Saudi Naval Doctrine

[The SC]

The Saudi naval military doctrine is based on providing complete air cover for naval vessels..

The Saudi Navy consists of:

7 frigates + 4 new MMSC frigates from the US + option to purchase 4 additional
13 Corvettes and missile Boats + 5 Avante Corvettes from Spain + 3 missile Boats from France Returned from the Lebanese deal (It is believed that they were replaced by Gowing Corvettes)
2 support ships
3 Mine Control
200 interceptor boats
50 helicopters
4 Poseidon Maritime patrol

The Saudi maritime doctrine, and what distinguishes it, is the integrated air and maritime work .. The joint work system provides enormous and immediate missile capabilities that no country in the region can compete with..

By this it means that Saudi Arabia's warships do not fight alone during any sea battle, but rather there is always the presence of Saudi fighters that are able to reach any theater of operations thanks to the capabilities of refueling by air..

Saudi Arabia possesses 1,000 Harpoon and Sea-Eagle air-to-surface missiles..
Saudi Arabia contracted 400 Harpoon air-to-surface which gives it an impressive long arm in naval capabilities..

There is no navy in the region that is able to withstand 400 air-to-surface Harpoon missiles, as well as 600 surface-to-surface Harpoon missiles,.that is 1,000 anti- ship Harpoon missiles..

The Saudi Air Force equips a number of its fighters and prepares pilots for naval operations

The F15 fighter is capable of carrying 3 Harpoon missiles.

Here we see the Saudi F-15 carrying a Harpoon missiles:

The Air Force also has the Sea-Eagle anti-ship missiles on Tornado aircraft:

The Saudi Eastern Fleet alone, not counting the Western Fleet..Has an immediate missile force of 68 Harpoon missiles across 13 naval units, a small-sized and fast-maneuverable fleet..

4 units carry 8 Harpoon missiles each
9 units carry 4 Harpoon missiles each

Plus
24 torpedo
13 76mm cannon

Naval vessels are always accompanied by mine sweepers in every mission

During operations, Navy helicopters support naval units

Saudi Arabia has equipped about 10 Super Puma helicopters with missile capabilities..So a radar and electronic systems have been installed..armed with 20 Exocet anti-ship missiles for immediate use..

Dolphin helicopters are equipped with 4 AS-15TT anti-Ship missiles

It is also equipped with anti-submarine warfare capabilities via sonar and torpedoes

The Saudi Navy has strengthened its fleet now with 10 Romeo helicopters

Saudi Arabia has contracted about 40 boats and is seeking to increase the number to 60 boats

The Saudi Navy has also 150 interceptor boats of other types

 

[The SC]

Lurssen OPB 40

IPV-60

TNC 35

Two Saudi frigates accompanying a British frigate

AS565M Panther

And C-295 maritime patrol

 

[Yasser76]

When did Saudi order P-8 MPA? Lack of submarines is big problem amongst Gulf navies.

Also Saudi Frigates/Corvettes very rarely venture far from port. I think Naval domain is the one area GCC have happily given up to the US. Most GCC Navies are very small.

 

[Blacklight]

When did Saudi order P-8 MPA? Lack of submarines is big problem amongst Gulf navies.

Also Saudi Frigates/Corvettes very rarely venture far from port. I think Naval domain is the one area GCC have happily given up to the US. Most GCC Navies are very small.

Lack of Submarines? Persian Gulf's max avg. depth is 90m. Not enough depth / space to hide subs. In this depth range, sub-surface threats can easily be managed by Surface assets.

 

[burning_phoneix]

When did Saudi order P-8 MPA? Lack of submarines is big problem amongst Gulf navies.

Also Saudi Frigates/Corvettes very rarely venture far from port. I think Naval domain is the one area GCC have happily given up to the US. Most GCC Navies are very small.

The Red Sea and and Persian Gulf are very shallow. Red Sea in particular has many coral reefs and underwater features that make submarine operation difficult. There is no real reason for Gulf navies to expand to a blue water force, they are unlikely to make foreign expeditions abroad that require such a force.


