S-2 - Options for the Pakistan Navy

[Penguin]

i should have mentioned that this is for 'serious readers' only

I guess so ;-)
Luckily, I don't qualify ....

 

[abaseen99]

MONDAY, MAY 23, 2011
Whole Sale Defence Deals: Pakistan And China

Pakistan has looked towards its traditional ally after being bashed by the United States for its defense needs in 1965 and Pak-China defense & economic relationship never looked back. Current visit of the Pakistani Minister was a great success by all means as Pakistan was able to not only pursue China to stand by it in these difficult times but also agreed on number of pending defense deals.

Gawadar Port:

China has agreed to take over the operations of Gawadar Port in Pakistan at the request of the federal government after the

agreement with the Singapore Port Authority expires. Pakistani Defense Minister, Chaudhry Ahmad Mukhtar has announced in front of local media that Pakistan asked for Chinese in number of fields and China was immediately ready to help Pakistan in any way possible.

Type 054A Jiangkai-II Stealth Frigateakistani Defense Minister, Chaudhry Ahmad Mukhtar has said that China has also agreed to provide loan for the purchase of the Chinese 4400 ton frigate. This agreement will clear the financial problems of the Pakistan Navy and it will be able to purchase new generation stealth Type 054A Jiangkai II Multi-Role frigate which is equipped with the HQ-16 Medium-Range Air Defence Missiles.

Chinese HQ-16 Surface to Air missile have range of over 50 kilometers launched from 32 vertical launch system (VLS) and is far more superior then the FM-90N surface-to-air missile (SAM) used on the F-22P Zulfiquar class frigate. Frigate will also use 8 C-802A or C-803 antiship missiles which have range in excess of 180km. Type 054A Jiangkai II frigate is designed with stealth features, including sloped hull design, radar.

 

[muse]

I have read the article twice, but I am still not hundred per cent certain that the author is advocating purchase of SSBN. After making his case, all the author has to say is that Pakistan has to make hard choices. Suppose the poor guy didn’t want to upset PN brass and thus stopped short of out and out recommendation.

Niaz

Niaz Sahab, I refer you to the quote below, in particular the notion of proportionality:

Deterrence is not a passive concept; it must be stepped up in proportion to an adversary’s increases in arsenal or delivery means. For reasons all too well known, Pakistan’s principal security perceptions will remain India-centric. To keep deterrence credible, the indispensability of continuously bolstering Pakistan’s nuclear assets, including delivery means, cannot be overstressed.

Pakistan’s strategic community and Beijing could plan the training and subsequent lease of a nuclear-powered submarine.The PLAN’s Xia submarine could be an appropriate start.A pool of selected PakistanNavy officers could be trained to operate an SSBN, with theoretical / academic work ashore followed by operational training at sea and finally a strategic deployment.Though such a plan seems ambitious and the PLA Navy’s SSBNs rarely prowl far, this remains a viable choice that would serve the two countries well strategically.

 

[MastanKhan]

He just got this article printed because there is a senior naval rank in front of his name---other than that----very basic and general information----copied from all other source---a waste

 

[abaseen99]

Submarines:

Pakistan and China has also agreed to provide training to the personal of the Pakistan Navy on the Chinese submarines. Pakistani and China has already agreed earlier this year to jointly development and co-production of diesel electric submarines fitted with the Air Independent Propulsion to meet Pakistan Navy’s long standing requirement of six new generation of submarines.

Unconfirmed news from Indian sources also suggest that Pakistan and China has also discussed the possibility of leasing a Chinese nuclear powered attack submarine SSN to Pakistan Navy for limited time period.

Pakistan Navy has shown interest in leasing of SSN after the Indian leasing of SSN from Russia and construction of nuclear powered submarine armed with submarine launched ballistic missiles with Russian help.Chinese Military News Blog

 

[fatman17]

IMHO as disucssed in the article the SLCM/SLBM armed subs. would not be under the command of Navy but NCA. Where does that leaves the navy? It has to afterall provision for its safety through active deployment of hunter/killer groups ahead of the so called "Boomer." This requires considerable redeployment of undersea assets and redefinig of the basic mission of the navy while undertaking the traditional sea denial role.

if they are nuclear otherwise not.

 

[Aamir Hussain]

In the US, during the cold war, the boomer force was strictly under the operational command of USN. Operational deployment was done according to an agreed strategy between the all the armed forces chiefs and the civilian leadership governing deployment of nuclear capable platforms and response/preemptive strategic strikes.

The Navy was free to decide the Patrol Areas of their subs including boomers etc. as long as the base line requirement as laid out in the TOR agreed between CJCS & Service chiefs on Nuclear Strike Capability was achieved.

However, once EMERGCON/DEFCON 1 is reached, the President in consultation with JC's and NSA (after studying the evidence including hard evidence of launches and trajectory inputs etc.) directs the release of retaliatory strikes (Basically a Launch on Warning LoW strike) communicated through the VLF network by the National Command Authority prior to enemy weapons impact to the boomer force directly. This requires about 25 minutes from the first Intel of launch of strategic nuclear strike by the enemy. Btw, US (Air force only) went to DEFOCN 2 level once during the Cuban Missile Crisis.

This system has been change including the use of VLF comm. and an RLOAD (Retaliatory Launch Only After Detonation system is being studied besides many others to reduce the risk of accidental/faulty launch authorization.

However, for Pakistan, there are not 25 minutes!!!! Our is a slightly more complex issue. However, IMHO the command and deployment should remain with navy based upon strict TOR’s agreed before hand for those platforms that have Strategic Nuclear Strike capability.

 

[MastanKhan]

Mr Hussein,

Ours is an extremely issue----with no time warning between launches and impact----we are dead meat right from gitgo----many of our launches will not even have a reaction from either side until and after the detonation----.

There is no oppurtunity for sane heads to prevail in our case once the decision is made and the button is pushed-----.

 

[Aamir Hussain]

Khan Sahib:

As things stand today, you are right. However, we need to improve the launch capability and the safety and security of our so called strategic assets. We have them and now we need to take care of them before they take care of us for good!!!

Part of detente is the strategic second strike capability based upon a SLBM/SLCM type of platform-- that in theory would have the time required to launch a retaliatory strike. In my opinion the challenges would be:

1. No VLF order for launch-- as all command and control structures would have been wiped off within ten minutes (or less) of launch of nuclear strike by India.
2. Need for Standing orders for nuclear strike launch when:
All types of communications have been lost with the mainland --sans equipment failure. This is compounded by the fact that the sub needs t oremain in passive listening mode to remain hidden.
Visual and intelligence input from other sources confirm annihilation of the significant population base of motherland.
Enemy intercepts confirming launch and detonation of nuclear strike.
Third country intercepts confirming annihilation of major population centers of Pakistan.

Of course, as abundantly apparent from the above narrative/options the inherent dangers that lie within such a protocol and the criticality of the Captain of the boat and his/her final judgment in ordering or not ordering a launch.