Sukmawati Sukarnoputri, daughter of former Indonesia president, converts to Hinduism from Islam

[Indos]

Allah sent 124000 nabis to all corners of the world and if all of them say God in their language then imagine how many names should he have ?

It doesnt matter, why you think it becomes problem ? We, human, will communicate with God with our own language, that is the language of our heart. If I say God, please help me,,,,,then what is wrong if Indonesian said, Tuhan tolonglah aku.....

Look like you keep trying to find any flaws in Islam but never try to acknowledge the truth of Islam when It has been sent to you ?

 

[not_two]

Why I said Allah is not physical but more like our spirit, is because this verse. Something physical usually can be seen, He is also every where, and this can only happen if His essence similar like our spirit/soul

View attachment 788659

Quran

Surah Al Anam (The Cattles) Ayat 103


Vision comprehends Him not, and He comprehends (all) vision; and He is the Knower of subtleties, the Aware.

Hindu Upanishad kena says similarly about God.. Distinct from known and also beyond unknown..
. There the eye does not go, nor speech, nor mind. We do not know That; we do not understand how It can be taught. It is distinct from the known and also It is beyond the unknown. Thus we have heard from the ancient (teachers) who told us about It.

 

[not_two]

It doesnt matter, why you think it becomes problem ? We, human, will communicate with God with our own language, that is the language of our heart. If I say God, please help me,,,,,then what is wrong if Indonesian said, Tuhan tolonglah aku.....

Look like you keep trying to find any flaws in Islam but never try to acknowledge the truth of Islam when It has been sent to you ?

My logic comes from concept of shirk in today's understanding among Muslim scholars ..If you say you worship Tuhan then is it acceptable today under Islam ?
As far as flaws are concerned there are many in all religions especially when they are used and abused for power and politics..

 

[Indos]

Hindu Upanishad kena says similarly about God.. Distinct from known and also beyond unknown..
. There the eye does not go, nor speech, nor mind. We do not know That; we do not understand how It can be taught. It is distinct from the known and also It is beyond the unknown. Thus we have heard from the ancient (teachers) who told us about It.

The real essence of God is not known, there is right, similar like until now we cannot see the spirit, but we can see that spirit is present somehow when we look any people who are dying will open their mouth, as if it is the spirit that comes out from the mouth.

Despite so, God must tell to His creation about Him that still can be understood by human. Actually many hints in Quran that will reveal more about Him but Islam is taught more about His commands and others, something beyond that will be understood base on individual level of understanding and his/her own spiritual experience.

If God let His creation dont understand Him, so it will be unlogic, how can we know how to worship God if He doesnt tell us ?

I believe all big religions comes from the same source and will speak the same things as well, I also believe Hindu in the beginning is the right religion as well, but as we see Hindu Today, it makes the believers confused as there are many kind Hindu, each followers worship different God.

We can see from how the earth is protected from meteorit and how Earth is so livable, it means God is protecting us, God cares on us, so if you understand philosophy thinking, God will care also to human and give human direction to their life. If the direction become unclear due to time and people mistake after hundreds of years, He must send another messenger to clear things up, as we know it is His nature to protect human as He is kind

 

[not_two]

The real essence of God is not known, there is right, similar like until now we cannot see the spirit, but we can see that spirit is present somehow when we look any people who are dying will open their mouth, as if it is the spirit that comes out from the mouth.

Despite so, God must tell to His creation about Him that still can be understood by human. Actually many hints in Quran that will reveal more about Him but Islam is taught more about His commands and others, something beyond that will be understood base on individual level of understanding and his/her own spiritual experience.

If God let His creation dont understand Him, so it will be unlogic, how can we know how to worship God if He doesnt tell us ?

I believe all big religions comes from the same source and will speak the same things as well, I also believe Hindu in the beginning is the right religion as well, but as we see Hindu Today, it makes the believers confused as there are many kind Hindu, each followers worship different God.

We can see from how the earth is protected from meteorit and how Earth is so livable, it means God is protecting us, God cares on us, so if you understand philosophy thinking, God will care also to human and give human direction to their life. If the direction become unclear due to time and people mistake after hundreds of years, He must send another messenger to clear things up, as we know it is His nature to protect human as He is kind

If God is not physical entity then physical distance is not a barrier between him and us ..If he is omnipresent then time can't be a barrier between him and us ..These two statements are enough to conclude logically that there is nothing apart from God .. Universe seems to be a dream of God .

