Should The Hagia Sofia become a Mosque?

[TMA]

1.Hagia Sofia has been burnt down, destroyed and desecrated several times by contending Christian rulers or pontiffs. This one is indeed a symbol of Islamic prowess. Generations of Muslims and Turks have given their life to conquer Constantinople and thus announce to the world that the Message of Islam has now entered Europe. I for one would like to see it as a mosque where Mumins will pray.
2. Don't forget - never forget al Andalusia. How many mosques have been allowed to remain. May be one or two out of thousands.
3. Same process is going on in Arakan, Burma. Some of the oldest mosques of Islam have been leveled up by the Buddhist rulers. Something similar happened in Cambodia where most of those killed in the Killing Fields in the name cultural cleansing were in fact Cambodian Muslims. You can see the few surviving families huddled in a shanty across the river in Phenom Pen.

The destruction of mosques in Iberia and Cambodia does not mean that Muslims should destroy Churches in Anatolia. If others cannot respect places of worship, we should not stoop to their level.

 

[WaLeEdK2]

No, it should be converted back into a cathedral.

 

[NUCLEAR_WINTER]

bumb

 

[asad71]

The destruction of mosques in Iberia and Cambodia does not mean that Muslims should destroy Churches in Anatolia. If others cannot respect places of worship, we should not stoop to their level.

I totally agree with you. But the emotion attached to this edifice and the sacrifices made in the name of Islam over generations make me feel that here we may perhaps break the exalted principle you mention. .

 

[TMA]

I totally agree with you. But the emotion attached to this edifice and the sacrifices made in the name of Islam over generations make me feel that here we may perhaps break the exalted principle you mention. .

No.

 

[flamer84]

The Christians of the time destroyed Masjid and converted Masjid Al-Aqsa into a stable

Not the Orthodox.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

It is on Turkish real estate. Let them decide. This thread is like you lot deciding what extention I put on my house.

 

[Azad-Kashmiri]

Not the Orthodox.

So..you follow Rum, the Byzantine Christendom? How is Rusia different to Greek Christendom?

Verily, you will find the strongest among men in enmity to the believers (Muslims) the Jews and those who are Al-Mushrikun (idol worshipers), and you will find the nearest in love to the believers (Muslims) those who say: "We are Christians." That is because amongst them are priests and monks, and they are not proud. (Quran: Surah Maidah.82)

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Should The Hagia Sofia become a Mosque?

Turks gather to pray at Hagia Sofia, call to reopen mosque​

The Imam of the Ka'bah, Islam's holiest site in Mecca, Abdullah Basfar, led thousands in a dawn prayer congregation outside of the Hagia Sofia on Saturday morning, before the congregation raised their hands in supplication asking for it to be reverted into a mosque.

World Bulletin / News Desk

It has served as the exalted seat of two faiths since its vast dome and lustrous gold mosaics first levitated above Istanbul in the 6th Century: Christendom's greatest cathedral for 900 years and one of Islam's greatest mosques for another 560.

Today, the Hagia Sophia, or Ayasofya in Turkish, is officially a museum: Turkey's most-visited monument, whose formally neutral status symbolises the secular nature of the modern Turkish state.

An imam of the Ka'bah, Islam's holiest site in Mecca, Abdullah Basfar, led thousands in a dawn prayer congregation outside of the Hagia Sofia on Saturday morning, before the congregation raised their hands in supplication asking for it to be reverted into a mosque.

"This is a serious push to break Ayasofya's chains," said Salih Turhan, head of the Anatolia Youth Association, which has collected 15 million signatures to petition for it to be turned back into a mosque.

"Ayasofya is a symbol for the Islamic world and the symbol of Istanbul's conquest. Without it, the conquest is incomplete, we have failed to honour Sultan Mehmet's trust," he said, citing a 15th Century deed signed by the conquering Caliph and decrying as sin other uses of Hagia Sophia.

Built in 537 by Byzantine Emperor Justinian whose rule stretched from Spain to the Middle East, Hagia Sophia - meaning "Divine Wisdom" in Greek - was unrivalled in the Christian world until Ottoman Sultan Mehmet II conquered the city in 1453 and turned it into a mosque. Modern Turkey's founder Mustafa Kemal Ataturk decreed it a museum in 1934.

