Suprising Pakistan. Are Things Really Changing?

[Rahil khan]

lol cleanest, it may be fairer then elections previously held and the reasons are simple that it went through politically appointed ECB where the budha was CECP and rest of the actual members were all politically appointed and all the fake degree holders who were caught were all later released

EU report is just being superficial and it observed that the process took place and thats all

it was the worst rigged election in pakistan histry in terms of voting



again hyped up jaahil mentality of a PTI follower

MQM is just a part of a legal procedure and that doesnt mean MQM will be demolished

and rest of your post just represent your dream wishes nothing in gonna happen to MQM

infact if MQM comes clean it will show that MQM is clean from corruption and will also prove innocence of MQM of all murder charges it was framed against

PTI has lost battle in its home turf very badly(punjab) and since one month PTI has done nothing in KPK

I desperately hope the city of lights may restore his former glory and peace. Whichever party restores it, whether MQM or any other, shall be my hero.

 

[darkinsky]

I desperately hope the city of lights may restore his former glory and peace. Whichever party restores it, whether MQM or any other, shall be my hero.

i desparatly want the entire pakistan to progress, karachi represents the situation entire pakistan is facing today its all interlinked

 

[Sedqal]

lol, if there are only two political party then i fail to understand why PPP is limited to sindh and the clean sweepers are limited to punjab

and its only one month and the CM of balochistan failed when he didnt do anything against the terrorists who bombed ziarat residency and who killed innocent people in quetta and girls included

technically he should have resigned already because he failed, but neither the federal is bothered because as i told you that balochistan has no representation and nor the provincial government is interested

in foreign country people resign immediately

- PPP has historically won good number of seats from Punjab (specifically Southern side). PMLN has won 2/3rd majority and has established vote bank in all provinces of Pakistan. Same is the case with other democracies in the world, all political parties have some provinces/ states where they have established more loyal votebank.

- I don't agree that Baluch CM has failed but in any case he is an elected CM and public will hold him responsible. If Baluch and Pashtoon in Baluchistan find him a failure he won't be elected again. His future rests with people he has sworn to serve.

- You want Federation to sack an 'elected' Govt when hardly 3 months have gone by? That will enrage Baluch and create a bigger mess.

- In those foreign countries democracies have now been established for decades - Pakistan is just starting. Plus some how Pakistanis think that 'those countries' have very honest and upright politicians whih is not true. Ask the citizens of 'those countries' how they feel about their elected representatives.

 

[darkinsky]

- PPP has historically won good number of seats from Punjab (specifically Southern side). PMLN has won 2/3rd majority and has established vote bank in all provinces of Pakistan. Same is the case with other democracies in the world, all political parties have some provinces/ states where they have established more loyal votebank.

- I don't agree that Baluch CM has failed but in any case he is an elected CM and public will hold him responsible. If Baluch and Pashtoon in Baluchistan find him a failure he won't be elected again. His future rests with people he has sworn to serve.

- You want Federation to sack an 'elected' Govt when hardly 3 months have gone by? That will enrage Baluch and create a bigger mess.

- In those foreign countries democracies have now been established for decades - Pakistan is just starting. Plus some how Pakistanis think that 'those countries' have very honest and upright politicians whih is not true. Ask the citizens of 'those countries' how they feel about their elected representatives.

sorry but your arguments arnt logical at all, for being the majority, PMLN or PPP atleast needed to win 3/4 provinces, and when i talk to you about the provincial representation of the people, its negligible because when PPP wins, its only sindh in their control and nothing else

same stands for PMLN

PMLN only got 2-3 provincil seats and one national seat from sindh (among 65) which is a disgrace

same stands for PPP who didnt get too much seats in punjab last time

also i said something about local governments

balochistan has 15-16 parties getting representation

so its all a joke

there is some severe stuff lacking in pakistani political system

the gao will keep increasing like south punjab party getting elected from south punjab, hazara party, pashtun party etc

or punjab will keep electing PMLN as a national party even though in other parts of the party the performance will be dismal because PMLN will only play punjab part and fail big as a federal party

 

[darkinsky]

and honestly you cant do too much in punjab alone when 2/3 of pakistan(by area) is failing

pakistan is one country and punjab interest is linked with other provinces

so as long as the other 2/3rd of pakistan is in trouble punjab cant perform alone like developing at 7% rate

it has been proved lat time when shahbaz has punjab authority and failed to bring any investment into punjab

so the only option for PMLN as federal party will be to ensure the entire pakistan gets going forward and not only punjab if it wants to win the next election after five years

 

[Sedqal]

sorry but your arguments arnt logical at all, for being the majority, PMLN or PPP atleast needed to win 3/4 provinces, and when i talk to you about the provincial representation of the people, its negligible because when PPP wins, its only sindh in their control and nothing else

same stands for PMLN

PMLN only got 2-3 provincil seats and one national seat from sindh (among 65) which is a disgrace

same stands for PPP who didnt get too much seats in punjab last time

also i said something about local governments

balochistan has 15-16 parties getting representation

so its all a joke

there is some severe stuff lacking in pakistani political system

the gao will keep increasing like south punjab party getting elected from south punjab, hazara party, pashtun party etc

or punjab will keep electing PMLN as a national party even though in other parts of the party the performance will be dismal because PMLN will only play punjab part and fail big as a federal party

I told you PPP wins regularly from Punjab you should check the numbers historically. PMLN has a vote bank in all provinces look at it historically. They have established party offices and official hierarchy in all provinces.

