RUSSIA starts work on second 5th generation fighter.

[ahmeddsid]

Still I belive, there must be some string attached. I dont think Russia will agree to this term and they will not let loose the control of the project to Indians (Ofcourse they will not ask India if they want to deal with Venezuela and sell the planes). The deal will not be anything better than US and UK.
Another way of looking at it.. Russia already have other aircraft project lined up.. So they could still deal with Indians in PKAF and they could still go with other projects alone.. So Russia is not really loosing anything here... They will have other aircraft to deal with 3rd parties if at all requried..

its a 50-50 project for the last time PAKFA is the most viable of Russias 5th Gen Planes I feel. Russians are roping in the Brazilians also I heard.

 

[TopCat]

Good carrot... Yummy for any donkeys.....

 

[ahmeddsid]

is BD getting any carrots like these?

 

[TopCat]

is BD getting any carrots like these?

Ofcourse we do chase other kind of carrot not army stuffs...

 

[ahmeddsid]

Ofcourse we do chase other kind of carrot not army stuffs...

good for you!

 

[Moscow]

But the full technology will be transfered between India and russia? Also india is holding the patent right and ownership of the project. If that was the case then, the whole deal is going in favor of Indians, as Indians are only paying 12 billion, which russia could easily make, by selling ready products...

russians had the technology for a long time. the mig 1.4 had its flight tests long ago but still the problem was the funds they could not afford the money due to the loss the mig corp suffered following the cancellation of algerian order.and after the success in the MKI project where the indians used some different avionics to meet their demands. the sukhoi plant decided to go along with the indians.
the pakfa project is above the money deals betweeen the indians and russians if its comes out to its planned potential then russian aviation industry will be back to its previous position as one of the best around the world.
moreover the russians have always supplied india with their best products so its nothing new that india is on a win ,win position.


thanx.

 

[Moscow]

Still I belive, there must be some string attached. I dont think Russia will agree to this term and they will not let loose the control of the project to Indians (Ofcourse they will not ask India if they want to deal with Venezuela and sell the planes). The deal will not be anything better than US and UK.
Another way of looking at it.. Russia already have other aircraft project lined up.. So they could still deal with Indians in PKAF and they could still go with other projects alone.. So Russia is not really loosing anything here... They will have other aircraft to deal with 3rd parties if at all requried..

now sir what the exact deal parameters are is not in my knowledge, the russians never reveal all the details but the thing is that russia is not losing the control over the project its only that its trying to gain and keep its strong indian market intact, now indians can get hight techweapons from the west that will cut the russian sales but if you get into a jv the doors for any other aircraft of the 5th generation being inducted in the near future is shut down forever.
russians are thinking about the long term goals rather than making a cheap buck.

yes air one more point whatever other aircraft projects are going on in russia all of them will involve either india or israel, or china.

NEW TACTICAL TRANSPORT AIRCRAFT:-50-50 JV russia-india
UAVS- to be bought from israel and later codeveloped.
MIG- 5th gen light fighter -- looking for partners probably offered to india, brazil to be developed after pakfa

i do not know of anyother new project all the rest are upgrades of the present migs and flankers which are 4++ generation at the most.

thanx

 

[TopCat]

russia is not losing the control over the project its only that its trying to gain and keep its strong indian market intact

I also believe the same thing.. and at end of the day.. It will not be called a Indian plane but a russian plane

 

[ahmeddsid]

I also believe the same thing.. and at end of the day.. It will not be called a Indian plane but a russian plane

No it wont be called an Indian or Russian Plane, It will be called a Indo-Russian Plane. Maybe they might name it like Brahmos on similar lines

 

[Moscow]

I also believe the same thing.. and at end of the day.. It will not be called a Indian plane but a russian plane

it dosent matter the point it its 2 different variant of the same plane.
PAKFA for the russians
FGFA for the indians
thnx

 

[Tornado]

Moscow sir if u consider PAK FA ur "second 5th generation fighter". Let me guess which is the first one u started working on. Is it 1.44 as per ur calculation. or if could make it more clearer. Thanx

 

[Moscow]

Moscow sir if u consider PAK FA ur "second 5th generation fighter". Let me guess which is the first one u started working on. Is it 1.44 as per ur calculation. or if could make it more clearer. Thanx

sir pakfa is not the 2nd 5th gen fighter its the first one if you read the original post you can see that the 2nd one is migs.here is the original post once again for you.


