Saudi Arabia still offers lot of opportunities for Indians

[Mugwop]

Saudi Arabia continues to be a land of opportunity for Indians. Indians have benefited the most from the amnesty scheme as 1.4 million people got their residency and work status legalised," says Faiz Ahmad Kidwai, Consul-General of India, Jeddah, Saudi Arabia.

In every adversity, there is an opportunity. Saudi Arabia’s Nitaqat labour and migration reform has led to the deportation of lakhs of illegal migrant workers, but for a sizeable majority this scheme came as a blessing as they used the grace period of six months get their work status legalised.

The amnesty scheme provided a window of opportunity for around 1.4 million Indian migrants who earlier did not have a legal status to work in Saudi Arabia, but now have got their residency and work status legalised during the amnesty period.

Lakhs of expatriates on illegal visas had to be deported as a part of implementing this law. Indians, who form the largest expatriate population in Saudi were amongst the worst hit.

The Nitaqat law introduced by the Saudi Labour Ministry in 2011, makes it mandatory for all private firms to recruit a minimum of 10 per cent Saudi nationals in the private sector companies.

However, the Saudi government has targeted only illegal workers and people on valid visas are welcome to the country. Officials admit that tracking down illegal recruiting agencies and human resource agents remains a huge challenge.

“The middlemen and agents dupe a lot of workers. Strict measures must be taken to weed out such agents,’’ says Faiz Ahmad Kidwai.

The good news is that among all expats, Indians are much preferred for jobs in Saudi Arabia. This move will curb illegal agents who make a quick buck by duping thousands of migrants looking for better opportunities abroad.

India’s Consul General in Jeddah, Faiz Ahmad Kidwai shares his views on Saudi's controversial Nitaqat law and the state of illegal workers in Saudi Arabia.

How is the situation in Saudi Arabia now for Indian workers?

The situation is normal now. The deadline for the amnesty scheme for workers ended November 3. The process of evicting illegal immigrants is still going on but there are hardly any Indians with invalid visas. There are people of other nationalities on illegal visas still in the country.

So the process is on to deport illegal migrants. Indians benefited the most from the amnesty scheme that ended on 3 November as 1.4 million people got their residency and work status legalised.

While 4 lakh people managed to get their job statuses changed, 3 lakh workers managed to get residency permit during the amnesty period and 2.5 lakh workers got the liberty to change their job category.

Why was the nitaqat law mooted in Saudi Arabia?

The basic problem in the Gulf region is unemployment. With a large population of youth unemployed, the government had to take measures to get these young youth employed. There are about 90% expatriates in the private sector.

The government aims to increase this number to 20-25% to solve the unemployment crisis.

The government has graded companies on the basis of local recruitment into blue, green, yellow and red groups. The companies which comply with recruiting most Saudi locals will receive more advantages compared to others.

How did the government crack down in illegal migrants? Will the Saudi/Indian government crack down on these agents instead of just targeting poor immigrants?

After the amnesty was over, officials from the labour, passport departments and police checked documents of people at offices, residences and even public places. They checked visas and residency permit. Those who violated were arrested and if they had no crime record and they were sent to the deportation centres.

The government has not taken any measure to crack down on agents. However, by giving an amnesty period, many workers could get a correction of procedures, like change the sponsor, get the jobs certified or if a worker who is actually an accountant was documented as a driver, he could have it changed.

The middlemen and agents dupe a lot of workers. Strict measures must be taken to weed out such agents. People must take care not to fall in their traps.

What will be the future labour policy of Saudi Arabia. How are the working conditions of people in Saudi Arabia?

Despite the deportation of workers, Saudi Arabia still offers a good opportunity for workers. Indian workers are preferred in Saudi as they work hard and are law abiding citizens.
The working conditions at some places are good while it is bad at some places. We do get complaints but that is from just 3-4% of the workers who live here.

How many Indians work in Saudi Arabia? How many Indians have been deported?

Indians account for the highest expatriate population in Saudi Arabia. The country has 2.75 millions Indians. Around 1.7 lakh Indian workers got deported. However, they can go back to Saudi Arabia on legal visas.

What kind of measures are the Indian government officials taking for the proper rehabilitation of these workers?

The state governments of Kerala and Andhra Pradesh have been very proactive in rehabilitating the workers. The Kerala government has registered the workers who have returned from Saudi Arabia. They are offered jobs or given loans for self employment.

Did illegal migrants put up resistance or feign ignorance of the law? Were there instances of violence against the Nitaqat law?