 

[Indos]

My logic comes from concept of shirk in today's understanding among Muslim scholars ..If you say you worship Tuhan then is it acceptable today under Islam ?
As far as flaws are concerned there are many in all religions especially when they are used and abused for power and politics..

Of course it is acceptable, you will see our Pancasila said Tuhan Yang Maha Esa, or One and The Only God, not using "Allah."

No Muslim scholars will say it is Sirik if English man ask Allah with the words God instead of Allah. It is basically the same, but it is better to use Allah during Dua.

Well people comes with their level right, there are layers between human, we can see sincere Muslim and not sincere Muslim, you will see Muslim who understand Islam so deep and Muslim who understand Islam in the surface only.

Muslim basically live to worship God, so every thing we will do is to get Ridho from God. This is stated in Quran. This is maybe something difficult to understand by Atheist. I will try to explain it. Actually many people live their lives to seek people acceptance, this is why so many people when they can have enough salary, they will buy car, despite car is not necessary because we can still use public transportation, unless they have marriage and really needs car to bring their little kids to school.

Many man is actually working to get acceptance by their wifes, to make their wife stay with him and respect him. This is why Islam try to break this slavery mentality, we dont need to get acceptance from people, wife, and others, we just need to get acceptance by God because God is the true creator of us, who think about us before we are born, and who will help us sincerely. Many men are left by their wife after the men doesnt provide financial support to the family, but God will always be with us if we are really a good person.

Politics and power is important, through politics and power we can help people and protect Muslim. For true Muslim they become politician is to serve Allah.

Dont judge people as lying if they say they want to serve Allah when they ask for leadership position, we can see for their track record, good people can be seen through their track record

This Ridwan Kamil, West Java Governor, wants to be President and he said what he is doing in politics is for Ibadah ( worshipping God) since in Islam we have been informed by Allah that we are created to worship Him. There is nothing wrong in it.

If God is not physical entity then physical distance is not a barrier between him and us ..If he is omnipresent then time can't be a barrier between him and us ..These two statements are enough to conclude logically that there is nothing apart from God .. Universe seems to be a dream of God .

Yup, physical distance is not a barrier for Him

I dont understand with your statement saying universe to be a dream of God ?

 

[Rollno21]

The next thing is whether you believe God is One or more than One ? If God is more than one than He is not having Supreme power.

Hindu is not clear any more, real God will send another messenger to make it clear again, just like happening in the beginning of any true religion. So what you need to do is to find one that is clear and logic, Islam is very clear, logic, and not complicated, this is the only religion where the holly book is still genuine as the oldest Quran is still stored in Museum.


Illah is something that you worship, it can be Allah or another. Allah is God (Genuine one). This is why the name of prophet Muhammad father is Abdullah.

Your father is father to you.
He is husband to your mother.
He is son to your grand parents.
He is someone else or another name to people at work.

He is the same person but even one sees him him differently and call him differently. You cannot call anyone wrong ,can you ?. It's that simple ,you are complicating it by looking from only your point of view.

 

[not_two]

Of course it is acceptable, you will see our Pancasila said Tuhan Yang Maha Esa, or One and The Only God, not using "Allah."

No Muslim scholars will say it is Sirik if English man ask Allah with the words God instead of Allah. It is basically the same, but it is better to use Allah during Dua.

Well people comes with their level right, there are layers between human, we can see sincere Muslim and not sincere Muslim, you will see Muslim who understand Islam so deep and Muslim who understand Islam in the surface only.

Muslim basically live to worship God, so every thing we will do is to get Ridho from God. This is stated in Quran. This is maybe something difficult to understand by Atheist. I will try to explain it. Actually many people live their lives to seek people acceptance, this is why so many people when they can have enough salary, they will buy car, despite car is not necessary because we can still use public transportation, unless they have marriage and really needs car to bring their little kids to school.

Many man is actually working to get acceptance by their wifes, to make their wife stay with him and respect him. This is why Islam try to break this slavery mentality, we dont need to get acceptance from people, wife, and others, we just need to get acceptance by God because God is the true creator of us, who think about us before we are born, and who will help us sincerely. Many men are left by their wife after the men doesnt provide financial support to the family, but God will always be with us if we are really a good person.

Politics and power is important, through politics and power we can help people and protect Muslim. For true Muslim they become politician is to serve Allah.