The Gap will decrease with such parties. PPP, ANP and MQM backed a 'Saraikistan' tehreek in South Punjab which painted central Punjab as a cruel overlord still PMLN won majority in Southern Punjab. ANP played the Pashtoon Nationalist card but PTI won from there with its slogan for Pakistan. In Sindh people have always preferred PPP over Sindhi nationalist parties. So how can you claim its increasing the gap?

If it only took Punjab then there would be no govt other then PMLN but historically PPPP has been won more. PTI also received a lot of votes from Punjab. If PMLN fails at federal level people will elect some other party, that is how democracy is supposed to work. I agree with the last part, democracy in Pakistan is still evolving and needs more time.

and honestly you cant do too much in punjab alone when 2/3 of pakistan(by area) is failing

pakistan is one country and punjab interest is linked with other provinces

so as long as the other 2/3rd of pakistan is in trouble punjab cant perform alone like developing at 7% rate

it has been proved lat time when shahbaz has punjab authority and failed to bring any investment into punjab

so the only option for PMLN as federal party will be to ensure the entire pakistan gets going forward and not only punjab

Thats why I said that Punjab finally won't be the punching bag for perceived injustices. Provincial autonomy will transfer all provincial matters to provincial assembly. Security, health, education, commerce all these things are already been transferred. Rest will follow soon.

 

[darkinsky]

I told you PPP wins regularly from Punjab you should check the numbers historically. PMLN has a vote bank in all provinces look at it historically. They have established party offices and official hierarchy in all provinces.

The Gap will decrease with such parties. PPP, ANP and MQM backed a 'Saraikistan' tehreek in South Punjab which painted central Punjab as a cruel overlord still PMLN won majority in Southern Punjab. ANP played the Pashtoon Nationalist card but PTI won from there with its slogan for Pakistan. In Sindh people have always preferred PPP over Sindhi nationalist parties. So how can you claim its increasing the gap?

If it only took Punjab then there would be no govt other then PMLN but historically PPPP has been won more. PTI also received a lot of votes from Punjab. If PMLN fails at federal level people will elect some other party, that is how democracy is supposed to work. I agree with the last part, democracy in Pakistan is still evolving and needs more time.



Thats why I said that Punjab finally won't be the punching bag for perceived injustices. Provincial autonomy will transfer all provincial matters to provincial assembly. Security, health, education, commerce all these things are already been transferred. Rest will follow soon.

PPP is a sindhi nationalist party too, the sindhi nationalists you are talking are itself the faction of muslim league, called muslim league functional, and PPP always plays the sindh card like PMLN plays the punjab card

ANP in its history was never the dominant party of the province and they got there because jamaat islami boycotted the elections

late jamaat islami was replaced with PTI

and PTI also states that they are a national party and they have also got representation in all the provinces

so you are just being illogical

about sareikistan, as i said that the south punjabis are trying a new party this time, if they fail like they failed before they may be forced to support their own party

same goes to hazaras

the pashtuns of north balochistan already support their nationalist party(PKMAP) and it has nothing got to do with balochs,(before PPP had majority in balochistan) balochs have elected BNP and national party so if you are clever you will get my point

 

[SBD-3]

PPP is a sindhi nationalist party too, the sindhi nationalists you are talking are itself the faction of muslim league, called muslim league functional, and PPP always plays the sindh card like PMLN plays the punjab card

Yeah Yeah PPP,PTI and PML-N all are 18-seat nationalist parties Profile of all of MQM's leadership (except from recent Nabil Gabool) and the restricted geography of their mandate is a testimant that it is a nationalist party not different from ANP.

 

[darkinsky]

Yeah Yeah PPP,PTI and PML-N all are 18-seat nationalist parties Profile of all of MQM's leadership (except from recent Nabil Gabool) and the restricted geography of their mandate is a testimant that it is a nationalist party not different from ANP.

lol for starters you know nothing about MQM

for starters educate yourself with this video

MQM is not an ethnic party, it gets votes from karachi which is a mini pakistan and where not only urdu speakers but punjabis also live, balochs live too and kashmiris seraikis, pashtuns etc

in rabita committee there are four members each from the four province who represent their respective province from balochistan, sindh, KPK and punjab

punjab's rabita committee member is this

Aftikhar Akbar Randhawa

he is an active member of rabita committee where even farooq sattar is not

this guy is rabita committee member from Balochistan and he is given ticket from Karachi which is a base of MQM

there are lots of pathans in MQM in karachi, see this

MQM gilgit Baltistan

gilgit Baltistani kid dancing near 90

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_x7Dew7F_0

 