Many workers volunteered to show their documents. People do understand the laws and the benefits of abiding by rules. So it was much easier for Indians. There were some minor instances but they were not related to illegal visas.

Were there illegal women immigrants like domestic helps who were also deported?

There were families who were staying illegally. People who come to Umrah/Haj visas have overstayed here illegally for years. Over a period, they also had children without any legal documents they faced uncertain times. So all of them were forced to return to India. But there weren’t many women workers from India.

What would be your advice to migrants who is looking for work in Saudi Arabia?

Saudi Arabia still has many opportunities for workers. The deportation too has created many job vacancies so Indians are welcome here. The drive is only against illegal workers.
Workers should make sure they go through the right channel. Many believe that there is a free visa. The free visa is a misnomer. The workers must ensure that the visa they get is from a correct employer for a specific job.

What is the current economic scenario and job prospects in Saudi Arabia?

The economic situation is good. They are many job prospects for locals and expats. With many illegal workers gone, there are many opportunities open up especially in the construction and infrastructure sectors. However, the big challenge for people is to come with proper visas.

What are the measures that the Saudi government is initiating to stem this discontent amongst locals, in terms bringing providing locals more jobs across spectrum?

The Saudi government welcomes expats. Their concern is lack of jobs of their own local people. Their concern is genuine. The local population belongs to this place, they needs jobs too. They are not demanding a huge reservation of jobs for locals. The government seeks to reserve jobs for about 20-25 per cent of locals.
'Saudi Arabia still offers lot of opportunities for Indians' - Rediff.com Business

 

[al-Hasani]

The regime should prioritize offering job opportunities for locals and the country as a whole on a much bigger scale than has been done for ages. Plenty of youngsters without jobs. But obviously easier importing cheap labour. Or keeping some retarded 20-year old laws alien to everything but now hailed as "part of the heritage" (LOL), large parts of the entire system intact etc. is more important to please deranged psychopaths who in their mental state do not realize that they are hurting everything that they claim to hold dear. As they don't know better. Or at least every living organism can only hope so.

Can we not "hire" Merkel for a few years? Pleeaseee! Anyone? She would turn KSA into a super heavyweight in a decade. Enough of wasted potential and retardness. We are talking about one of the most resource rich countries on the planet. Thinking where we could have been if things were done correctly is something that could give the most optimistic person a life-long depression. FFS.

The leadership does not deserve that anyway it seems. Because only fools make so little out of so much potential. The only hope is my generation (early 20's) and the younger ones and those that will follow when we are long gone and buried.

But that's probably asking for far too much as well.

No, Western Europe it will be and remain for a long time to come. Not everyone is privileged enough to have both their feet in both camps though. Sometimes I pity them.

​

I am a angry and disappointed because at one hand I know that we (GCC) are a very privileged part of the world overall on many fronts but on the other hand I see a lot of wasted potential and a lot of self-harm (that is passed of as unintentional to my great annoyance), retarded behavior etc. which is very sad.

It goes for the entire Arab world actually. Once the center of the world for millenniums as the cradle of civilization and now largely a former shadow of its great past. It's baffling how low you can fall from great heights. But that's the cycle of life.

 

[Gufi]

The regime should prioritize offering job opportunities for locals and the country as a whole on a much bigger scale than has been done for ages.

There i totally agree with you that Saudiazation of jobs should be a priority, BUT the nationals should be qualified. In many government departments one sees unqualified Saudis. The change needs to be gradual and there should be no ego in regards to work

 

[al-Hasani]

There i totally agree with you that Saudiazation of jobs should be a priority, BUT the nationals should be qualified. In many government departments one sees unqualified Saudis. The change needs to be gradual and there should be no ego in regards to work

The reason why for instance some women (not so much the current generation which is more educated than their male counterparts) are not qualified is totally the regimes very own doing. Due to the retarded laws that THEY put in place to hinder the women from REGAINING their historical position in Arabian society. Due to all the other nonsense that prevents what they are now busy correcting from happening. It's because people have been pampered to such a big extent that some of them don't even bother making tea without calling their Filipino or other foreign maid. I am obviously overreacting here but trying to get a point across.
They think that they can live like that forever. Well, they will for a very long time but it will have an end one day. Also we don't need all that foreign labor to this extent. Not at all. Foreigners should be welcome due to KSA's history of a region between Europe, Africa, Asia engulfed in ancient trade and mutual influences and especially due to being the cradle of Islam. But we should attract the best qualified people mainly. As most responsible states do. Excluding war refugees etc. With all due respect then it's not our responsibility to cater for poor foreigners as much as we want to help them get a better life. It's the responsibility of Pakistan, Indonesia, India, Bangladesh, Somalia, Ethiopia, Egypt, Yemen etc. to serve their people just like it is the responsibility for our regime to cater for the people.

