Saudi-backed Wahhabis behind massacre of Shias in Pakistan

[somebozo]

Iran and Saudi Arabia both have their hands dirty, as far as their involvement in supporting some groups in our country

both entities' religious facilities should be banned....Zakat or Khoms is one thing; but Pakistan is not a place for those 2 children to duke it out by using religion for division and politics

we need to take this issue more seriously.....

both Tehran and Riyadh did limit their links to sectarianism in Pakistan over the past decade.

But unfortunately some extremist elements in Iran and Saudi Arabia continue to fund Shia and Sunni extremists in Pakistan. If this is stopped, we can identify other terrorists, acting as Sunni or Shia, who are feeding sectarianism on orders from unknown elements in Afghanistan, a country where multiple countries are operating with different agendas. The Indians have a history of meddling in sectarianism during the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan. [The Americans are known to have used sectarianism as a policy tool in Iraq. Also, Israel appears to have links to a group called Jundullah, created as a Sunni group to hound Iran.]

I think we should enforce a strong and secular Pakistani identity and grow some balls to take the protest at diplomatic level and international court if either country is caught funding proxies in Pakistan. We should expel their diplomats bring a resolution against them in United Nations.

 

[lem34]

Iran and Saudi Arabia both have their hands dirty, as far as their involvement in supporting some groups in our country

both entities' religious facilities should be banned....Zakat or Khoms is one thing; but Pakistan is not a place for those 2 children to duke it out by using religion for division and politics

we need to take this issue more seriously.....

both Tehran and Riyadh did limit their links to sectarianism in Pakistan over the past decade.

But unfortunately some extremist elements in Iran and Saudi Arabia continue to fund Shia and Sunni extremists in Pakistan. If this is stopped, we can identify other terrorists, acting as Sunni or Shia, who are feeding sectarianism on orders from unknown elements in Afghanistan, a country where multiple countries are operating with different agendas. The Indians have a history of meddling in sectarianism during the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan. [The Americans are known to have used sectarianism as a policy tool in Iraq. Also, Israel appears to have links to a group called Jundullah, created as a Sunni group to hound Iran.]

But would you agree that Sauds started it? They were scared that they may suffer similar fate to Shah of Iran and have always been trying to be sectarian whereas Iran did it as a response??

 

[somebozo]

But would you agree that Sauds started it? They were scared that they may suffer similar fate to Shah of Iran and have always been trying to be sectarian whereas Iran did it as a response??

Sectarism first emerged during the early 90's after total economic collapse of Saudi Arabia due to King Fahad own nepotism and despotism. It was a classic case of Najdis exporting their imperialism in the name of Islam.

 

[Armstrong]

But would you agree that Sauds started it? They were scared that they may suffer similar fate to Shah of Iran and have always been trying to be sectarian whereas Iran did it as a response??

Doesn't matter because I've met, both, some pretty nasty Shi'ites coming out of the Iranian Cultural Centres and some very racist Sunnis, in my short-life ! What matters is that things are indeed pretty messed up because of this ideological war that was fought by clerics from Saudi Arabia, Iran and most of all Pakistan ! And unless we put an end to it our already torn social-fabric would be in complete tatters !

 

[somebozo]

Doesn't matter because I've met, both, some pretty nasty Shi'ites coming out of the Iranian Cultural Centres and some very racist Sunnis, in my short-life ! What matters is that things are indeed pretty messed up because of this ideological war that was fought by clerics from Saudi Arabia, Iran and most of all Pakistan ! And unless we put an end to it our already torn social-fabric would be in complete tatters !

This is the weakness of our own government and spy agencies..instead of keeping neutrality they side with their fav factions. What we need to do is pass a bill that any mullah or ayatollah accepting foreign money or peddling foreign agenda will be tried under high treason and sentenced to lifetime imprisonment. You will see a lot of these goons going out of business very soon. Religion has become a tool of Najdi and Safvid imperialism. Both are equally nasty but we happen to see one as good and other as evil...

 

[lem34]

Sectarism first emerged during the early 90's after total economic collapse of Saudi Arabia due to King Fahad own nepotism and despotism. It was a classic case of Najdis exporting their imperialism in the name of Islam.

whoever started it we must end it and punish any sectarianism or take appropriate action against anyone advocating this evil

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

But would you agree that Sauds started it? They were scared that they may suffer similar fate to Shah of Iran and have always been trying to be sectarian whereas Iran did it as a response??

the 1979 revolution in Iran changed a lot of things, as did the subsequent anti-soviet Jihad efforts

 

[somebozo]

whoever started it we must end it and punish any sectarianism or take appropriate action against anyone advocating this evil

the idiot who has the power to change the destiny of Pakistan unfortunately was misguided by the same mullahs and ayatollahs who supported his rise to power and soon the power faction broke into two..Shia and Sunni...with Zia siding with the Sunnis and turning a blind eye to their activities which soon turned bloody between two rivals. Again our own fault..we are a multi-culture, multi-ethinic and multi-theology nation hence we need to adapt strict secularism...