Now, renewed interest in praying at Hagia Sophia taps into a burgeoning sense of Islamic identity that Erdogan has encouraged during a decade as Turkey's dominant politician.

For most of the 20th Century, Western-oriented Turks scorned the imperial past. But Erdogan has promoted celebration of the Turkish conquest that turned Constantinople into Istanbul.

"Conquest is the removal of shackles on doors and in hearts," he said on Thursday to mark the 561st anniversary of the Byzantine defeat. "Civilisation comes with conquest."

A 2012 film depicting the Muslim takeover of the Byzantine capital, "Conquest 1453", attracted an audience of millions. So has the museum's "Panorama 1453" exhibition, which recreates the event in vivid detail.

Ibrahim Kalin, a senior Erdogan adviser, said there were no plans to alter the monument's current status.

"Speculation on changing it into a church or a mosque remains speculation. Hagia Sophia has been open to all visitors from Turkey and around the world and will remain so," he said.

Last year, Erdogan said he would not consider changing Hagia Sophia's status as long as another great Istanbul house of worship, the 17th Century Sultan Ahmed Mosque, remains mostly empty of worshippers. Istanbul boasts more than 3,000 mosques.

But many pious Turks believe turning Hagia Sophia into a museum denigrated the memory of Sultan Mehmet, who strode into the cathedral to pray at its altar.

http://www.worldbulletin.net/headlines/137796/turks-gather-to-pray-at-hagia-sofia-call-to-reopen-
mosque

Turkish opposition calls to transform Hagia Sofia into mosque
​

Following similar calls from Turkey’s second biggest opposition party MHP, Turkey’s main opposition, the Republican People’s Party (CHP) have also called to transform the Hagia Sofia into a mosque.

World Bulletin / News Desk

Republican People’s Party Ankara minister Sinan Aygun has posedthe question as to why the Hagia Sofia shouldn’t be turned into a mosque in the Turkish parliament, following a call to turn the museum into a mosque by a member of Turkey’s third biggest party MHP.

The Hagia Sofia was originally built as an orthodox church around 1,500 years ago, but was converted into a mosque in 1453 after Sultan Mehmet II conquered Istanbul for the Ottoman Empire. After the Ottoman Empire collapsed, making way for the constitutionally secular Republic of Turkey, the mosque was closed and reopened as a museum in 1935.

MHP minister and historian Yusuf Halacoglu first proposed transforming it into a mosque, claiming that it had no legal basis to remain as a museum. Investigations into the decree that turned the Hagia Sofia into a museum have revealed discrepancies regarding the date the decree was issued, as well as sparking claims that the founder and first president of the Turkish Republic Mustafa Kemal Ataturk’s signature was forged.

The signature on the decree dated November 24, 1934 spells K.Ataturk. However, it is well-known that the founder of Turkey and first president had not yet adopted the surname Ataturk on that date, and was back then simply known as Gazi Mustafa Kemal.

Turkish opposition calls to transform Hagia Sofia into mosque | General | Worldbulletin News

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According to Ustad Nejip Fazil, closing Aya Sofia as a mosque is like putting a seal (muhr) on the souls of the Turks. InshAllah it will be reopened as a mosque when the Turk millet get their souls fully back. Allah u Azimusshan knows the best.

As for Fatih Sultan Mehmet Han (Khan as pronounced in other parts), May Allah be pleased with him, the sultan had cursed (Beddua) those who would close Aya Sofia as a mosque and prayed to Allah not to take them out from the 7th Jahannam. As an Aulia his curse won't go to vain inshAllah.

 

[flamer84]

So..you follow Rum, the Byzantine Christendom? How is Rusia different to Greek Christendom?

Verily, you will find the strongest among men in enmity to the believers (Muslims) the Jews and those who are Al-Mushrikun (idol worshipers), and you will find the nearest in love to the believers (Muslims) those who say: "We are Christians." That is because amongst them are priests and monks, and they are not proud. (Quran: Surah Maidah.82)

Yes,most Romanians are Orthodox Christians.Russians are not different,they're Orthodox just like us,just like the Greeks,Bulgarian,Serbs.

 

[TMA]

According to Ustad Nejip Fazil, closing Aya Sofia as a mosque is like putting a seal (muhr) on the souls of the Turks. InshAllah it will be reopened as a mosque when the Turk millet get their souls fully back. Allah u Azimusshan knows the best.

