RUSSIA starts work on second 5th generation fighter.

[Moscow]

To Moscow.

I did not say that AFL 41 does not exist OR that IBRIS AESA radar does not exist.

Wat i said was that they will not fly with the tech demonstrator...because they are not ready for induction onto the plane. WHEN IT FLYS IN 2009-2010.

With regards to TOT for india i think the FORUM members know if you part with $10 billion dollars of your money in development of this fighter then you will certainly get some TOT and rights to manufactutre upgrade and use wat ever western add ons that IAF forsees it needs......

I am not belittling it. PAK FA FGFA will be better than Typhoon & rafael and match for JSF at its worst.......

Its a great opportunity for india to be involved at such depth.

BUT ITS A DECADE AWAY BEFORE IT FLYS IN IAF COMBAT COLOURS

now sir this is a more logical way of putting things.
i now understand what you are tryin to say
yes its a long time off from real induction but we will get the single seat russian version earlier than the indians.
now if you want an update on the tech demonstrator visit the link i posted i quoted the no of prototypes the possible date of flight tsts and also structural tests are on.

as for the radar and engine they are tried and tested on different platforms. the radar on mig35 and su-35,
also russia is trying to develop an antistealth radar for which i also posted somelinks on this section.

i am sure it will be no earlier than 2015-2017 when we will see a real pakfa fly.

thanx for clarifying.

 

[indiatech]

Russian Fifth Generation Fighter PAK-FA First Test Flight in 2009

Insists Sergei Ivanov

Dated 21/1/2009

Russia's fifth-generation fighter have to start testing phase in 2009, deputy prime minister Sergei Ivanov was quoted as saying by RIA Novosti today. Further progress on the aircraft should terminate in a first commissioning to the Russian Air Force before 2015, the News Agency said.

"I insist that the testing start as early as 2009, and the fifth-generation fighter must enter service with the Russian Air Force in 2015," Sergei Ivanov said at a meeting of the Military-Industrial Commission.

Ivanov said the fighter programme must be accelerated as previous plans set 2010 for the first tests of the new fighter. The deputy prime minister was confident that the date can be hold, since developments on the first prototype of this aircraft are nearing end.

Russia's advanced multirole fighter is being developed by Sukhoi, which is part of Russia's United Aircraft Corporation (UAC), along with India's Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL), under a preliminary intergovernmental agreement signed in October 2007.

Russia and India will simultaneously develop two versions of the combat aircraft - a two-seat version to meet the requirements of India's air superiority doctrine, and a single-seat version for the Russian Air Force.

Russia's Sukhoi aircraft maker earlier said it had started to construct a prototype of the fifth-generation fighter, which will feature high maneuverability and stealth to ensure air superiority and precision in destroying ground and sea targets.

The Russian version will be built at the Komsomolsk-on-Amur aircraft-manufacturing plant in Russia's Far East.

Ivanov said on Wednesday that the aircraft manufacturing industry should review and adjust some testing programs and methods due to advanced nature of the new aircraft.

 

[duhastmish]

Russian Federation vice premier Sergey Ivanov declared that the fifth generation combat airplane, tests of which it is planned to start in 2009, should be adopted into the Russian military's inventory in 2015.

"I emphasize, tests must start as early as this year, and in 2015 the fifth generation aviation complex should be adopted into Russia's air force," Ivanov said during a trip of the Russian Federation government's military industrial commission to Akhtubinsk on Wednesday.

According to him, "Not only ground, but also a maritime range will be need for full-fledged flight tests of the fifth generation airplane."

Source: 21.01.09, Interfax

they also demonstrated the pace of Su-34 and MiG-35 tests to the vice premier.

Then Ivanov is off to Astrakhan', where as the head of the council of trustees of the New Generation charitable foundation sports programs he will take part in a ceremony for the opening of a multipurpose sports complex.

source : http://www.royfc.com/acft_news.html

 

[indiatech]

Russia Committed to Development of Sukhoi T-50 PAK FA, Fifth Generation Fighter Jet

Dated 19/1/2009

Moscow continues to pursue a Sukhoi-based fifth-generation fighter. After five years of effort, Russia finally found an international partner for the development project. In 2007 India entered an agreement to jointly develop a fifth-generation fighter based on the Sukhoi.