Dont judge people as lying if they say they want to serve Allah when they ask for leadership position, we can see for their track record, good people can be seen through their track record

This Ridwan Kamil, West Java Governor, wants to be President and he said what he is doing in politics is for Ibadah ( worshipping God) since in Islam we have been informed by Allah that we are created to worship Him. There is nothing wrong in it.

Yup, physical distance is not a barrier for Him

I dont understand with your statement saying universe to be a dream of God ?

If you remove time and distance then how can you differentiate between creator and creation ? Unless creation is just a dream of creator ?

 

[Indos]

If you remove time and distance then how you can you differentiate between creator and creation ? Unless it's just a dream of creator ?

Time ? We cannot go back in times. I dont say about time, I only talk about God is not physical and this is why He cannot be seen, and He is near us, it means in essence He could be bigger than universe.

You seems try to talk like phylosoper, but the basis of phylosophy is logic, what I am saying is logic while I dont understand what you are saying. You have been educated with complex Gods in Hindu, this is why you assume the truth is complex and cannot be understood. Islam is a religion that can be understood easily, until now you keep denying, do you want me to bring that "Nebula" verse once more ?

Your father is father to you.
He is husband to your mother.
He is son to your grand parents.
He is someone else or another name to people at work.

He is the same person but even one sees him him differently and call him differently. You cannot call anyone wrong ,can you ?. It's that simple ,you are complicating it by looking from only your point of view.

You dont sounds logic with what you are saying. I admit that God can be called differently, but His teaching will be somewhat similar until the end of time, if He founds His teaching is mislead by human, He will likely try to correct it and bring another messenger. Now Hindu holly book is something in doubt since you cannot find the original one and Today Hindu worship many Gods, I mean many Hindu worship different Gods

 

[not_two]

Time ? We cannot go back in times. I dont say about time, I only talk about God is not physical and this is why He cannot be seen, and He is near us, it means in essence He could be bigger than universe.

You seems try to talk like phylosoper, but the basis of phylosophy is logic, what I am saying is logic while I dont understand what you are saying. You have been educated with complex Gods in Hindu, this is why you assume the truth is complex and cannot be understood. Islam is a religion that can be understood easily, until now you keep denying, do you want me to bring that "Nebula" verse once more ?


You dont sounds logic with what you are saying. I admit that God can be called differently, but His teaching will be somewhat similar until the end of time, if He founds His teaching is mislead by human, He will likely try to correct it and bring another messenger. Now Hindu holly book is something in doubt since you cannot find the original one and Today Hindu worship many Gods

So according to you time is not a physical entity ? Or time is a limitation to God ? Time and space appears in God or God appears in time and space , which is correct ? About originality of holy books we can discuss later I think you too know there is no original book in any religion of thousands year back ..
Enlighten me about nebula verse ..

 

[Indos]

So according to you time is not a physical entity ? Or time is a limitation to God ? Time and space appears in God or God appears in time and space , which is correct ? About originality of holy books we can discuss later I think you too know there is no original book in any religion of thousands year back ..
Enlighten me about nebula verse ..

LOL time again that you try to talk, you are too much watching Hollywood movie he he. We cannot bring back time. Thats it. God as I said (based on my interpretation on Quran) is like our spirit, spirit is there in Earth or sky when we fly using planes, but we cannot measure and see it physically

Of course Islam is original since the first Mushaf (Mushaf Ustmany) is in Museum, you can try to google it. If Hindu cannot trace their original book it means the teaching is in doubt, even the teachings are so different to so many sects, as you keep insisting to talk philosophically so I have stated above that impossible God will not try to correct His teaching to human when His teaching has been so broken as we can see in Hindu, what I mean is that there are already so many sects in Hindu and the scripts are also in doubt in term of its originality, even Ramayana story become your Holly book as well. God cares to human as we can see how we are protected in this earth and how livable Earth is. So God will likely send new messenger if His teaching has been mislead by human after hundreds or even thousands years old like Hindu. This is logic

Any way, do yo believe God is only One or many ?

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Quran verse is not that simple, many verses come true after more than 1000 years

This is just an example:

Quran, Ar-Rahman verse 37-38

And when the heaven is split open and becomes rose-colored like oil

So which of the favors of your Lord would you deny? -

The Cat's Eye Nebula

hubblesite.org

That verse talks about the destruction and it is match when a galaxy gets destroyed

Other nebulae form as the result of supernova explosions; the death throes of massive, short-lived stars. The materials thrown off from the supernova explosion are then ionized by the energy and the compact object that its core produces. One of the best examples of this is the Crab Nebula, in Taurus. The supernova event was recorded in the year 1054 and is labeled SN 1054. The compact object that was created after the explosion lies in the center of the Crab Nebula and its core is now a neutron star.