As for the Navy, I would like to see the Badr class retired after the Avantes come online, they had good service but are a little long in tooth now.

Also, I'm not happy about the Poseidon purchase. It lakes a MAD broom that is essential for hunting down subs (one of the most important things as Iran has several) and they claim that other systems make a MAD unneeded but I'm not so sure. I had hoped the Navy and Airforce (that needs replacements for C-130 Hercules) would team up and hit two birds with one stone by getting the Kawasaki P-1 MPA and the Kawasaki C-2 Transport. Japan would be much more open to a ToT than the US and the aircraft are built on the same platform that can be used to help build up the nascent aviation industry here like the AN-132D was supposed to.

 

[Yasser76]

The Red Sea and and Persian Gulf are very shallow. Red Sea in particular has many coral reefs and underwater features that make submarine operation difficult. There is no real reason for Gulf navies to expand to a blue water force, they are unlikely to make foreign expeditions abroad that require such a force.


As for the Navy, I would like to see the Badr class retired after the Avantes come online, they had good service but are a little long in tooth now.

Also, I'm not happy about the Poseidon purchase. It lakes a MAD broom that is essential for hunting down subs (one of the most important things as Iran has several) and they claim that other systems make a MAD unneeded but I'm not so sure. I had hoped the Navy and Airforce (that needs replacements for C-130 Hercules) would team up and hit two birds with one stone by getting the Kawasaki P-1 MPA and the Kawasaki C-2 Transport. Japan would be much more open to a ToT than the US and the aircraft are built on the same platform that can be used to help build up the nascent aviation industry here like the AN-132D was supposed to.

Again, I cannot find any source for P-8 purchase.

As for Submarine operations, Iran seems to be able to do this as does Pakistan, both of whole operate in Persian Gulf.

 

[Blacklight]

Again, I cannot find any source for P-8 purchase.

Have you tried google?

As for Submarine operations, Iran seems to be able to do this as does Pakistan, both of whole operate in Persian Gulf.

Iran - ask NATO forces operating, what a joke that is.

Pakistan - Only courtesy visits, AOR is Arabian Sea and Indian Ocean.

 

[Philosopher]

Have you tried google?


Iran - ask NATO forces operating, what a joke that is.

Nato forces operate large submarines which are at a disadvantage in the relative shallow water of the Persian Gulf. Iran currently operates small to lower-mid size submarines which are perfectly suited for the Persian Gulf environment.

 

[Blacklight]

Nato forces operate large submarines which are at a disadvantage in the relative shallow water of the Persian Gulf. Iran currently operates small to lower-mid size submarines which are perfectly suited for the Persian Gulf environment.

Yes, and No.

Size wise, Yes you are right, unfortunately the tech involved (w.r.t. Iran) is well beyond obsolete. The lack of thermals also does not favor "anyone" who operates in those waters.

The lack of depth means, that even a decade old ASW eqpt., can prove to be quite effective.

 

[Gomig-21]

That's incredible. Never seen anything like that but it's understandable considering how customized the weaponizing of that Puma is. Good stuff.

 

[Philosopher]

unfortunately the tech involved (w.r.t. Iran) is well beyond obsolete.

Iran's newest submarine i.e the Fateh is a very capable submarine for its size. Current version utilises diesel, but the upcoming version will use AIP. There is much to say about Fateh, so I suggest you visit the relevant thread:

Iranian Navy | News and Discussions

https://en.mehrnews.com/news/142466/Fateh-submarine-to-join-Navy-in-coming-days-Cmdr-Khanzadi ‘Fateh’ submarine to join Navy in 'coming days': Cmdr. Khanzadi Commander of Iranian َArmy Navy Rear Admiral Hossein Khanzadi made the remark in an inaugration cermeony of a Navy hospital in Tehran on...

defence.pk

As for your claims regarding ASW warfare, like I already said, these relatively smaller submarines are perfect for the shallow waters of the Persian Gulf like region:

That is what concerns the U.S. Navy. Two things heighten the risk of a similar ambush by midget submarines against U.S. ships: the complex sonar picture of shallow water where these small subs can operate,

Is the U.S. Prepared to Face Midget Subs?

