Silent Buildup

[MastanKhan]

I guess everyone is missing the point in my first post. I can understand the war with India in la onger run aren’t favourable for Pakistan, my point is Pakistan will use its max capability and force to damage India’s military infra as much as they can whether offensive or defensive approach in case of first Indian attack let assume India is offender. Does India has capability to stop full-blow adversary attack? I guess NO!

Hi,

That is the million dollar question---. The only thing that is unpredictable is the Paf---.

Paf will be the deal maker or the deal breaker---. I don't think Paf has prepared it self for the task of conquest over the enemy---.

I believe that IK needs to change the direction the Paf has been heading---that of a defensive force---. It needs to be an offensive strikes force as well as an offensive air dominance force---.

Paf needs at least 150 plus more aircrafts to do that---. If it had another 150 aircrafts of the caliber of JF17 BLK2 available right now---india would not have committed feb26th in the first place---.

 

[Rank]

Hi,

That is the million dollar question---. The only thing that is unpredictable is the Paf---.

Paf will be the deal maker or the deal breaker---. I don't think Paf has prepared it self for the task of conquest over the enemy---.

I believe that IK needs to change the direction the Paf has been heading---that of a defensive force---. It needs to be an offensive strikes force as well as an offensive air dominance force---.

Paf needs at least 150 plus more aircrafts to do that---. If it had another 150 aircrafts of the caliber of JF17 BLK2 available right now---india would not have committed feb26th in the first place---.

IAF qualitative and quantitative edge has existed since parliament attack, Mumbai attack, uri and so on... still failed... I am not estimating IAF but what we have seen ... pure failure... Indian Airforce is literally lacking in something which they even don't know how to overcome..

 

[Kaniska]

I guess everyone is missing the point in my first post. I can understand the war with India in a long run aren’t favorable for Pakistan. My point was Pakistan might use its max capability and force to damage India’s military infra as much as they can whether the offensive or defensive mode. Does India has the capability to stop full-blow adversary attack? I guess NO!

For a moment keep it out the statements of politicians of India.But in statergic term, why would India initiate a war where we are struggling with retaining existing ones?

 

[Rank]

For a moment keep it out the statements of politicians of India.But in statergic term, why would India initiate a war where we are struggling with retaining existing ones?

When a jingoist warmonger mind-set leading the state, you can expect anything!

PS: World have seen this in Feb 2017.... when govt + military might, both were blank when advisory ready for HIC... clearly evident your force completely sitting duck (no plan how to counter in case of response) no plan B C D!

 

[AMRAAM]

Do you understand India, Indian Govt and Indian Military ?

If we start with 2000's.
2001- parliament attack - 2001/2 military stand off - conventional ground forces reaching borders. no outcome.
2008 - Mumbai attacks, no outcome.
2016 - Uri attack, the story of a surgical strike using Indian SF.
2019 - Pulwama Attack - Airforces conduct strikes
2019 - Indian sub detected near Pakistani waters.

Indian Military has pitted all its conventional forces against Pakistan in past 20 years. Army, Special Forces, Air Force, Navy - Result ?

It's not about Indian establishment. There is an RSS terrorist sitting at the top of their command who spent his entire life on a dream of waging a war against Pakistan.

 

[PakFactor]

It's not about Indian establishment. There is an RSS terrorist sitting at the top of their command who spent his entire life on a dream of waging a war against Pakistan.

The most dangerous enemy to ignore is the cunning one — which is the RSS while at the top.

But question is what’s our War Doctrine? My main focus in defense is studying Doctrines that defines the armies objectives and I haven’t seen much from Pakistan Armed Forces. As @MastanKhan said we need to focus on a military that’s offensive posture as that will also solve the defensive issue — and neither politicians or generals took initiative to do so.

Throughout war any defensive posture nation is a sitting duck — it never wins wars and in return just takes punishment, without inflicting any real damage on the enemy, while the other side will restock up and keep hitting.

We have not developed much in armor capabilities and have medium weight tanks rather than focusing on 50+ ton tanks that for example offers better survivability.

