Russia loses its position in India

[takeitwithyou]

I said Yes. Pakistan can make up the losses if Pakistan becomes a strategic partner of Russia.

And don't give me that the Pakistani economy is not good enough. That argument is not very convincing.

I'm here to learn from you; you have insights that are new and quite different.

From 2012 to 2016, Russia supplied 68. per cent of India's arms import, as per the survey by Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI). The value of which was more than circa 5 billion_ year on year. Are you going to short the Chinese and buy Russian defense-related products for the same, every year?

 

[MultaniGuy]

. Economics isnt your strongest forte now Sir, is it? ??!!

And foreign policy and geopolitics isn't your cup of tea either?

Get out of here Indian false flagger!

I'm here to learn from you; you have insights that are new and quite different.

From 2012 to 2016, Russia supplied 68. per cent of India's arms import, as per the survey by Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI). The value of which was more than circa 5 billion_ year on year. Are you going to short the Chinese and buy Russian defense-related products for the same, every year?

Well the Pakistani economy is not that strong at the moment.

If we go by your statistics, Russia will have to do things with discounts.

Can Pakistan replace India in defence contracts? I said yes previously, but only with discounts.

But if Pakistan can replace India as a strategic partner of Russia this is possible.

Secondly I still think Pakistan will get most stuff from China.

Now be a good boy and stop wasting my time.

 

[hussain0216]

I'm here to learn from you; you have insights that are new and quite different.

From 2012 to 2016, Russia supplied 68. per cent of India's arms import, as per the survey by Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI). The value of which was more than circa 5 billion_ year on year. Are you going to short the Chinese and buy Russian defense-related products for the same, every year?

Why would we need to?

India is a cash cow for Russia, we do not seek to replace it

The recent bonhomie between Pakistan and Russia is simply because some of our strategic interest's have become aligned

There is no need to over think this

 

[MultaniGuy]

I'm here to learn from you; you have insights that are new and quite different.

From 2012 to 2016, Russia supplied 68. per cent of India's arms import, as per the survey by Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI). The value of which was more than circa 5 billion_ year on year. Are you going to short the Chinese and buy Russian defense-related products for the same, every year?

But I said India will not ditch Russia completely for USA. So I don't think Pakistan will be replacing India for defence contracts with Russia anytime soon.

Is it possible that Pakistan can replace India for defence contracts. Yes, only if India tilts towards USA completely and Russia does things with discounts to counterweight India-USA relationship.

But only with discounts, because the Pakistani economy is not that strong yet.

Its all about geostrategy and undermining the other party.

 

[takeitwithyou]

This is not about tilting or about whose camp who is in, I think those days are gone for everyone

Its simply a case of Russian and Pakistani interest's aligning on a number of issues, as well as Chinas, Iran's and Turkeys

Pakistan is not out to replace India, both Russia and Pakistan have our own reasons for a improvement in ties

Well, he was stating something quite different.

I would like to learn from you where you see Russians converging on interests with Pakistan over India. It is a sensitive region and Russians have to be wary of irritating India. What are these mutual interests of any significance? Thanks

 

[MultaniGuy]

Well, he was stating something quite different.

I would like to learn from you where you see Russians converging on interests with Pakistan over India. It is a sensitive region and Russians have to be wary of irritating India. What are these mutual interests of any significance? Thanks

I have to agree with @hussain0216, Pakistan will not replace India in Russian defence deals anytime soon. But can it, yes it can if the politics work in that direction.
Perhaps the only thing hurting Pakistan is the economic reasons, thus I said only with discounts.

Secondly Russia can join CPEC Through Kazakhstan and China and have access to warm waters to the Arabian Sea without having to rely on Iran to the strait of Hormuz.

 

[takeitwithyou]

But I said India will not ditch Russia completely for USA. So I don't think Pakistan will be replacing India for defence contracts with Russia anytime soon.

Is it possible that Pakistan can replace India for defence contracts. Yes, only if India tilts towards USA completely and Russia does things with discounts to counterweight India-USA relationship.

But only with discounts, because the Pakistani economy is not that strong yet.

Its all about geostrategy and undermining the other party.

That's not what you originally claimed. But everyone has a right to change their mind, even so, within the same thread.

Regarding your new position. Pakistan does not spend 5 plus billion (year after year) in defense sales with China as India does with Russia. If India goes 100% to us like you have stated. Are you saying you are going to quadruple your defense budget to afford China and now also Russian contracts of similar dollar values each year?

 

[MultaniGuy]

That's not what you originally claimed. But everyone has a right to change their mind, even so, within the same thread.

Regarding your new position. Pakistan does not spend 5 plus billion (year after year) in defense sales with China as India does with Russia. If India goes 100% to us like you have stated. Are you saying you are going to quadruple your defense budget to afford China and now also Russian contracts of similar dollar values each year?

You are correct, I have changed my mind.
I do not know where you get your statistics from. But if we go by them anyways, Pakistan could get something from Russia anyways.

Yes, India spends more than Pakistan in defence sales, especially with Russia.
Pakistan will most likely get defence stuff from China.

Besides I said if the politics work in that direction, then things could work out.

The only thing holding this agreement back is the economics.

happy now?

