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Super Su-30 MKI as MRCA

What do you think?

  • Super MKI

    Votes: 24 51.1%
  • Rafale

    Votes: 15 31.9%
  • Other may be EFT or F-35

    Votes: 8 17.0%

  • Total voters
    47

Kinetic

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Super Su-30 MKI (Once in discussion) as a MRCA with a powerful AESA radar, whole new range of Air to Ground missiles, PGMs along with RAM coatings. What is your view on this?

Advantages:
1) Can be produced in India without any delay.
2) Already known aircraft.
3) 2/3 cost of Rafale and much less life cycle cost.

But we need to have new ejection seat and Indian AAM.


Cash tapped Russia will be very happy to take away MRCA from France after Mistral scandal.
 
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I don't want France or Russia to take us for a ride. Rafale F3 configuration was offered in original tender and now Dassault must honor its price and technical bid and not offer something else in name of jacking up prices. Any post tender modification will amount to injustice with EFT.
I therefore think that EFT must be given a chance to match Dassault's price bid and if found acceptable, PO must be placed on them.
Anything else would mean another scandal in the making even though government has best of intentions.

Cash tapped Russia will be very happy to take away MRCA from France after Mistral scandal.
Yes sir they would indeed be very happy, more so considering this is a behemoth of a deal but in case India has to go for additional MKIs they must insist equal technology transfer (AESA radar et al) as was envisaged in MMRCA competition. 15-20 billion USD isn't a small amount of money after all.
 
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Super Su-30 MKI (Once in discussion) as a MRCA with a powerful AESA radar, whole new range of Air to Ground missiles, PGMs along with RAM coatings. What is your view on this?

Advantages:
1) Can be produced in India without any delay.
2) Already known aircraft.
3) 2/3 cost of Rafale and much less life cycle cost.

But we need to have new ejection seat and Indian AAM.


Cash tapped Russia will be very happy to take away MRCA from France after Mistral scandal.
Disadvantage - 1)Brings in no western technology, we already )make MKI in home.
2) Inferior ground attack capability
3) Super Mki is on paper right now, development and testing may take little longer. AESA radar, more powerful engine etc are not tested yet.
4) Russians monopoly in fighter jets, India will be totally dependent on Russians for next 50 years.
 
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why not SU-35 (MKI) ?

Yeah, that will be a good choice as well.

Disadvantage - 1)Brings in no western technology, we already )make MKI in home.
2) Inferior ground attack capability
3) Super Mki is on paper right now, development and testing may take little longer. AESA radar, more powerful engine etc are not tested yet.
4) Russians monopoly in fighter jets, India will be totally dependent on Russians for next 50 years.

1) Whats is called western tech'? We made MKI thats one of the advantages.
2) No, It will have Brahmos, and loads of ASM and glide bombs.
3) It will not take much time like building a Rafale in India. Forgot Scorpene? We signed the deal in 2006 and still we didn't get one.
4) No, we will go for Indian AMCA and Tejas mk II as well.
 
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The irony is that long term the MKI will cause far greater budgetary issues.....


Its in service for last 13 years and till it didn't but French will for sure. Scorpene is an example.... In 2010 itself the price has now gone up to $5 billion ($834 million for each submarine)!!!!! In 2015 $ how kmuch it is costing???? !!!!

They took whopping $2.4 billion just for upgrading the Mirages with new missiles!!!!!
 
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@Kinetic

We need to ask for fighters on need and some technical bases.

like (1) Aircraft Capability: which includes, the Fuselage, Engine, thrust vector nozzle, Weight, Flying manuverability etc. Which all depends on the Basic Plane Design, Carbon fiber nano tubes skelton like design that help in the protecting the plane, active radar denial and much more.
(2) Electronic Capacity: This is what now cost more, The Mig-35 with the 3D or 4D nozzle have best maneuverability amongst all plane, perhaps more than Raptor, but have not Those extraordinary electronic suits, like the French Spectra. We need Extraordinary 5th Gen like techs electronics as used in the our planes.