Nebula - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

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I dont need to keep answering your questions since I have answered many of your question since about 2 weeks ago. It seems that you keep questioning Islam while I have answered many of your questions, but you dont even try to be critical with your own religion, Hindu.

 

[Village life]

There is no religion called hinduism...hinduism as you know it is an amalgamation of different philosophies and beliefs(including animistic religions)....anyone can follow or not follow anything according to their inclinations.
Highly philosophical books like upanishads are considered holy in hinduism...at the same time cock and bull stories like puranas are also considered holy in hinduism...it is very difficult for a person who is following an organised religion like islam to understand the so called hinduism.
Having said that the religion that most people in India follow these days is religion propagated in puranas and smritis(religion that developed between 5th and 10th century AD)...including the verses that are chanted in most rituals.
Therefore one can say there is a bit of uniformity that has emerged as far as beliefs and customs are concerned in hinduism across india.

Ah it's making me further confused ,it means Hinduism doesn't even fit in the category of religion because it is collection of many ideas over the time, no offense to hindous please take it as general Inquiry,

 

[Sage]

Murtad ki aik he saza, Sar tan say juda ...

 

[not_two]

LOL time again that you try to talk, you are too much watching Hollywood movie he he. We cannot bring back time. Thats it. God as I said (based on my interpretation on Quran) is like our spirit, spirit is there in Earth or sky when we fly using planes, but we cannot measure and see it physically

Of course Islam is original since the first Mushaf (Mushaf Ustmany) is in Museum, you can try to google it. If Hindu cannot trace their original book it means the teaching is in doubt, even the teachings are so different to so many sects, as you keep insisting to talk philosophically so I have stated above that impossible God will not try to correct His teaching to human when His teaching has been so broken as we can see in Hindu, what I mean is that there are already so many sects in Hindu and the scripts are also in doubt in term of its originality, even Ramayana story become your Holly book as well. God cares to human as we can see how we are protected in this earth and how livable Earth is. So God will likely send new messenger if His teaching has been mislead by human after hundreds or even thousands years old like Hindu. This is logic

Any way, do yo believe God is only One or many ?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quran verse is not that simple, many verses come true after more than 1000 years

This is just an example:

Quran, Ar-Rahman verse 37-38

And when the heaven is split open and becomes rose-colored like oil

So which of the favors of your Lord would you deny? -

View attachment 788708

The Cat's Eye Nebula

hubblesite.org

That verse talks about the destruction and it is match when a galaxy gets destroyed

Other nebulae form as the result of supernova explosions; the death throes of massive, short-lived stars. The materials thrown off from the supernova explosion are then ionized by the energy and the compact object that its core produces. One of the best examples of this is the Crab Nebula, in Taurus. The supernova event was recorded in the year 1054 and is labeled SN 1054. The compact object that was created after the explosion lies in the center of the Crab Nebula and its core is now a neutron star.

Nebula - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

------------------------------------------------------------

I dont need to keep answering your questions since I have answered many of your question since about 2 weeks ago. It seems that you keep questioning Islam while I have answered many of your questions, but you dont even try to be critical with your own religion, Hindu.

So you mean to say God appears in time and space ..In other words God is not everywhere and everytime .That understanding makes God too small as he functions within the limitations of time and space .
If you think that 8th century first mushaf is original one than what was zayd writing ?
So according to nebula verse you mean to say when a galaxy is destroyed heaven is destroyed ? Where is your logical reasoning ? Do you know how many galaxies are there ?

Murtad ki aik he saza, Sar tan say juda ...

What is murtad ?

 

[Village life]

The air within a bubble bursts it mixes with atmosphere ..But atmosphere doesn't have any boundaries ..If you think everything should have boundaries then nature doesn't work like that ..If you think in religion needs one to worship a God or Gods then Hinduism is not a religion ..It's just a way of living and understanding nature and energies acting on it physically or spiritually ..Having said that there are bubbles inside Hinduism but you can't put Hinduism inside a bubble..

So how come a cow is sacred and Hanuman is a hero if it's not being told by Devine force,and Kishan be Lord and there are so many other gods,,are they all imaginary or developed by peoples them self who practice the as per you the living style called Hinduism,