Right now only way to take on India is 1st strike using CMs and SOWs and logging them at air bases in a surprise attack like the Israelis did to the Egyptians in 3 hours in which the Israelis reigned supreme throughout the war. Can’t give the enemy any breathing room.

 

[SIPRA]

Conditions, for a potential war, between India and Pakistan, are quite ripe; but there may be other factors and pragmatic considerations, which wouldn't let it happen. In any case, whatever may be the assessment, both the countries would remain on their toes, under the prevailing circumstances.

 

[Shah_Deu]

We need to inflict maximum damage to IAF, its airbases and anti air batteries through SOWs and CMs and our Strike squadrons in the early hours (not days) of the conflict. We have to create our air superiority. Once we have that in the western front, PAF can then take out IAF strike formations by providing CAS to PA. We must start with PAF which is our strength vis a vis IAF, PA should be on defensive since it is where IA is strong. We should play to our strengths. This is how tiny israel has managed to keep much larger neighbors at bay. Airforce is the key! we have to change our mindset to make airforce the most dominant of the three! This is the force which provides us a chance to win against a much bigger India, the other two services are more for the defence while providing some aggressive punch

 

[Sheikh Rauf]

Hi , well I have some question in my mind brother after reading your post,

1)I am interested in knowing how you reached these numbers ?
2)Also 7-10 days you concluded from whose standing point ? Pakistan or India?
If it's Indian , then it hints of achieving their goals based upon cold start , if it's Pakistan's 7-10 days, do discuss what in your opinion we would have set our goals and how much we can achieve them?
3)Also in Pakistan's case, do you think there is a place in which we would be aggressors? ? ( though I know WE have worked hard to build our image as non aggressors since Feb, but what if we came to know that shit is about to hit the fan and we take advantage by having the first strike, maybe our Cold Start )

All above questions / discussion is under Conventional arms only .

Seriously when we decide that now we have to attack believe me we will not think what world will think of us.. we will do what we suppose to .. attack is best defence after all.

 

[Manidabest]

Indians r upto something fishy but i hope we r well prepare agiannst any indian misadventure and i think its coming very soon and will turn it into A BIG WAR lets say 3RD WORLD WAR

 

[Arsalan 345]

I think in case of India Pak full scale war or even limited war,paf is the main weapon of pakistan army.we need to take out their sams and finally fly easily over indian cities but India is deep and pakistan isn't which is very big problem.india can reinforce after paf initial attack and this is the problem.they have everything in large numbers and they install those things deep inside India.sows can be effective near border areas but not against targets deep inside india.this is a big challenge.obviously if we destroy their airbases and sams in the initial attack,they will stop the war.paf presence will be critical but kindly don't underestimate iaf.they have numerical superiority and they can easily destroy our airbases as well.we don't have bombers like tu-160. We need bombers to annihilate indian targets.

Indians r upto something fishy but i hope we r well prepare agiannst any indian misadventure and i think its coming very soon and will turn it into A BIG WAR lets say 3RD WORLD WAR

They are preparing for a war.i think they will open three fronts at the same time.one is Kashmir,other is Punjab and third is Sindh.they have eyes on Sindh as well.they pretend to be innocent but they are very clever and they plan things very carefully.

 

[Lasit Borphukan]

Pak’s job is to exponentially increase the “conjectures” for the Indians do believe in it!!! A deep strike capability to hit Bombay (RSS + Parsi + financial HQ), Madras (southern Brahmins with brains), Bangalore/Hyderabad (outsourced tech hub) etc. is a great plus!! Gujrat (read Ambanis etc.) needs to understand they’re the first to go - aka Sultan Mahmut style....

what a fantasy ... why would any sane mind in Pakistan would attack selective locations in India without destroying Indian might to retaliate...

Pakistan can either use all of its 140 nukes at a time on India and hope that the strike would obliterate Indian ability to respond or just keep the nukes for the museum..

Do you understand India, Indian Govt and Indian Military ?