The Sunnis had the backing of state and free flow of weapon from Afghan Jihad..the Shia found support from new Khomenist Iran urging export of revolution...it was a classic case of drilling in the plate one eats from. Until we continue to indoctrinate our students with falsified history which does not connect them to this land but some super-nation concepts out of thin air it will be very difficult to build a patriotic nation which can think of their land they live on before picking a gun against their country men....our education system is a constant brain wash of Islamic ideals with inflated personalities in far far away lands once a upon a time..

 

[Armstrong]

This is the weakness of our own government and spy agencies..instead of keeping neutrality they side with their fav factions. What we need to do is pass a bill that any mullah or ayatollah accepting foreign money or peddling foreign agenda will be tried under high treason and sentenced to lifetime imprisonment. You will see a lot of these goons going out of business very soon. Religion has become a tool of Najdi and Safvid imperialism. Both are equally nasty but we happen to see one as good and other as evil...

I don't agree because in the state that Pakistan finds herself in where the Mullah enjoys a vastly greater following then some of our better 'intellectuals' such an 'aggressive' move, though one I'd agree with, will call for a terrible backlash ! So..no lets go for something more expedient and much more subtle; perhaps introducing something in the curriculum of our schools that ebbs away at Sectarianism in our society gradually over a 15-20 year period ! In the meantime let us, in the words of one of my favourite Scholars - Mr.Ghamidi, introduce compulsory 12 year schooling in some of the more wordily sciences and humanities for any Madrassa and anyone who'd like to take an admission in that Madrassa ! Perhaps even sell that to the Mullahs and bring them on board by being pretty smart (and misleading) about it !

 

[Black Widow]

though its your internal matter i should not poke my nose,

but i will say just this "if your house is dirty, insects from outside come inside, better to clean the house before blaming others.


Bring democracy and secularism (at leastfor Muslims) stop appreciating terrorists, stop glorify them. be progressive, half of the problem will solved.


if you make Islamic republic, the question will be, Is it shia republic or sunni republic, is it shia khalifa or sunni khalifa.

just 2 cents.

 

[Armstrong]

though its your internal matter i should not poke my nose,

but i will say just this "if your house is dirty, insects from outside come inside, better to clean the house before blaming others.


Bring democracy and secularism (at leastfor Muslims) stop appreciating terrorists, stop glorify them. be progressive, half of the problem will solved.


if you make Islamic republic, the question will be, Is it shia republic or sunni republic, is it shia khalifa or sunni khalifa.

just 2 cents.

I suggest you grab a copy of Iqbal's 'Reconstruction of Religious Thought in Islam'; its freely available on the Internet, in fact if you google on to the 'Iqbal Academy''s site...they actually have a free-downloadable version of it. Try going through the Chapter that explains his views on what a Modern Muslim State ought to be...it'll help answer many Questions !

Though, I'm sure you'd still like a brief summary and so in a nut-shell this is what he proposed : Since the arrival of the Modern Nation State and consequently the concept of Nationalism, significantly changed the dynamics in which the Muslim thought process had made propositions in the past. And so in the light of those changing dynamics so must our understanding of Islam evolve; the Hindu or the Sikh of yesterday was a dhimmi who could never own up to a Muslim Monarchy and vice versa for a Muslim, but since the creation of a Nation-State based around a common ethnicity, history, views or linguistics...we have the chance to create something that both a Muslim and Non-Muslim can own up to ! So the dynamics have changed...loyalty to ones religion to the point of fighting another has given way to loyalty to a common Homeland...lets change our perceptions along with that ! His proposition thus was a completely democratic state where the Muslims will have the chance to engage in Ijtihad (or consensus to form a legal opinion) to reconstruct Islamic thought or reinterpret the age old Fatwas in the light of modernity and the vastly evolved world that we found ourselves in; except let that Ijtihad be conducted by the Parliament of the Muslims where the Sunnis, the Shi'ites and some of the traditionally thought of as 'deviant sects' can get together and reach a consensus ! The idea was that just as there is a fierce debate in the Parliament on any matter of a Secular nature and the Parliamentarians and the People by extension are left a much more informed audience who vote for or against any proposition displaying not only the Popular Will but their Collective Wisdom....let the religious reformation needed also be done by the same forum where all our represented instead of individual Mullahs who fuel Sectarianism in the Public...in short - an organized religion like Islam needs some regulation by the Government and instead of relegating that to the Mullahs on their self-styled divine missions give that power to the elected representatives of the People and by extension the People so that a much more tempered audience can reach a consensus after due deliberations and give and take and so that the People (or at least the majority) because of 'the consensus' can own up to it !

 

[Edevelop]

Why can't Wahabbis (Saudis) keep their mess in their own country???