As for Fatih Sultan Mehmet Han (Khan as pronounced in other parts), May Allah be pleased with him, the sultan had cursed (Beddua) those who would close Aya Sofia as a mosque and prayed to Allah not to take them out from the 7th Jahannam. As an Aulia his curse won't go to vain inshAllah.

May I ask, is it permissible in Islam to forcibly convert a Cathederal into a Mosque? I am asking from the Islamic perspective not from the Conqueror's perspective.

If the answer is no, then do you agree that what was done was a wrong?

 

[Azadkashmir]

orthodox Christians main cathedral was hagia sofia this was their nerve center like ours al aqsa and kaaba.
i think they should allow Christians return to it. plus this will down play tensions. imran nazar says Muslims should give it back and apologise, imagine how we would feel if same were to happen to us. however western Christianity is pagan mix and infiltrated by crypto zion leaders, = knights templar money usury.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

May I ask, is it permissible in Islam to forcibly convert a Cathederal into a Mosque? I am asking from the Islamic perspective not from the Conqueror's perspective.

If the answer is no, then do you agree that what was done was a wrong?

To the best of my knowledge and humble opinion l'll try to answer. My intention definitely is not to start polemics or to disrespect any religion or its followers. My sources are based on the Ottoman understanding of the Kuran and the Islamic Jurisprudence. I am not an expert on them either. My understanding is like taking a teaspoon of water from the vast oceans of Islamic knowledge base.

When Allah u Azimusshan (folks who are'nt muslims might think of ONE GOD who has no partners, sons etc.) created all human souls together, he gathered them and asked them who was their LORD. They all said in fact Allah is their LORD. And then Allah asked to the souls who want to be Muslims (submit to Allah and Only worship Allah. All prophets were Muslims and they called people to worshipping only one GOD, Allah). A faction of the souls sumitted themselves to be Muslims, and the rest declined to be Muslims. From Islamic point of view, the consequences of these choices, needless to say, aren't the same - one leads to eternal salvation, the other to eternal condemnation. As such Islam accepts that there will be Muslims and people from other religions cohabit at the same time as per the Divine Plan. In this world, all enjoy some undeniable rights including right to worship whoever they wish and whichever religion they like, and there shouldn't be anarchy on the basis of religions. As churches or mosques or temples are parts of religion, they are safe guarded as well.

Human experience, however, is very complex and it includes events like war which carries existential threats for nations. People participating in this defense forum is itself the proof that how important these matters of war and peace are!

As for Aya Sofia, it was the symbol of religious and political supremacy of Byzantine Othodox folks over all other friends and rivals including Temple of Solomon in Jerusalem and Catholic Churches in Rome. Aya Sofia was ravaged and merciless killings, rapes and lootings were done by the Latins in the 13th century. Constatinopole fell to the Sultan after a bloody fight. He could have demolished Aya Sofia along with annihilation and expulsion of Orghodox folks to show who is the new Boss in the town (not to justify anything but for historical notes - think about fall of Moor Arabs in Spain or Crusaders in Jerrusalem). But, Islam prohibited him to carry out wholesale anarchies and slaughters as par the norm of the day. So, he made a smart move in consultation with his top religious and political advisors (Kuran is explicitly against one-man show and encourages collective decision making mechanisms) by converting Ays Sofia into a mosque, renaming the city to Istanbul, transferring his capital from Edirne to Istanbul. Moreover, he brought in Jews, Armenians and Latins to give it a cosmopolitan makeover. As for the Orthodox, they were allowed to keep their Top Clerics and HQ in Istanbul (to this day Greek Orhodox Church HQ is in Istanbul). So, the Sultan sent a clear message through Aya Sofia that he was there to stay, no more Catholics killing Orthodox or Muslims killing Christians, no ethnic cleansing, no alphabet soup anarchists/terrorists (mostly in the service of foreign enemies to internally weaken the states), I. e ., Buck stops here. You are free to worship, trade and live your lives, but don't forget to pay your taxes!!

To summarize, as far as my take from Ottoman understanding of Islamic jurisprudence is concerned, NO to arbitrary conversion of cathedrals to mosques, but if one conversion saves hundreds of thousands of lives GO AHEAD with fill speed for all administrative actions come secondary to the preservation human life, dignity and honor.

..Wa ma Taufiqi Illa Billah.


