Saudis Must Stop Exporting Extremism

[Cheetah786]

Would he recognize your Shia sect?

Yes

 

[Falcon29]

Yes

Why so? Isn't he against sects?

 

[Cheetah786]

Why so? Isn't he against sects?

I believe Almighty to be the judge and firmly believe he and he only can decide who is right and who is wrong. (You are not a MUSLIM if other aren't safe from you and your actions).

 

[Falcon29]

I believe Almighty to be the judge and firmly believe he and he only can decide who is right and who is wrong. (You are not a MUSLIM if other aren't safe from you and your actions).

I agree with you here in my honest opinion.Only God can determine who dies a Muslim(Before Islam came anyone who submitted to God). Although I can't make out what you're trying to say in the paragraphs. Although(Take or don't take, but don't consider this hostile) I believe humans tend to adjust things to their preferences. I am not-Shia even if I don't think some parts of their ideology are right.

Such as their position regarding Abu Bakr(ra) and Ali Ibn Talib(ra). I don't think some of you notice Abu Bakr(ra) is mentioned in the Quran by the Almighty. Also in the Quran mentioned was people spreading rumors of the Prophet's(SAW) wife. I've heard that Shia's state Ali(RA) was not involved in conquests, more specifically conquest of Persia. Even though the war fought against Persia was defensive. Persian Empire was occupying eastern Arabia. And Ali(RA) actually sent his sons to fight.

Our differences are not much if you think about it. But, I believe these differences are irrational. Just as may believe some differences by Salafi's are irrational and intended to just separate theirselves or put their selves above the main body.

I would like to take this opportunity to discuss our differences and back them up with sources. If I see what you say indeed is correct I will look into it. Although, keep in mind I'm a crafty person that is good at refuting. In return I will give you sources to support my position.

 

[Cheetah786]

I agree with you here in my honest opinion.Only God can determine who dies a Muslim(Before Islam came anyone who submitted to God). Although I can't make out what you're trying to say in the paragraphs. Although(Take or don't take, but don't consider this hostile) I believe humans tend to adjust things to their preferences. I am not-Shia even if I don't think some parts of their ideology are right.

Such as their position regarding Abu Bakr(ra) and Ali Ibn Talib(ra). I don't think some of you notice Abu Bakr(ra) is mentioned in the Quran by the Almighty. Also in the Quran mentioned was people spreading rumors of the Prophet's(SAW) wife. I've heard that Shia's state Ali(RA) was not involved in conquests, more specifically conquest of Persia. Even though the war fought against Persia was defensive. Persian Empire was occupying eastern Arabia. And Ali(RA) actually sent his sons to fight.

Our differences are not much if you think about it. But, I believe these differences are irrational. Just as may believe some differences by Salafi's are irrational and intended to just separate theirselves or put their selves above the main body.

I would like to take this opportunity to discuss our differences and back them up with sources. If I see what you say indeed is correct I will look into it. Although, keep in mind I'm a crafty person that is good at refuting. In return I will give you sources to support my position.

Please provide the name of the Surah or verse from Quran.

 

[Falcon29]

Please provide the name of the Surah or verse from Quran.

This one is the most direct one:

Al-Bara'at. : "He being the second of the two, When they were in the cave and when Muhammad said to his companion 'Grieve not, surely God is with us,' then God came to their help, and protected them with an army which they saw not". {9:40}

.....

There are more which the Prophet(SAW) mentioned in hadith that were revealed in reference to Abu Bakr(ra) or his affairs.

 

[Cheetah786]

This one is the most direct one:

Al-Bara'at. : "He being the second of the two, When they were in the cave and when Muhammad said to his companion 'Grieve not, surely God is with us,' then God came to their help, and protected them with an army which they saw not". {9:40}

.....

There are more which the Prophet(SAW) mentioned in hadith that were revealed in reference to Abu Bakr(ra) or his affairs.