All those manual jobs could be held by locals. But a change in mentality must happen.

People not paying tax at all in the GCC is not foreseeable either. It's totally unheard of elsewhere in the world.

 

[Gufi]

All those manual jobs could be held by locals. But a change in mentality must happen.

I do not normally use smileys but this is perfectly stated.

 

[al-Hasani]

I do not normally use smileys but this is perfectly stated.

Yes, which is the responsibility of the regime to help with which they also have started doing. It's just too slow and too late for my liking. It's like everyone is trying to please everyone and not go too far on any issue which creates somewhat of a vacuum.

Just 60 years ago locals were proudly farmers, fishermen, carpenters (very talented - just look at the rich traditional crafts, architecture etc.) but nowadays many won't touch those jobs. In fact not because they are necessarily against those jobs but because RECENT trends have created a stigma sourrending them. Women must take equal part in the workforce for instance which is far from being the case. Economically speaking in KSA you have almost 50% of the population (again I am vastly overreacting to prove a point) that is not contributing to the economy in terms of workforce. Imagine if the same was similar with the US for instance? Large pats of their revenues would shrink dramatically. That's what I mean with self-harm.

Same with the taxation issue in KSA. Other similar G-20 Major Economies Member States (in fact ALL of them) receive huge profits due to taxation from their people. In KSA only mostly foreign firms and local firms (corporation taxes).

Another example of self-harm that not only harms the society but the economy too. Are they planning to implement taxes suddenly one night? That would create unrest.

 

[Audio]

All those manual jobs could be held by locals. But a change in mentality must happen.

Change in mentality is connected to the gratuitous welfare model, which is connected with buying social stability which is connected to the way where power sits in KSA. Royalty, clergy and i forgot the third component.

The king can be as progressive as kings come, but if he has to go seek advice to old men who recite verses by heart and are deeply entrenched in dogma's...

 

[al-Hasani]

Change in mentality is connected to the gratuitous welfare model, which is connected with buying social stability which is connected to the way where power sits in KSA. Royalty, clergy and i forgot the third component.
The king can be as progressive as kings come, but if he has to go seek advice to old men who recite verses by heart and are deeply entrenched in dogma's...

Bingo!



No bad words about clerics overall (only the retards) but they have way too much influence for my liking.

Hence the self-harm and lack of foresight although it has to be said that this is slowly changing. At last! People like to compare the various GCC states but KSA is in a totally different situation and has a much bigger potential than the smaller GCC states which will always be hampered by their size and population numbers (at least in the foreseeable future) but I am sure that none of them are complaining. You won't find many states of a similar size and population living in such rich countries. KSA cannot be a Qatar (highest GDP per capita in the world) but can be at the top for a long time to come and stay there if certain issues are tackled rightly. In any case the GCC faces similar problems and struggles and should and will approach them jointly.

 

[al-Hasani]

@Gufi

Tell me brother why do those talented Saudi Arabian women (on al international level) below need to succeed abroad but can't back home?

1 million views. If outsiders can spot that peculiar detail and wonder why that is then the natives should ask themselves this question morning and night. Every single day. Until changes arrive. In KSA women cannot even drive due to a law made in 1990 and some "clerics" say it's bound in culture. What 24 year old culture? Bunch of nonsense. I cringe while writing this…..1400 years ago famous women of Islam were on the battlefields from what is now KSA and in ancient pre-Islamic times (several millennium ago) you had Arab/Semitic queens ruling areas in what is now KSA. Baffling, shocking, retarded and embarrassing.

 

[Ahmed Jo]

Bingo!



No bad words about clerics overall (only the retards) but they have way too much influence for my liking.

Hence the self-harm and lack of foresight although it has to be said that this is slowly changing. At last! People like to compare the various GCC states but KSA is in a totally different situation and has a much bigger potential than the smaller GCC states which will always be hampered by their size and population numbers (at least in the foreseeable future) but I am sure that none of them are complaining. You won't find many states of a similar size and population living in such rich countries. KSA cannot be a Qatar (highest GDP per capita in the world) but can be at the top for a long time to come and stay there if certain issues are tackled rightly. In any case the GCC faces similar problems and struggles and should and will approach them jointly.