If we start with 2000's.
2001- parliament attack - 2001/2 military stand off - conventional ground forces reaching borders. no outcome.
2008 - Mumbai attacks, no outcome.
2016 - Uri attack, the story of a surgical strike using Indian SF.
2019 - Pulwama Attack - Airforces conduct strikes
2019 - Indian sub detected near Pakistani waters.

Indian Military has pitted all its conventional forces against Pakistan in past 20 years. Army, Special Forces, Air Force, Navy - Result ?

You can see the clear escalation ladder from India from not doing anything in 2001 to bombing Pakistan in 2019 for a much smaller event than parliament attack. ...

India is playing the mad man here and asking Pakistan to predict its reaction. the strategic intend is to make sure that pakistan thinks 100 times before doing anything in Kashmir .... we are fine as long as Pakistanis stage dharnas on Kashmir every friday... for anything else, the establishment has to do lots of cost vs benefit analysis

 

[ejaz007]

Hi,

These are indeed very concerning times for the region---.

India is going to open up a new front or multiple fronts at that---that is for sure---. Kashmir is going to get snowed in soon---. So that flank if it stays secure would help india in other locations---.

27th did nothing to india other than embarrass it in front of the world---. Paf told the IAF what its shortcoming were and they will thank Paf by showing them that they have taken care of those short comings---.

That show of power by the Paf was a Tactical blunder and disasterous---all the tactical information that was released---that was totally outrageous---.

That is exactly what people in Pakistan do not realize.

We have shown our strength and they know their weakness.

Indeed India should be thankful to Pakistan.

 

[GURU DUTT]

This is a funny thread here even so called "thinking people" Like @MastanKhan are mocking themselfs by dreaming that indian sikhs will turn against India just cause of so called Kartarpur corriodre or 1984 roits done by Congress when they were and are soldier's of sanatan dharm and it was Nihang Sikhs who wrested Ram Mandir initally from bieng a abondenned masjid for almost 350 years & Harminder sahib in pre 1905-7 era has pictures of hindu sadhu's

(a race/panth/sect of hindu's born owt of medival "bhakti movement" by Baba Guru Nanak dev Ji where each Hindu familiy used to doante first son of the family to service of Guru for fight against those who weere opressing Hindus and later they Got weapons training/shastra vidya and intern they were called 'Shiya/sikh' remember last three sikh gurur's and there dicipels were given public death penalities in chandni chowk by Mughal kings @MastanKhan and these lessons are taought to each sikh child in there guru dwara's and schools run by Gurdwara across the world while Guru Granth sahib the last & 10 & Living Guru of sikhs which in the nector of all the great teaching of Guru Nanak and his compatriots like even Kabir & has many great teachings from GITA & Upnishads & Veda's & Quran)


now lets talk about Indian Strategy well what hapenned on Feb26 & 27 was a more of recce mission to tell self ego filled IK & his GHQ bakers that we can cross the LOC even after so called "NUCLEAR BLACKMAIL BY PAKISTAN" and we did and nothing happenned

now coming to something serous

1.India will never attack where and How PAF & PA & PN wants it to

2. India will for sure punish those who made lives on indian misrable with there 1000 cuts poilicy

3.what missiles , aircrafts& MBTs or MRBLs or so called Tactical nuces you boast soon will be of no use

4. Pakistan might have some Nuces india has more & better advanced version

in true terms even the bosses in GHQ and those in biejieng & washington know these facts but its the false bravado in Pindi & lahore & islamabad and its media circle thats whipping up the frenzy when the bulk of pakistani (90%)nation is finding it impossible to get a proper two squar meal a day with dignity

so instead of harming india think what is written on the wall and instead of dreaming about so called G-T-H try improving the lives of avrage pakistanies or else

 

[SABRE]

It does.. India has a nuclear tria... how you can target or neutralized entire India strategic capability? Similarly Pakistan’s SF is mostly based on TEL mobility, you can fire from anywhere not a stand alone single launch pad... my ref in this perspective... the system is spread all over...

Again, don't take this personally, but your selection of words is confusing. There are specific lexicons applied to nuclear weapons strategy. Perhaps, when you say ubiquitous you are implying the term "dispersed"?