* Sheyh Abdali to Osman Gazi (founder of the Ottoman Empire), "Let the people live, so that the State lives."

 

[TMA]

To the best of my knowledge and humble opinion l'll try to answer. My intention definitely is not to start polemics or to disrespect any religion or its followers. My sources are based on the Ottoman understanding of the Kuran and the Islamic Jurisprudence. I am not an expert on them either. My understanding is like taking a teaspoon of water from the vast oceans of Islamic knowledge base.

When Allah u Azimusshan (folks who are'nt muslims might think of ONE GOD who has no partners, sons etc.) created all human souls together, he gathered them and asked them who was their LORD. They all said in fact Allah is their LORD. And then Allah asked to the souls who want to be Muslims (submit to Allah and Only worship Allah. All prophets were Muslims and they called people to worshipping only one GOD, Allah). A faction of the souls sumitted themselves to be Muslims, and the rest declined to be Muslims. From Islamic point of view, the consequences of these choices, needless to say, aren't the same - one leads to eternal salvation, the other to eternal condemnation. As such Islam accepts that there will be Muslims and people from other religions cohabit at the same time as per the Divine Plan. In this world, all enjoy some undeniable rights including right to worship whoever they wish and whichever religion they like, and there shouldn't be anarchy on the basis of religions. As churches or mosques or temples are parts of religion, they are safe guarded as well.

Human experience, however, is very complex and it includes events like war which carries existential threats for nations. People participating in this defense forum is itself the proof that how important these matters of war and peace are!

As for Aya Sofia, it was the symbol of religious and political supremacy of Byzantine Othodox folks over all other friends and rivals including Temple of Solomon in Jerusalem and Catholic Churches in Rome. Aya Sofia was ravaged and merciless killings, rapes and lootings were done by the Latins in the 13th century. Constatinopole fell to the Sultan after a bloody fight. He could have demolished Aya Sofia along with annihilation and expulsion of Orghodox folks to show who is the new Boss in the town (not to justify anything but for historical notes - think about fall of Moor Arabs in Spain or Crusaders in Jerrusalem). But, Islam prohibited him to carry out wholesale anarchies and slaughters as par the norm of the day. So, he made a smart move in consultation with his top religious and political advisors (Kuran is explicitly against one-man show and encourages collective decision making mechanisms) by converting Ays Sofia into a mosque, renaming the city to Istanbul, transferring his capital from Edirne to Istanbul. Moreover, he brought in Jews, Armenians and Latins to give it a cosmopolitan makeover. As for the Orthodox, they were allowed to keep their Top Clerics and HQ in Istanbul (to this day Greek Orhodox Church HQ is in Istanbul). So, the Sultan sent a clear message through Aya Sofia that he was there to stay, no more Catholics killing Orthodox or Muslims killing Christians, no ethnic cleansing, no alphabet soup anarchists/terrorists (mostly in the service of foreign enemies to internally weaken the states), I. e ., Buck stops here. You are free to worship, trade and live your lives, but don't forget to pay your taxes!!

To summarize, as far as my take from Ottoman understanding of Islamic jurisprudence is concerned, NO to arbitrary conversion of cathedrals to mosques, but if one conversion saves hundreds of thousands of lives GO AHEAD with fill speed for all administrative actions come secondary to the preservation human life, dignity and honor.

..Wa ma Taufiqi Illa Billah.


* Sheyh Abdali to Osman Gazi (founder of the Ottoman Empire), "Let the people live, so that the State

Look at what Salahuddin did when he conquered Jerusalem. He had more right to vengeance than Sultan Fateh. Look at the Caliph Umar (may Allah be pleased with him) when he conquered Jerusalem.

I don't understand how converting a Cathedral into a Mosque saved hundred of thousands of lives. Please explain.

Sorry. My reply to you was included in your answer. I must have misplaced my cursor.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Sorry. My reply to you was included in your answer. I must have misplaced my cursor.

The Sultan had to show to the Muslims that the Hadith about conquering Constantinopole had indeed been fulfilled and Islam had indeed been victorious. Conversion of Aya Sofia did that job. It quenched the anger among the victors to take revenge from the warring party as was the norm of the day. A large portion of Ottoman subjects were Christians. If the Muslim majority didn't feel entitled at least from the honor point of view, how could the internal peace be maintained and the minority feel safe?