[darkinsky]

Yeah Yeah PPP,PTI and PML-N all are 18-seat nationalist parties Profile of all of MQM's leadership (except from recent Nabil Gabool) and the restricted geography of their mandate is a testimant that it is a nationalist party not different from ANP.

this guy tahir mashadi appearing in TV shows is an army retired officer pure punjab by blood and used to live in punjab but doesnt get elected from punjab but he gets to be the MNA from Karachi because MQM wants participation from all ethnics

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tahir_Hussain_Mashhadi

 

[interhacker]

but i didnt want to bring MQM here because the guy himself brought PTI and i answered him accordingly

Sir, I am terribly sorry if I caused you any inconvenience. Just to clarify a few things. When I wrote that post mentioning PTI, I only meant it to be a neutral question as to the influence created by the party on the country. I was thoroughly satisfied by your well-reasoned reply and I left the matter there. I don't know how this MQM vs PTI vs etc. flame-war came about but I sincerely apologize if it was due to any post of mine.

 

[darkinsky]

Sir, I am terribly sorry if I caused you any inconvenience. Just to clarify a few things. When I wrote that post mentioning PTI, I only meant it to be a neutral question as to the influence created by the party on the country. I was thoroughly satisfied by your well-reasoned reply and I left the matter there. I don't know how this MQM vs PTI vs etc. flame-war came about but I sincerely apologize if it was due to any post of mine.

i dont blame you at all so there is no need to apologise

i think those guys @Jungibaaz @mafiya etc should apologise you for damaging your thread

 

[Jungibaaz]

Hallelujiah! A party war thread

This is democracy. Party war threads wont ever end.

 

[Bratva]

i dont blame you at all so there is no need to apologise

i think those guys @Jungibaaz @mafiya etc should apologise you for damaging your thread

AAP hi apni aa'dapu par zara gour karain naa

HUM agar arz karain gai to shikayat ho gi

 

[Jungibaaz]

having feudals in the party and making alliance with feudals is a completely different thing my dear

you forget that its the feudals you vote into the parliament and give them majority

now coming the MQM, itself MQM is not a feudal party and it appreciates the hardwork of its workers unlike other parties, and it also chooses candidates from its common worker unlike PTI who took 50,000 rupees as a party fund before alloting the NA and PA tickets?

MQM provides tickets for free and not only that, it also funds the election campaign of its workers, feudal oriented parties have no system of appreciating the hard work of its workers and only blesses feudals who can buy tickets worth millions of rupees

now please tell me if you ask them 50,000 for giving tickets how much will they loot before they actually start serving for the public?

this is not the politics on merits also, its a politics about money and PTI has brought no change in the traditional politics of pakistan, its the same faces with the same old rusted system

but i didnt want to bring MQM here because the guy himself brought PTI and i answered him accordingly

do you deny all these charges that despite claiming naya pakistan why PTI fails to criticise feudal system and why anti feudal is not PTI's number one agenda?

its because of feudalism that MQM faced persecution by the state for 15 years

MQM was in alliance with not feudals but musharraf before and it embraced musharraf's system which was about real democracy

MQM did alliance with PPP because it wanted o be in the democratic system as the last one was termed as dictatorship even though it was a better democracy as a whole

since MQM completed its duty to work for democracy or whatever media labelled it but since then MQM has started doing opposition politics and you saw MQM sitting in opposition benches

There is a difference, I agree. But that too, the effects are the same. Empowerment of feudals.

On to the MQM. Yes, they aren't a feudal party, that is their strong point. However, they are a political mafia of another sort. MQM has some very good educated people in it. But some aspects of MQM ruin it for the rest of you guys. You were always famous in Pakistan and now you are famous here in the UK, all for the wrong reasons.

Anyway, sticking with the feudal thing, actions speak louder than words. Now Altaf bhai, he speaks very loud. Very very loud, so loud that you in Pakistan can hear him while he is here in London. But his actions betray his words.

On to PTI, it is anti-feudal, though admittedly, it hasn't had any clear party statement against feudalism that I can remember. However, Imran Khan has spoken on the matter and said he is against it. But also PTI policy includes changes to land ownership laws and also PTI's stance against political mafias and family politics is clear.

As for MQM and PPP. Hahaha. Yeah, you did it for democracy. When you ask PPP what they've done in the last five years, first and last words are democracy. Involving yourself in the democratic process to support democracy is one thing. To join a party and form an alliance, an alliance that led Pakistan in to new lows. Is that strengthening democracy? I believe it severely weakened democracy. Remember, democracy is only as strong as THE PEOPLE make it to be. Tell me, the people, did they support democracy more back in 2008 or now in 2013?

This so called pro democratic alliance has turned public opinion against these democratic parties and democracy.
In fact, the only reason voter turnout wasn't as low as before is because of PTI and sad state of Pakistan.