Sweeden and Pakistan discuss Defence

[RescueRanger]

well the conversation cld be like this:

coas; lets discuss defence equipment
sweden; yes by all means as long as it is not of 'offensive category'
coas; gripen
sweden; offensive
coas;rbs-70
sweden;offensive
coas; bmse
sweden; offensive
coas; anything not offensive
sweden; erieye
coas; thx we have that
sweden; want more
coas; no thx and thx for visiting
sweden; my pleasure

Beautifully put sir.

 

[Arsalan]

Originally Posted by fatman17
well the conversation cld be like this:

coas; lets discuss defence equipment
sweden; yes by all means as long as it is not of 'offensive category'
coas; gripen
sweden; offensive
coas;rbs-70
sweden;offensive
coas; bmse
sweden; offensive
coas; anything not offensive
sweden; erieye
coas; thx we have that
sweden; want more
coas; no thx and thx for visiting
sweden; my pleasure

now that is realy nice sir je...

my initial thoughts were that there might be something regarding the JFT avionics updataion but when i look at Mr. President, i doubt he would be going to anyone oteht the Uncle Sarkozi...

regards!

regards!

 

[Arsalan]

Source for PAF using the RBS-23 BAMSE ??

Even the Swedes themselves got the system in 2002, when did PAF got them ??

it has been evaluated by PAF back in 2008

4 countries has asked Saab Bofors Dynamics for bids on supplying the RBS 23 BAMSE.

I wonder who the other 3 countries might be.

The article says Pakistan has done 'some kind of evaluation' of the system and decided it suits them the best but the export control agency might not approve a deal due to the unrest in Pakistan.

Saab has a goal of selling the system to 10 countries.

even if we search for PAF air defence stsem it shows RBS-23 i the list.

however your concern have got me and i will check this one personally with a few inside people i know...

will revert back to this one soon.

regards!

 

[Arsalan]

pakistan have got Erieye from sweden already,

the Surface to Air missile RBM-23 is also in service with PAF, it is a missile in same category of Cortale Missile.

we also operate RBS-70 MANPAD system,

pakistan is looking for some westren avionics for next block JF-17 and the swedish Gripen may come in as an option.

this is all what i know and there may be many more things..

regards!

well i forgot to mention the pld air defence work horse. the Swedish Giraffe radar

regards!

 

[Arsalan]

Pakistan operates artillery locating radar as well from Sweden:

ARTHUR is a new artillery locating radar developed by Sweden. It has been sold to Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Pakistan, Singapore and now to Greece (which will pay $44 million for several systems to be delivered in 2004).

ARTHUR has shown great reliability in detecting rockets, artillery shells, and mortar shells, and in calculating the position of the firing unit. It can, through data links, provide these coordinates directly to counter-battery artillery units. In one test in Hungary ARTHUR detected all 500 projectiles fired within its coverage fan. ARTHUR has also been used to observe outgoing friendly shells and calculate their points of impact.

regards!

 

[Zarbe Momin]

Giraffe radar is producing pakistan in Kamra, that's mean if we buy some other systems, sensors, missel and launchers then we can integrate them with our own made Giraffe radars.

 

[syntax_error]

Pakistan cannot buy Gripen cos if it did if would mean buying a aircraft of the same class (role) as JF-17 and would batter the confidence of all perspective export customers of JF-17 ..
coz how would they believe the supiriority of Gripen if the country producing it is buying from another country a similar aircraft with higher costs........

It would the end of JF-17 export possibilities ....
so Griphen for Pakistan is a big NO -NO

 

[fatman17]

Pakistan operates artillery locating radar as well from Sweden:



regards!

LAND FORCES UPDATE.
ARTHUR STANDS READY FOR PRODUCTION ORDER

JANE'S DEFENCE WEEKLY



DATE: 11-Sep-1996

EDITION: 1996

VOLUME/ISSUE: 026/011


BY LINE:
Christopher F Foss


INTRODUCTION:
The first orders are expected this year for a Scandinavian mobile
artillery locating radar system. Christopher F Foss reports



TEXT:
The first order is expected this year for the Artillery Hunting
Radar (Arthur) designed to meet Norwegian and Swedish army needs for a highly mobile system capable of locating enemy artillery and
mortars.

Details of the quantities of Arthur systems required have not been
released but it is expected to be considerably more than 20 systems.
If the order is placed this year the first units could be delivered
in 1997/1998.

Arthur was developed by Ericsson Microwave Systems of Sweden and its subsidiary Ericsson Radar of Norway.

At present, neither army has a mobile radar system that is capable
of detecting enemy positions with the speed and accuracy required so
they can be rapidly neutralised by counter battery fire.

Trials with the prototype Arthur system mounted on a Hagglunds
Vehicle Bv 208 all-terrain vehicle were completed in Norway last
year and involved the tracking of 155 mm artillery projectiles fired
from two batteries of six Ml09A3 self-propelled artillery systems
and 81 mm mortar bombs fired from four mortars.

These results showed that the firing point of the 155 mm projectiles
could be located to within 32 m while 81 mm mortar bombs could be
located within 26 m. Typically, two or three Arthur systems would be
deployed at brigade or division level. Of the total of 56 projectiles fired from the 16 weapons, Arthur detected and tracked 39 projectiles and located all 16 weapons.