I am sorry I don't believe in hadiath. Those were written 100s of years after the prophet.

 

[Falcon29]

I am sorry I don't believe in hadiath. Those were written 100s of years after the prophet.

Which claim exactly? I claimed that he is mentioned in the Quran and cited a verse. There are other verses which some scholars say are referenced to him.

But, my friend, it's odd that you say you don't believe in hadith. Because hadith is the only reason Shia sect exist. Without those specific hadith books, Shia scholars wouldn't have anything to cite to support their positions.

You edited your post pretty quickly there.

 

[Falcon29]

Forget these people. They can't even read the Quran properly and you try to influence them with it.
Are you Levant people only beautiful or are you intelligent also. I know many Arab's especially Palestinians who are doctors.

I am intelligent but not beautiful.

Although I've been called many names by people who disagree with me.

A little bit maybe.

That being said, take it easy and some people will look into it. I'm not trying to convert anyone, I consider them already as Muslims in general terms. It's this thread which brought up idea of 'religious sect' being behind this war. So it got into a religious discussion. And I wanted him to look into his beliefs.

Remember they're afraid since they believe we are hostile to them. But, for me the truth is I don't find Sunni's to be hostile them. Especially during 70's-80s time. We Arabs had many and still do have popular Shia singers. This sectarian scene is new to all of us. And he probably thinks I obsess over Sunni's. Truth is though I am frustrated at most Sunni's there are today.

 

[kalu_miah]

Blog: Truth About Muslim Brotherhood, Salafism (wahabism) and The Ayatullahs - Wake Up From Your Slumber

Truth About Muslim Brotherhood, Salafism (wahabism) and The Ayatullahs

published by Lindquist on Tue, 2013-03-19 11:33
And though I suspected complicity on the part of the Ayatollah, I had no time to research that connection. What ties all of these matters together is Freemasonry’s 18th Degree where hierophant fools swear allegiance to the interests of Israel above all others. There has been a strong Jewish and occult Jewish presence in Persia for ages and even now there is strong evidence from primary sources—who I have met—that Jews control a majority of resources and most of the well valued land and fixed properties. When one adds this to the occult/Satanic nature of the Shi’ite‒Ismai’li origins, there is most definitely a recipe for collusion, subversion, and top-shelf mischief making of the worst kind.

I have edited the article and corrected some minor errors. Yes… as I have said many times, our leaders really are that wicked, but what is worst, Muslims really are this stupid as well — both realities are just as the prophet (wslm) predicted. – oz

The ‘age of enlightenment’ or ‘age of modernity’ was the period when many in Europe first started to break with a millennia old tradition by questioning Christianity and replacing it with Freemasonry. It became their to spread their ‘belief’ and practices in the entire world so that Freemasonry became the main world religion with them at the helm.

Whereas European missionaries had previously tried to convert non-Europeans to Christianity; after the Enlightenment a new kind of missionary emerged: European Freemasons who employed fellow non-European Freemasons to infiltrate indigenous religions in order to reform them. What this ‘reforming’ entailed was a transformation of traditional religions that would harmonize with the occult practices of Freemasonry. This writer posits that this was the case with Islam and the so-called Islamic reformist movements that began in the 19th century and gave birth to Salafism, Wahhabism, the Muslim Brotherhood, Al Qaeda, Khomeini’s revolution, and lastly, the present Arab Springs.

The leading figures in the 19th century Islamic reformist movement—alternatively called Islamic Modernism or Islamic Revivalism—were (a) JAMAL AL-DIN AL AFGHANI (whose real name was Jamal Al-Din Al Asadabadi), (b) MUHAMMAD ABDUH; and then later in the 20th century, the leading by Browse to Save" href="Wake Up From Your Slumber - The Truth Will Set You Free">man in this movement was (c) HASSAN AL BANNA. All three were initiated into European Freemasonry; a fact acknowledged by the Encyclopedia Brittanica and other famous sources. It is even acknowledged by the grandson of Hassan Al Banna, Tariq Ramadan.