The Sukhoi T-50 PAK FA -- standing for Advanced Frontline Aviation Aircraft System -- is a stealth-enabled fighter jet designed to compete with the American Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning Joint Strike Aircraft and the Lockheed Martin/Boeing F-22 Raptor. Russian air force watchers already christened it "Raptorsky," after the F-22 Raptor, with which it is supposed to compete.

The developers describe the T-50 PAK FA as having excellent maneuverability, supersonic cruising speed, long range and high protective properties. PAK FA will have a takeoff weight of 20 tons, which falls between the takeoff weight of the two American competitor airplanes, the F-35 JSF (17.2 tons) and the F-22 (24 tons).
The new fighter -- a medium version -- will have a traditional wing form, though the dramatic-looking reverse-delta wing of the Su-47 Berkut influenced the Russian fighter's designers.

The Russian fifth-generation fighter is supposed to make its first test flight this year. The testing dates have been postponed from the end of 2008, as had been previously announced by Sergei Ivanov, the Russian deputy prime minister in charge of defense production.

Some Russian spokesmen promised deployment of the T-50 in 2013, but according to the earlier statements by Sukhoi CEO Mikhail Pogosyan, the new Russian-Indian fifth-generation fighter might enter mass production by 2015.

According to Russian sources, the Sukhoi T-50 PAK FA will incorporate technology from the two experimental predecessors: the Su-47 and the MiG Project 1.44.
The flagships of the Russian aerospace technology -- Tekhnokompleks Scientific and Production Center, Ramenskoye Instrument Building Design Bureau, the Instrument Building Scientific Research Institute in Zhukovskiy, the Ural'sk Optical and Mechanical Plant in Yekaterinburg, the Polet firm in Nizhniy Novgorod and the Central Scientific Research Radio Engineering Institute in Moscow -- were selected to develop the avionics suite for the fifth-generation airplane.

NPO Saturn has been determined to lead the work on the engines. The Novosibirsk Aviation Production Association has begun construction of the fifth-generation fighter at its renowned Komsomol'sk-on-Amure Chkalov plant where most Sukhoi fighters are made.

However, considering the current economic recession and the track record of delayed deadlines, the Russian fifth-generation fighter may stay on paper for a longer time. This would give Washington and its allies sufficient time to launch mass production of F-35s, deploy them on American bases and fulfill orders from international customers such as Britain, the Netherlands and Israel.

The F-35 is expected to enter service no later than 2012, while the Russian Sukhoi T-50 PAK FA is certain to be in mass production by that time.

The future may not be bright for the next generation of the Russian fighter. Many Western defense experts believe Russia's fourth-generation fighter jets cannot withstand the U.S. stealth-enabled tandem of F-35 and F-22, which offer high maneuverability and near invisibility to surface radars because of advanced radar suppression equipment. Moreover, U.S.-based simulations and tests suggest that the stealth-enabled fifth-generation F-22 and F-35 can defeat any current aircraft, including the Raptorsky

 

[duhastmish]

any body have any information about project - PAK-DA , IF india have any option or chance to involve in this programme ?

 

[chirag.s]

hi duhastmish

going by indias previous trends it does not have a capable very long range offensive air capability other than the bear because there is no doctrine for such capability i suppose or else we would have atleast half a squadron of tu-22m backfires by now .just hoping for the best

 

[Patriot]

hi duhastmish

going by indias previous trends it does not have a capable very long range offensive air capability other than the bear because there is no doctrine for such capability i suppose or else we would have atleast half a squadron of tu-22m backfires by now .just hoping for the best

Bombers are only used for bombing nations which does not have any real air defense capability and most of the India's Enemy have very good Air Defense so bombers will be the first targets to go down.