The actual tracking range depends on a number of factors, including
terrain, but the instrumented range is 20, 30 or 40 km and Arthur
can track well over 100 targets a minute.

The system can perform two main functions: weapon location and fire
control. Arthur searches the horizon for targets and when a
projectile is detected it is tracked and its trajectory calculated.

It also tracks the impact area and determines the threat battery
size and geometry.

Using the positions of firing batteries and impact areas, Arthur
selects the most vital targets and then issues an immediate call for
counter battery fire. The system is also capable of tracking
artillery rockets.

To reduce procurement and operating costs, proven components are
used in the design of Arthur. The frequency generator, transmitter,
receiver and basic signal processing hardware are common to the
Ericsson Giraffe air defence radar of which more than 450 have been
sold, mostly for export.

Arthur has five key subsystems and mounted in the front unit of the
Bv 208 are the communications system and the power supply.
The communications system is designed for two-way data and voice
communication using radio as well as tactical and public networks,
where appropriate. It is powered by the vehicle engine and there is
a panel for connection to an external source.

Mounted in the rear unit are the radar, navigation system and the
command and control system.

The fully coherent C-band pulse Doppler radar with passive phased
array antenna is mounted on the roof of the rear unit and when
travelling is lowered into the horizontal position. To render the
radar operational the antenna is raised into the vertical position
where it has a search sector of 90ø (16 sub-sectors). It is designed
to detect very small targets in the presence of clutter, birds and
electronic countermeasures (ECM).

Arthur is claimed to be highly resistant to ECM and has low
radiation sidelobe levels. The scanning beam is above ground level
which is, according to Ericsson, below anti-radiation missile
altitude.

The reference unit of the inertial navigation system is mounted
directly on to the radar antenna and provides co-ordinates on
deployment and during target tracking. A global positioning system
is fitted.

The data processing unit for the command and control system, based
on commercial off-the-shelf products, consists of two high
resolution colour-graphic displays for the radar operator and
tactical officer.

When in position, four stabilisers are lowered manually, one at each
corner of the rear units. Arthur can be brought into action in under
five minutes.

Typically, Arthur would be deployed about 6 to 7 km behind the
forward line of troops and normally requires two operators.

In low-intensity operations the system can be used by one operator.
Data processing is performed by a general computer programmed in the Ada language. Arthur has a training simulator and test equipment
built in as standard.

The version of Arthur selected by Norway and Sweden will be mounted on the Swedish Hagglunds Vehicle Bv 208 all-terrain vehicle which is already in service in both countries in large numbers in the
standard Bv 206 version.

However, it can be mounted on a wide range of other chassis, both
tracked and wheeled; for example, a container carried on the rear of
a 3.5 tonne 4 x 4 cross-country truck. Arthur can also be repackaged
into an armoured fighting vehicle such as a 6 x 6 armoured personnel
carrier.

Although developed to meet the operational requirements of Norway
and Sweden, overseas marketing of this system has started.
The demonstration in Norway was attended by representatives from
Austria, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,
Portugal, Pakistan and the UK.

With the increased emphasis on rapid deployment forces, the
manufacturers believe there is a significant export market for
Arthur, especially as it can be transported inside a C-130 Hercules
transport aircraft.

 

[Ahassan]

First of all PAF never evaluated RBS-23 it was the army who evaluated.....PAF is looking forward to upgrade its cortale missiles to NG standards from France.
The cooperation btw sweden and pakistan in military simply means the collaboration btw two forces in terms of training and some of the weaponery!
Pakistan Army wants to upgrade its Giraffe radars to GIRAFFE AMB standards!
which is used by pak army and not the AF! and its the Pak army who wants RBS-23 and not the AF!
and for the PAF they need new and improved radars that is being used by the gripen NG for Jf-17 Block II.

 

[gowthamraj]

My guess is we will get french Spectra avioni suite (used in rafael).

Iaf wants that suite for mirage upgrade but it costs 50 million per piece

So we went earlier version with 30 million

 

[uglyindian]

Gripen NG has AESA radar, PAF would love to Gripen because chinese are yet to develop AESA for fighter

 

[Super Falcon]

well we need apc from swdeen specially in my opinion and some missile boats and might be gotland submarine our navy is considering after U 214 failure

 

[fatman17]

well we need apc from swdeen specially in my opinion and some missile boats and might be gotland submarine our navy is considering after U 214 failure

we have plently of APC's based on the M113 chassis.

 

[khurasaan1]

Gripen NG has AESA radar, PAF would love to Gripen because chinese are yet to develop AESA for fighter

I guess PAF will develop its own AESA by then

 

[Arsalan]

well we need apc from swdeen specially in my opinion and some missile boats and might be gotland submarine our navy is considering after U 214 failure

no, i disagree with this sir!

HIT is doing good enough in APCs and if we want to improve the force, collaboration with Turkey/China will be a good cost effective option. we must not import anymore PAC/Tanks rather look to import some technology features and build the main machines at home.

regards!