JAMAL AL-DIN AL AFGHANI is readily seen as a Father of the majority of Islamic reformist movements this time. It is less well known that he was also a major source of Ayatollah Khomeini’s inspiration. Khomeini actually called him “The Teacher and hero of the Islamic Revolutionary movement”, and even named a square after him in Tehran.

MUHAMMAD ABDUH was Jamal Al-Din Al Afghani’s most prominent pupil and founder of the modern Salafi movement.

HASSAN AL BANNA was the founder of the Muslim Brotherhood. The Islamists of a so-called ‘Al Qaeda’ sprang from the Muslim Brotherhood and Al Qaeda’s current leader, Ayman Al-Zawahiri, is famously known as a Muslim Brotherhood by Browse to Save" href="Wake Up From Your Slumber - The Truth Will Set You Free">member; even though he formed his own group later on. Sayyed Qutb, who led the Muslim Brotherhood during the 1950s and 1960s, also became the main ideologue for the MB and other Islamists.

Taken From wikipedia: h ttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_revival
(edited by Omar Zaid)

Origins

The man cited by most researchers as the forerunner of these several re-Islamization movements is Jamal-al-Din Afghani: “one of the most influential Muslim reformers of the nineteenth century” who traveled the Muslim world. [1] His acolyte, Muhammad Abduh, has been labled “the most influential figure” of the early Salafi movement. [2] In 1928, Hassan al-Banna established the Muslim Brotherhood as the first mass Islamist organization which remains one of the world’s largest, most influential Islamic groups. Other influential revival activists and thinkers include Rashid Rida [who was a Freemason and editor of the ‘Lighthouse’ (a Freemasonic codeword)], and Ali Abdel Raziq.

In South Asia, Islamic revivalist intellectuals and statesmen like Syed Ahmed Khan, Muhammad Iqbal, Muhammad Ali Jinnah promoted a Two-Nation Theory, while the Muslim League established the world’s first modern Islamic Republic, Pakistan. Abul Ala Maududi was the later leader of this movement who established Jamaat-e-Islami in South Asia. Today it is one of the largest Islamic parties in the Indian sub-continent, spanning four countries: Pakistan, India, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka — although these different national parties have no organizational links between them.[3]

As for the current Islamist revival, two ostensible causes can be cited:

1. The energy crisis of the 1970s which led to the formation of the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC). Many Muslims believe, as did Saudi Prince Saud al-Faisal, that the hundreds of billions of dollars in wealth obtained from the Gulf’s oil reserves were nothing less than a gift from God to the Islamic faithful. [4]
2. The return of the Khomeini to Iran (1979) and his establishment of a fundamentalist Islamic state.[5]

This JAMAL AL-DIN AL AFGHANI figure shared many similarities with Ayatollah Khomeini. From the book The Middle East: From Transition to Development’ by Sami G. Hajjar:[6]

“It is historically significant that the leader, who was preeminently responsible for the present-day revival, Imam Khomeini, became active almost one century after al-Afghani, the other Persian leader, began his activities, and from the same place of exile: Paris.”

Man believe JAMAL AL-DIN AL AFGHANI-ASADABADI was an Afghan SUNNI, but this is not so. He was born, raised and studied as an IRANIAN TWELVER SHIA—in Tehran and Najaf—and aslo associated more with Bahais, Babists, Freemasons, occultists and Westerners. Essentially, he was NOT MUSLIM in the classical sense as either Sunni or Shia.

Yet he is seen as the Father of modern Islamist movements: Pan Islamism, Salafism, Wahhabism, the Iranian Islamic Revolution, and Muslim Brotherhood. His dearest disciple was Muhammad Abduh, a Freemason just like his master. In turn, his most prominent disciple was RASHID RIDA, also a Freemason, who became a leading advocate for Whahhabism.