 

[chirag.s]

Bombers are only used for bombing nations which does not have any real air defense capability and most of the India's Enemy have very good Air Defense so bombers will be the first targets to go down.

but bombers will be used when complete or at least partial air /ground superiority is achieved unless we are talking about a B-2 im sure a bomber an indian bomber wont be knocking an enemy's doors on the first day of conflict

and any ways it certainly wont go for an attacking mission when there is a credible threat of SAMs .it depends on the bomber too if its stealth then no questions but if it is a tu-22 then there is no chance tu-160s might have better chance due to their speed or there can be certain WINDOWS where there is less threat from SAMs depends on the situation though but im sure india is spending its money or will spend its money on anything but a bomber in the current situation

and even if complete air superiority is achieved it will go with su-30 escorts

even American f-117s had f-16 escorts when it went to bomb saddam's presidential palace
even when they had half a dozen planes in air at any given time

sir with all respect for a senior member please think of all the possibilities before saying Indian bombers if any will be wasted in such a way i expect a much mature response from a senior member.

 

[Chanakyaa]

can any one Comment on the Numbers that Russia and India are going to have for FGFA ( PAK-FA ) ?

 

[duhastmish]

sir
i doubt if they have thought of numbers as yet. since its under development and we dont yet know what it will be like. and how efficiant, how much it will cost , how costly will be maintainability etc etc.
thankyou

 

[Moscow]

any body have any information about project - PAK-DA , IF india have any option or chance to involve in this programme ?

if india has the funds and the will they are always welcome, we can discuss PAK-DA once more details are made available but its based on the YAK model and currently russia is concentration on pakfa and work is goin onat very high speed , pakda will take centre test once pakfa flight trils are conducted.

PAK-DA is a veru ambitious project and india just might have a big chance.

thanx

 

[chirag.s]

if india has the funds and the will they are always welcome, we can discuss PAK-DA once more details are made available but its based on the YAK model and currently russia is concentration on pakfa and work is goin onat very high speed , pakda will take centre test once pakfa flight trils are conducted.

PAK-DA is a veru ambitious project and india just might have a big chance.

thanx

hi moscow on which yak model is it based on ? i thought tupelov will be involved considering their expertise in this field

 

[chirag.s]

sir
i doubt if they have thought of numbers as yet. since its under development and we dont yet know what it will be like. and how efficiant, how much it will cost , how costly will be maintainability etc etc.
thankyou

i think we wont have more than 6-8 squadrons .it also depends on the threat around the borders if china is sucessful in thier jxx quest we'll need more

this is just the dawn of the 5th gen era i think it will reach the peak by 2040
when all the aircrafts in the international market would be 5 gen.

HOPE FOR THE BEST PREPARE FOR THE WORST

 

[Moscow]

any body have any information about project - PAK-DA , IF india have any option or chance to involve in this programme ?

PAKDA a Russian Stealth bomber
The PAK DA (or PAK-DA), is a next generation strategic bomber which is being developed by Russia. It stands for Perspektivnyi Aviatsionnyi Kompleks Dalney Aviatsyi (Перспективный авиационный комплекс дальней авиации in Russian) which means Future Air Complex for Strategic Air Forces. The PAK DA is going to be heavily based on Russia's current supersonic bomber Tupolev Tu-160 and is expected to have it's maiden flight by 2015.

Russian Air Force has made tactical and technical requirements for a new generation of strategic bombers, as reported Interfax.

According to Russian Air Force commander Aleksandr Zelin, work on a new bomber has already begun. "The requirements are formulated, and many firms are now implementing plans" - said Zelin.

According to available information, the aircraft being developed under the project PAK DA (prospective aviation complex long-distance aircraft), will be computed on the basis of construction of a supersonic Tu-160 bomber. According to specialists, to create a new aircraft will take from 5 to 8 years, and the first flight of bombers to be expected after 2015.

Currently, the Russian airforce has Tu-95 and Tu-160 strategic bombers, as well as long range Tu-22 bombers. They can carry bombs and cruise missiles. The aircraft of these types are currently undergoing modernization.

Reports also say that the new bomber will have stealth characteristics.

 

[duhastmish]

sir moscow,
as per going by details of this project, it seems like a bomber in similar directions of B-2 spirit. but it should be advance design and should be more affordable.
but the pragmatic ability of bombers in this age are doubted again and again. a time when i think space war will outdate all generation war of fighter aircraft. going back to old scheme of things i.e bomber sound a bit cliche.