@Gufi

Tell me brother why do those talented Saudi Arabian women (on al international level) below need to succeed abroad but can't back home?

Those retarded laws you mentioned earlier were put in place several decades ago in order to combat the socialist wave of arab nationalism. I think the religious elite in Saudi back then had the same level of influence that the Jordanian tribes had (and still have). So while the Jordanian regime relied on the tribes to weather through the nationalist storm, the Saudi regime was forced to rely on the religious elite and comply with their wishes to some extent in return for using their influence to combat the threat posed by Gamal Abdul Nasser and his allies. This is just me speculating, of course. If I got anything wrong, please correct me. As for why there laws are still in place, I think the regime's thinking is 'why risk jeopardizig the delicate balance currently in place?' Like I said though, I'm just speculating here.

 

[al-Hasani]

Those retarded laws you mentioned earlier were put in place several decades ago in order to combat the socialist wave of arab nationalism. I think the religious elite in Saudi back then had the same level of influence that the Jordanian tribes had (and still have). So while the Jordanian regime relied on the tribes to weather through the nationalist storm, the Saudi regime was forced to rely on the religious elite and comply with their wishes to some extent in return for using their influence to combat the threat posed by Gamal Abdul Nasser and his allies. This is just me speculating, of course. If I got anything wrong, please correct me. As for why there laws are still in place, I think the regime's thinking is 'why risk jeopardizig the delicate balance currently in place?' Like I said though, I'm just speculating here.

Well, bro you were pretty much spot on. Just a few lose ends here and there, regional and international influences etc. Thankfully in my little naive world I still believe that those few "retarded laws" (as I call them) are on loan and not foreseeable on the long run. On many fronts the GCC is moving in the right directions and the region is one of the few lights in a otherwise dark region (currently) although issues such as social and political rights always get the headlines. Sometimes rightly sometimes not.

If "just" 3 things changed the aftereffects would be huge (in a positive way).

1) More social rights (read women rights mainly and a few other issues)

2) More political rights (preferably a constitutional monarchy and a real parliament (Shoura), real elections and more inclusiveness in the decision making from the average Joe. All interconnected issues.

3) Greater industrialization (ongoing - see the dozens of industrial cities on a world scale, enormous investments on agriculture, education - see KAUST) which would again lead to more scientific output, diversification, more effective production of the workforce etc. and with this certain laws that are harmful for the economic growth would automatically change due to the realities of the society.

UAE for instance have improved on all 3 points and even succeeded on some of them to a great deal. No reason why this cannot happen as the people of UAE are almost identical to our lot in the Eastern Province and beyond. So once again, like everywhere else, it's the system that needs change or at least major adjustments on some fronts.

 

[Ahmed Jo]

Well, bro you were pretty much spot on. Just a few lose ends here and there, regional and international influences etc. Thankfully in my little naive world I still believe that those few "retarded laws" (as I call them) are on loan and not foreseeable on the long run. On many fronts the GCC is moving in the right directions and the region is one of the few lights in a otherwise dark region (currently) although issues such as social and political rights always get the headlines. Sometimes rightly sometimes not.

If "just" 3 things changed the aftereffects would be huge (in a positive way).

1) More social rights (read women rights mainly and a few other issues)

2) More political rights (preferably a constitutional monarchy and a real parliament (Shoura), real elections and more inclusiveness in the decision making from the average Joe. All interconnected issues.

3) Greater industrialization (ongoing - see the dozens of industrial cities on a world scale, enormous investments on agriculture, education - see KAUST) which would again lead to more scientific output, diversification, more effective production of the workforce etc. and with this certain laws that are harmful for the economic growth would automatically change due to the realities of the society.

UAE for instance have improved on all 3 points and even succeeded on some of them to a great deal. No reason why this cannot happen as the people of UAE are almost identical to our lot in the Eastern Province and beyond. So once again, like everywhere else, it's the system that needs change or at least major adjustments on some fronts.

The UAE would be a great model to follow for Saudi Arabia and other countries as well. They have sound leadership and great management of their resources. I don't think your view is completely naive and I'm sure it's shared by many other Saudis. Maybe saudi officials will recognize that the current way cannot last forever and will subsequently adapt with the challenges ahead.

 

[al-Hasani]

The UAE would be a great model to follow for Saudi Arabia and other countries as well. They have sound leadership and great management of their resources. I don't think your view is completely naive and I'm sure it's shared by many other Saudis. Maybe saudi officials will recognize that the current way cannot last forever and will subsequently adapt with the challenges ahead.