That Jamal Al-Din Afghani/Asadabadi was the founder of the Arab Mason Society is something the Encyclopedia Britannica acknowledges quite openly (as do Freemasons): \

“During this period of political effervescence, Afghānī attempted to gain and manipulate power by organizing his followers in a Masonic lodge, of which he became the leader, and by delivering fiery speeches against Ismāʿīl.” [7]

We also read from Tariq Ramadan, Hasan Al Bana’s grandson the following:

As revealed by Abduh, he, Afghani, developed in his students a practical inclination: he encouraged them to engage in the publication of magazines, to put in motion a current of opinion and to join, like he himself did, the Masonic Lodges of French inspiration. [8]
At the same time he Afghani started to introduce himself into the French circles of freemasonry. He introduced, as we have seen, the Egyptian intellectuals of his entourage who were to be, later, the principal actors of the ‘Urabi Revolution. These circles had a crucial importance for al-Afghani: not only because they allowed him to spread his ideas but also because he was able to meet with influential people in the political environment. Thus we can affirm, without any doubt, that this is the period, in which al-Afghani, thanks to the recognition and to the personal engagement in the creation of an associative body conceived on the model of the Masonic circles, was able to accentuate his involvement in establishing political influence and alliance with the powers. (ibid., p. 85)

Other writers offer the following remarks:

In this period Afghani came forward as a political figure in two ways: by using a Freemasonic lodge as a vehicle for political intrigue and change, and by influencing people through oratory. [9]

The Documents corroborate and help to date Afghani’s membership and activity in the Freemasons of Egypt. … Most discussions of Afghani’s Masonic activity begin it in 1877 or 1878, but the Documents include a letter from him applying for membership in a Masonic lodge which dates from the spring of 1875 and a note saying he had entered a lodge in Muharram 1293/February 1876. Unfortunately the name or rite of the lodge is not included. The Documents also include invitations to sessions of Italian Lodges from early 1877 through 1879 and documents beginning in January 1877, from the Eastern Star Lodge, which was affiliated with the Grand Lodge of England. … The lodge, with Afghani as its leader, was to become an important instrument in the growing Egyptian crisis of 1878 and 1879. [10]

Jamal Al-Din Afghani/Asadabadi is also held in very high regard by the current Iranian government, here is what they think about him, from the Iranian government website:[11]

Tuesday, March 09, 1897: The Martyrdom of Seyyed Jamal al-Din Asad Abadi

Sayyid Jamal al-Din Asadabadi was born in Asadabad, Hamadan, in 1838. He began his study with his father when he was only five, and thanks to his ingenuity and aptitude soon acquainted himself with Quran Interpretation. To continue his education, he moved to Qazvin and then Tehran and subsequently departed for Najaf in 1849 to benefit from the presence of two Shiite Grand Marja’ of the time, Sheikh Morteza Ansari and Mollah Hussein-Qoli Hamadani. Sayyid Jamal proceeded to develop an anti-colonial and anti-British intellectual movement in Egypt, and founded an organization called “the Secret Society”, but British pressures made him leave Egypt. His movement was kept alive by his disciples, inclusive of Sheikh Muhammad Abdeh, and later paved the ground for popular uprising of the Egyptians against British colonialism. Having left Egypt, Sayyid Jamal resided in India for a while and then migrated to Europe. In Paris he published, in coordination with Muhammad Abdeh, “Orvat-al-Vosqa”, a newspaper, and engaged in removing the doubts poured on Islam through the articles of Ernest Renan in a Parisian newspaper. Being exiled from Iran, Sayyid Jamal arrived in Basra and, accompanied by Sayyid Ali Akbar Shirazi, dispatched a missive to Grand Ayatollah Sayyid Hassan Shirazi to complain of the oppression imposed on Iranian people by the King; a missive believed to greatly contribute to issuance of the fatwa on prohibition of tobacco by Ayatollah Mirza Shirazi and its subsequent tobacco movement. His presence in Iraq during 1891-92 had a further great influence in intellectual, political, and Islamic life of Shiite-inhabited regions and increased propagation of Islamic teachings in the country, as he was, and still is, widely known as the pioneer of Islamic “reform” or “renewal”. He spent his late life in Ottoman territories, being indirectly controlled by Sultan Abdul Hamid. Upon receiving the news of the murder of Nasser al-Din Shah Qajar by Mirza Reza Kermani, a disciple of Sayyid Jamal, Sultan Abdul Hamid was alarmed and ordered the murder of Sayyid Jamal. Eventually on March 9, 1897, he was poisoned and his body was buried in Sheikh’s cemetery of Constantinople.”