 

[takeitwithyou]

I have to agree with @hussain0216, Pakistan will not replace India in Russian defence deals anytime soon. But can it, yes it can if the politics work in that direction.
Perhaps the only thing hurting Pakistan is the economic reasons, thus I said only with discounts.

Secondly Russia can join CPEC Through Kazakhstan and China and have access to warm waters to the Arabian Sea without having to rely on Iran to the strait of Hormuz.

I love our conversation, it goes in so many directions. fascinating.

You say Russia with join CPEC. May I ask what lead you to believe so? Russians who are heavily vested and dug in Iran- has an ally in Inda who is investing there and Has zero security issues in Iran; would opt to help Pakistan and China on CPEC?

 

[MultaniGuy]

I love our conversation, it goes in so many directions. fascinating.

You think Russia with join CPEC. May I ask why do you think so when they are much heavily vested and dug in Iran? Why do you suppose Russia who is allied deep in Iran, has an ally in Inda who is investing there. Has zero security issues in Iran; would opt to help Pakistan and China on CPEC?

Listen Indian, lol, Russia prefers China to India in many fields.

And why should Russia work with Iran which is under sanctions.

Fine I have changed my mind, if you want a brutally honest opinion, Pakistan cannot replace India as Russia's defence partner, because of the economic reasons.

But you cannot deny Pakistan can become a more strategic partner to Russia than India is, because India does not have a geographic land link to Russia.

now be happy now.

Where are you? Where did you go? @takeitwithyou So we had our discussion.
Be happy now.

 

[takeitwithyou]

Listen Indian, lol, Russia prefers China to India in many fields.

And why should Russia work with Iran which is under sanctions.

Fine I have changed my mind, if you want a brutally honest opinion, Pakistan cannot replace India as Russia's defence partner, because of the economic reasons.

But you cannot deny Pakistan can become a more strategic partner to Russia than India is, because India does not have a geographic land link to Russia.

now be happy now.

I'm learning a lot from our conversations. I'm not sure if Russians who have aspirations of getting back to being a superpower want to promote China over India. I'd figure they would not have sold S400 to India if that was the case. All the same, it has been very nice of you to indulge me. Thanks.

P.S. America does not have direct land links with many countries. most countries. That does not seem to affect how they see us (NATO). I'm afraid your claim "But you cannot deny Pakistan can become a more strategic partner to Russia than India is, because India does not have a geographic land link to Russia."- is at best aspirational.

 

[MultaniGuy]

I'm learning a lot from our conversations. I'm not sure if Russians who have aspirations of getting back to being a superpower want to promote China over India. I'd figure they would not have sold S400 to India if that was the case. All the same, it has been very nice of you to indulge me. Thanks.

P.S. America does not have direct land links with many countries. most countries. That does not seem to affect how they see us (NATO). I'm afraid your claim "But you cannot deny Pakistan can become a more strategic partner to Russia than India is, because India does not have a geographic land link to Russia."- is at best aspirational.

lol don't fool me, you are no American.

You are an Indian pretending to be an American.

The average American does not care about this part of the world (Asia).

I'm learning a lot from our conversations. I'm not sure if Russians who have aspirations of getting back to being a superpower want to promote China over India. I'd figure they would not have sold S400 to India if that was the case. All the same, it has been very nice of you to indulge me. Thanks.

P.S. America does not have direct land links with many countries. most countries. That does not seem to affect how they see us (NATO). I'm afraid your claim "But you cannot deny Pakistan can become a more strategic partner to Russia than India is, because India does not have a geographic land link to Russia."- is at best aspirational.

Nor would Russia want India to become too powerful in India's neighbourhood. It's all about maintaining a balance.

 

[takeitwithyou]

lol don't fool me, you are no American.

You are an Indian pretending to be an American.

The average American does not care about this part of the world (Asia).


Nor would Russia want India to become too powerful in India's neighbourhood. It's all about maintaining a balance.

Average American does not come on Pakistani defense forums. None of us are average here - would you not agree?
You've made yet another twist in this saga. Your claim of - The Russians would not want India to become dominant in its own region. I'm keen to hear more from you. Tell me how they influence such a stance and the motivation to take on an ally of decades. Finally, the purpose.

 

[MultaniGuy]

Average American does not come on Pakistani defense forums. None of us are average here - would you not agree?
You've made yet another twist in this saga. Your claim of - The Russians would not want India to become dominant in its own region. I'm keen to hear more from you. Tell me how they influence such a stance and the motivation to take on an ally of decades. Finally, the purpose.

Are you unaware that Russia is also an ally and economic partner of China.

Russia will prefer China over India anyday.

India is just a cash cow for Russia.

Usually Pakistanis, Indians, and Chinese can be found on this site with a few Middle Easterners and a few Europeans.

 

[takeitwithyou]

Are you unaware that Russia is also an ally and economic partner of China.

Russia will prefer China over India anyday.

India is just a cash cow for Russia.

Usually Pakistanis, Indians, and Chinese can be found on this site with a few Middle Easterners and a few Europeans.

I was not aware of Russians 'anyday' preference of China over India. Do expand on why you think Russians would cede Russain aspirations of being a superpower to choosing China over India (today). Given India won't be one perhaps for decades?