Don't let the funny, politically incorrect name fool you: Midget subs are a real threat. In the hands of North Korean and Iranian navies, these small vessels make good platforms for ambushesand the U.S. Navy is clearly ready to hone its anti-submari

www.popularmechanics.com

 

[Blacklight]

Iran's newest submarine i.e the Fateh is a very capable submarine for its size. Current version utilises diesel, but the upcoming version will use AIP. There is much to say about Fateh, so I suggest you visit the relevant thread:

Iranian Navy | News and Discussions

https://en.mehrnews.com/news/142466/Fateh-submarine-to-join-Navy-in-coming-days-Cmdr-Khanzadi ‘Fateh’ submarine to join Navy in 'coming days': Cmdr. Khanzadi Commander of Iranian َArmy Navy Rear Admiral Hossein Khanzadi made the remark in an inaugration cermeony of a Navy hospital in Tehran on...

defence.pk

As for your claims regarding ASW warfare, like I already said, these relatively smaller submarines are perfect for the shallow waters of the Persian Gulf like region:

Is the U.S. Prepared to Face Midget Subs?

Don't let the funny, politically incorrect name fool you: Midget subs are a real threat. In the hands of North Korean and Iranian navies, these small vessels make good platforms for ambushesand the U.S. Navy is clearly ready to hone its anti-submari

www.popularmechanics.com

Thank You for the links!

 

[Philosopher]

Thank You for the links!

No problem friend. I was going to write an article here on Iran's submarine capabilities a while back but I got quite busy. Iran's naval program is going under the radar compared to its missile, UAV, air defence etc programs but it is something that has great ambitions. Once you check out that Iranian naval thread, share your thoughts if you get the time.

 

[The SC]

The Red Sea and and Persian Gulf are very shallow. Red Sea in particular has many coral reefs and underwater features that make submarine operation difficult. There is no real reason for Gulf navies to expand to a blue water force, they are unlikely to make foreign expeditions abroad that require such a force.


As for the Navy, I would like to see the Badr class retired after the Avantes come online, they had good service but are a little long in tooth now.

Also, I'm not happy about the Poseidon purchase. It lakes a MAD broom that is essential for hunting down subs (one of the most important things as Iran has several) and they claim that other systems make a MAD unneeded but I'm not so sure. I had hoped the Navy and Airforce (that needs replacements for C-130 Hercules) would team up and hit two birds with one stone by getting the Kawasaki P-1 MPA and the Kawasaki C-2 Transport. Japan would be much more open to a ToT than the US and the aircraft are built on the same platform that can be used to help build up the nascent aviation industry here like the AN-132D was supposed to.

Subs are coming in a JV with France..
And the very potent P-8 is coming too..most likely 4 of them if not 6.. this was announced in the Mega deal with the US when Trump visited Saudi Arabia

 

[burning_phoneix]

Again, I cannot find any source for P-8 purchase.

As for Submarine operations, Iran seems to be able to do this as does Pakistan, both of whole operate in Persian Gulf.

It was reported to be part of the same deal for the four LCS vessels

Saudi's Poseidon adventure? | Times Aerospace

www.arabianaerospace.aero

As for your claims regarding ASW warfare, like I already said, these relatively smaller submarines are perfect for the shallow waters of the Persian Gulf like region:

The same reason these submarines are supposedly effective (Shallow waters making Sonar ineffective) are the same reason they are ineffective, shallow waters make passive sonar submarines use to find targets equally ineffective. The Persian Gulf has waters as shallow as 10-20 meters in nearly every location outside the strait of Hormuz. At that point the submarine becomes effectively a very slow missile boat.