As you may know the Egyptian government is presently led by the Muslim Brotherhood. The Muslim Brotherhood, even though they claim to be ‘Sunni’, has always been close with Ayatollahs in Iran. Khomeini spoke highly of the Muslim Brotherhood and the Muslim Brotherhood member, Khalid Islambuli, the man who killed Sadat, was a declared a hero by Khomeini.

From wikipedia:

The Iranian Government, in response to Sadat’s peace treaty with Israel, and his provision of asylum to the deposed Shah of Iran, severed relations with Egypt and named a street in Tehran after Islambouli in 1981 in honor of his actions. Following Islambouli’s execution, Iran’s Supreme Leader Ruhollah Khomeini declared him a martyr. In light of extensive public protest, in May 2001 the Tehran City Council renamed the street “intifada street” in an effort to improve these relations.[12]

The Muslim Brotherhood has extolled Iranian Ayatollahs as made evident in this recent video:

It is this writer’s opinion that Khomeini’s revolution was not earnestly Islamic. And now that we see that the Muslim Brotherhood shares a Freemason origin with the Iranian, Afghan, it becomes suspicious now that both appear to conspire against Assad in Syria.

Please note that Qatar is currently the greatest supporter and sponsor of the Muslim Brotherhood as well as the Syrian rebels who are led by the Muslim Brotherhood and armed by the West. Qatar is also one of the very few Sunni countries that have maintained good relations with Tehran. In addition, Qatar also hosts the largest US military base in the Middle East and its state channel, Al-Jazeera, was created by staff members from the BBC. Al-Jazeera’s monitoring and Broadcasting of the Arab Spring, which Iran supported, show several similarities that run parallel with the 1979 Iranian revolution.

As for the role of (i) NATO; (ii) the Freemasons; (iii) the Muslim Brotherhood; and (iv); the BBC; during the 1979 Iranian revolution, let us review the following report and note the similarities:

The Conspiracy to Dethrone The Shah [13]

There are numerous reasons for believing that the emergence of a highly dynamic form of Islamic fundamentalism in Iran was a development of incalculable worldwide consequence. Since that fateful day of revolution back in 1979, the Islamic peoples have found themselves thrust into the very `storm-front` of world events; Ongoing wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, the conflict in Palestine, continuing troubles in several former Soviet republics involving Islamic majorities or minorities, the intimidation by China of Muslims in Xinjiang province, the seemingly endless conflict over Kashmir, and the tragic events of 9/11, have served to ensure that the much vaunted `Clash Of Civilizations` remains, much as the `Cold War` once had, an ever present `threat` in the minds of the western public’s manipulated sense of reality.

In the West, the `Establishment` and media’s portrayal of Iran’s Islamic Revolution is that Khomeini’s revolt was spontaneous and populist [just like the Arab Spring right?] and that it overthrew a repressive dictatorship that was hated by the people and supported wholeheartedly by the United States. It is true that the Shah’s government was not a democracy and that his secret service, trained by the CIA, was one of the most effective and often brutal intelligence organizations in the world. But what is not reported is that prior to the British-sponsored massive public relations campaign on behalf of the Ayatollah, the government of the Shah was in general, supported by the vast majority of the population. (…)

Prior to his exile from Iran in 1964, Khomeini had been based at the religious city of Qom, where, according to Radio Free Iran, as reported by Dr. Coleman, a former British Intelligence agent, he received a monthly stipend from the British [as did Ibn Saud], with whom he was in constant contact with.