Apologies for the late reply. The books were calling.

Well the UAE Is great and all but should also move towards a even more inclusive system. Real parliament and a constitutional monarchy. That's the way forward on the long run.

Yet I have also heard people (even people of ME backgrounds in the West) telling me that democracy is a failed project in that part of the world. I sometimes feel that they are partially right but on the other hand Western Europe faced even much more oppressive dictators once but came out stronger.

I can assure you that my views on nationality, Arab and Muslim cooperation (although not blind), cooperation, value of ancient culture, traditions, heritage, yet also a modern viewpoint and all the other things I have spoken about is popular and gaining more popularity for each day. In fact I would say that the vast majority agree but they are afraid to question the establishment because we know what happens if you criticize those in power in the ME. Some way you are going to pay for it or your family. Directly or indirectly.

The problem is that there are extreme positions. Even on this forum (talking about all users in general) you have either extreme nationalists, Islamists, extreme atheists etc. Same in KSA and the majority is caught between all of those groups that are battling for "the truth".
I consider all of them annoying and don't agree with them. A sane middle ground is to be found and certain people should not hijack religion and tell what is right and wrong. I will never accept some state cleric telling me and my people that some 24 year old nonsense law is part of "our" culture. As I already explained in post 9 in this very thread. Mine you for telling that I would be labelled as a "traitor" by some sheep. Can you imagine that?

The conclusion is that Hashemite rule should be reinstalled in KSA.

Cheers.

Another quick thing @Ahmed Jo.

I tell you another thing. I am a practicing Muslim with my own opinions on that. I recognize that KSA is a special case in the Muslim world for being the cradle of Islam. I respect and understand that our society is mostly conservative and I am perfectly fine with that. What I do not like though is that some sectors in our society think that they have a monopoly on religion.

In my view people should be taught about Islam in a much more diverse way. Let me give you an example. Before KSA was created back in 1932 in Makkah in the Masjid Al-Haram you had 4 different madahib that were taught. Hanafi, Maliki, Shafi'i and Hanbali. Now the state is teaching you Hanbali fiqh. I would personally like if the Grand Mufti of KSA for instance was drafted from those 4 madahib. Our Shia (Twelver, Ismaili and the small minority of Zaydis) have their own spiritual leaders already.

If you want to put a label on me then I follow the Shafi'i fiqh as you already know which most Makkawi Hashemites do.

KSA is the only Muslim country on the planet were you have almost every single Sunni and Shia sect that can be found indigenously. That diversity should be embraced and celebrated. After all, it's all Islam although I do not agree with the Shia school of thought for instance on a lot of fronts but if some other compatriots do then what am I going to do about it?

That's my opinion at least and if others believe otherwise then fair enough. It's their choice.

 

[Gufi]

n KSA women cannot even drive due to a law made in 1990 and some "clerics" say it's bound in culture. What 24 year old culture?

Saudi needs to change some laws. I think the grand mufti said that there is no problem with females driving. The problem s with the people. The people need to change their thinking in regards to females as well as many other things. Only then will the change come in Saudi, as the monarchy there is tapped in with what the common man thinks.

 

[al-Hasani]

Saudi needs to change some laws. I think the grand mufti said that there is no problem with females driving. The problem s with the people. The people need to change their thinking in regards to females as well as many other things. Only then will the change come in Saudi, as the monarchy there is tapped in with what the common man thinks.

I have a slightly different theory. Let's use this retarded law that was passed in 1990 as an example. Before that there was no problem. Women were driving. Many of the laws and recent customs are alien to our long and proud culture and customs.

Those that support this law have been indoctrinated to support it. Just like other laws. In their mind if you do not support such laws you are a "traitor" or even worse an "anti-Muslim". What to do then? Your credibility is zero. Your augments non-existing. This is wrong and must be pointed out.

Also the people that follow the government blindly. Most do because this has been installed in them. If you speak out too much you will get in jail. If you do this and that the Mutawa will come after you. Many people live in a state of paranoia without knowing it. Forgetting about their past. That's not healthy for the society.

I suggest that you take a look at photos from women in Hijaz 100 years ago. Hell even longer back. Everything will be clear in very few seconds.

That's not to say that there is no conservatism (there is and as a conservative person myself I support conservatism but the right and healthy one). Would be pure nonsense if I claimed so. But not the newly invented one.

I am not going to talk about the influence of Najd on other areas of KSA (which is a very diverse country at the end of the day) as it's controversial and should better be discussed among compatriots but part of the problem is connected to this.