Sukhoi's future twin-engine Flanker-class fighter is not the only new-generation combat aircraft project in Russia. According to Alexey Fedorov, head of the United Aircraft Corporation, another aircraft designer — MiG Corp. — is developing a lightweight multi-role frontal aircraft (LMFS), which is said to be similar to the US Joint Strike Fighter. While the PAK FA will replace Russian Air Force's Su-27s, the service's MiG-29 Fulcrum is to be succeeded by the LMFS. Development of the LMFS would follow the PAK FA, with a first prototype flight planned for 2016-17.
russia has also completed work on the radar,ammunition,engine and other prerequisites for its PAKFA. will see pakfa flying< trials > by 2009 thats for sure.

since the technologies and weapons to be used will be mostly similar and till now no futher info is available on the mig project <LMFS> so we are discussing the technologies that will be used for the pakfa as more information is available in this regard.

thanks. hope i cleared some of your confusion

 

[Moscow]

probable date for pakfa flight tests on 12 August 2009.


the pakfa prototypes are already undergoing structural tests


Three Fifth Generation Airplanes for Russian Federation Air Force Already Undergoing Tests

Russia's air force already is testing three fifth generation airplanes, the Russian Federation air force commander-in-chief, General-Colonel Aleksandr Zelin, reported on Friday to journalists.

"This year we are testing three fifth generation aircraft. They are in one or the other stage of readiness," he said.


more details here Roy's Russian Aircraft Resource

 

[iceman2009]

Russians have been talking up their 5th Generation fighter stating first flight in 2009....ie this year or early next year latest.

India has signed an agreement to pay 50&#37; of the development costs.

BUT THE REALITY is that this flight is nothing more than test flight of the concept and the war plane itself is over a decade away.

F22 flew the tech demonstrator in 1993 the F22 entered service in 2006 ie 13 years later.

LCA tejas TD1 flew in 2001 and the first IOC will not be acheived until 2010.

THE PAK FA wen it flys will fly with the AFL 31 saturn engine which currently powers the su30mki

Also the PAK FA will fly with the PESA radar. same as SU30 MKI TOO.

ONLY THE actual air frame itself will a new 5th generation version.

Both the new engine which can supercruise AFL41 & the ibris AESA are stil in development stage. As is the new range of Air to air & strike weapons.

" This flight is nothing more than to convince Russian & indian militaries that SUKHOI has the platform ready.

THE REST WILL TAKE US INTO 2020+

 

[Moscow]

Russians have been talking up their 5th Generation fighter stating first flight in 2009....ie this year or early next year latest.

India has signed an agreement to pay 50% of the development costs.

BUT THE REALITY is that this flight is nothing more than test flight of the concept and the war plane itself is over a decade away.

F22 flew the tech demonstrator in 1993 the F22 entered service in 2006 ie 13 years later.

LCA tejas TD1 flew in 2001 and the first IOC will not be acheived until 2010.

THE PAK FA wen it flys will fly with the AFL 31 saturn engine which currently powers the su30mki

Also the PAK FA will fly with the PESA radar. same as SU30 MKI TOO.

ONLY THE actual air frame itself will a new 5th generation version.

Both the new engine which can supercruise AFL41 & the ibris AESA are stil in development stage. As is the new range of Air to air & strike weapons.

" This flight is nothing more than to convince Russian & indian militaries that SUKHOI has the platform ready.

THE REST WILL TAKE US INTO 2020+

please discuss this on this thread,http://www.defence.pk/forums/milita...tarts-work-second-5th-generation-fighter.html


i have posted the original links, with pictures of the aesa radar wich you say is non-existance and also the picture of the alf41 engine.
the the new missiles and weapons to be used are also given together with the first russian 5 th generation prototype which flew long ago.

please get some proper information sir.
you are welcome to discuss this matter in that thread because this section only concerns posts related to paf.

thanx