Seen as a major threat to the Shah’s authority, Khomeini was deported to Iraq, where he lived until his arrest and subsequent deportation by the Iraqi government in 1978. French President, D’Estang, was then pressured to offer Khomeini refuge in France. Khomeini’s stay in France was financed by Francois Genoud. Coleman writes:

• Once Khomeini was installed at the Chateau Neauphle, he began to receive a constant stream of visitors, many of them from the BBC, the CIA and British intelligence.

The attack on the Shah’s government came through the Muslim Brotherhood and the Mullahs and Ayatollahs of Iran, supported and manipulated as ever by British Intelligence. Dr. John Coleman, a former British Intelligence agent and author of a number of books and monographs detailing the Establishment’s plan for a socialist world government, states in his report on Iran’s Islamic Revolution that the Muslim Brotherhood was created by:

• the great names of British Middle East intelligence, T.E. Lawrence, E.G. Browne, Arnold Toynbee, St. John Philby, and Bertrand Russell and that their mission was to keep the Middle East backward so that its natural resource, oil, could continue to be looted. …

Dr. Coleman further writes that in 1980 the broadcasts of Radio Free Iran divided the enemies of the Shah into four categories:

1. Iranian politicians bought by the Israeli Shin Bet;
2. The CIA’s network of agents;
3. The feudal landowners;
4. The Freemasons and the Muslim Brotherhood (viewed as the same enemy).

The BBC Persian Service came to be nicknamed in Iran the “Ayatollah BBC” for its non-stop coverage of everything that Khomeini wanted to say. Soon a large segment of the Iranian public, most of them impressionable young students, became convinced that the Shah truly was evil and that a return to pure Shi’ite Islam under the Ayatollah’s leadership was the only way to save their country. The Carter Administration, manipulated by British lackey, Zbigniew Brzezinski, then collaborated with the British to topple the Shah and install Khomeini.

Dr. Coleman writes:

• It was the BBC, which prepared and distributed to the mullahs in Iran all of the cassette tapes of Khomeini’s speeches, which inflamed the peasants (much like Al-Jazeera during the Arab Spring). Then, the BBC began to beam accounts of torture by the Shah’s SAVAK to all corners of the world. In September and October 1978, the BBC began to beam Khomeini’s revolutionary ravings directly to Iran in Farsi. The Washington Post said, “the BBC is Iran’s public enemy number one.”

 

[kalu_miah]

The Rise of the Salafists
WAHHABISM AND SALAFISM | Facts and Details

 

[Cheetah786]

Forget these people. They can't even read the Quran properly and you try to influence them with it.
Are you Levant people only beautiful or are you intelligent also. I know many Arab's especially Palestinians who are doctors.

LOL how original coming from a Wahhabi,Who can't even read or understand it . Your judgement is based on one video that can be edited, mine is based on 1000s upon 1000 killed by Wahhabi terrorist around the worldKilling, to please Arab master . Even though prophet of Islam clearly said, Arabs are not superior , at the end of day they still treat you like toilet paper and you are too happy to kiss and clean their as.s.

 

[ghoul]

Mark my words, Saudi Arabia will suffer for its crimes. These ISIS type groups would get there sooner or later.

PS: I hope they'll enjoy their own Saudi citizens getting beheaded...

 

[KingMamba]

Would he recognize your Shia sect?

Lol so it begins.

There's no such thing as 'Wahabi' sect and Saudi sect is Sunni. Plain and simple.

Say Wallahi habibi and I will take your word for it.

 

[Cheetah786]

Calm down chief and slap you chest

Why are you ready to blow yourself up.