(3) RADAR and IRST/DAS: To deal with the Future Warfare we need AESA Radar and Longest Range IRST, I read somewhere india is building 130km (as I recollect memory) IRST System we need to ask whether we need DAS (Direct Aperture System) like systems for the Fighters. The FGFA have all side Radar, We need some modules with S band or weather radar frequency against which the Stealth is not working, and DAS like Passive system, so without using Radar we can find the enemy object, moreover jamming proof, if AESA is their its jamming proof. the 3d radar capacity of the FGFA is better, but passive system DAS is morepowerful then radar, as that is passive detection. US is searching for the skin which is Infrared proof for its next gen fighter.
(4) material that is able to withstand against the laser Temparature.
(5) Air To Air Barak-1 like missile, to save Fighters from the enemy missile.
(6) EYE: The System of all Frequecy, Radar, Radiowaves, and Electronic Spectrum, with UAV passive detection. The Eye is the of motto "Jis Desh ki Nigehban he ankhen, us desh ko koi chu nahi sakta"
(7) Better weapons that can deal with enemy, weapons system. in short enemy fighters, including stealth and supersonic fighters.

If the purpose to have better electronics then such must be fulfilled by the Rafale and we need to ask our self why we need TOT(transfer of Technology) If purpose is to copy the plane, then it can be done in India too like china copy su-27, if we do not get any great things as seems from rafale, question is raised for what we are paying them more for? Start some six generation tech right now and choose plane that can deal with it in future, as US going with 6th gen and some country like Japan, RUSSIA, and France are jumping on sixth gen right now. We need the Fighters that will deal not only with the Fighters but also with the UAV, as dark sword like UAV will be used with the future Chinese fighters, The all direction UAV will protect such fighters, and more send weapons too.

We need to use money with right WISDOM, as the time is to see the future too, and the planes that will able to deal with the future fighters too.
 
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Its in service for last 13 years and till it didn't but French will for sure.
It's funny that the IAF (the ones who have all the information on the Rafale and MKI) have flatly ruled out the MKI as a replacement for the Rafale/MMRCA in the past, this should give all make us armchair generals take a moment's pause. What is it that they know that we possibly don't? 13 years and the IAF knows exactly how much it costs to fly the MKI per hour, how much time it spends on the ground (AOG), how easy it is to keep airworthy and such.

It is only after the politicians (DM) have got involved that the MKI is back on the table as an alternative to the Rafale, this, I suspect, is purely a bargaining tool to help focus the minds of Dassualt and clinch this deal finally.

Scorpene is an example.... In 2010 itself the price has now gone up to $5 billion ($834 million for each submarine)!!!!

Shell we just absolve MDL of their (considerable) role in the delays and price escalation. This demonisation of the French is all too convenient and if it were the case France wouldn't be exporting over $2 billion of defence products a year.
 
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Super Su-30 MKI (Once in discussion) as a MRCA with a powerful AESA radar, whole new range of Air to Ground missiles, PGMs along with RAM coatings. What is your view on this?

Advantages:
1) Can be produced in India without any delay.
2) Already known aircraft.
3) 2/3 cost of Rafale and much less life cycle cost.

But we need to have new ejection seat and Indian AAM.

Cash tapped Russia will be very happy to take away MRCA from France after Mistral scandal.
How about the biggest disadvantage of the SU series? And that is, the life cycle costs. Their maintenance is astronomical and procuring spare parts from Russia a nightmare!

Now, do you still prefer the Super SUs??
 
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What is it that they know that we possibly don't?
Yes, we also know that as well ..... its huge $$$$$ in the pockets of many.
Shell we just absolve MDL of their (considerable) role in the delays and price escalation. This demonisation of the French is all too convenient and if it were the case France wouldn't be exporting over $2 billion of defence products a year.

Fench export is small compared to others and Thats why Rafale has been ditched by every buyer till now... It has contested in more than a dozen contracts but failed to win one.
 
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It will take a MIRACLE to save the Rafale deal now

It is " come back to Russia " moment ALL over again
 
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