"Replacements for deficient Su-30 MKI and MiG-29 are being processed."

[hussain0216]

Whats the hold up in ordering more Rafales, the aircraft has already been evaluated four our needs and has been modified by Dassault for Indian specific requirements and delivered. Our pilots and ground staff have been already trained to operate it and dassault is keen to set up MRO and production line in India both for IAF and also exports. When everything is already or almost done why the hell are we again going through MRFA all over again by evaluating same aircrafts like Typhoon, F15, F16 blk 70,Grippen etc once more. Just place follow up orders on Rafales godsake.

Even if you did, you are way behind in a queue now, multiple countries are waiting

What would you do for the let's say 5-7 years before they could start delivering rafs

 

[Super Falcon]

Don't see India replacing them soon

 

[SABRE]

Don't see India replacing them soon

My estimation is 30 years for complete replacements in the tri-services. Simultaneous replacements in all three services would essentially reset the Indian military. So, they are likely to do things gradually. Eventually Russia would get into a position to begin supplying the spares but replacement process would still need to be taken at the earliest.

 

[Daghalodi]

Yes I am not an Indian. I am a South Indian.

 

[Wesen Hunter]

Again, your BS is laughable, Indonesia ordered tiny batches of SU-30s, as did Uganda and Belarus. Before asking people to "read up" maybe follow your own advice?

Neither Indonesia nor Belarus ordered from HAL.
In the year Russia delivered Sukhois to Indonesia their factories produced a total of 23 Su-30 that year, of which only a few were for Indonesia.
Unlike Russia which manufactures Sukhois for multiple customers incl. RuAF at same time, HAL supplies Su-30 to only one customer.

 

[blain2]

I have no reason to doubt in the capabilities of homegrown systems... but Russian? No way.

So the much hyped by the Indians "Raptor of the East" has been a complete and utter dud?

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

Pakistan is only arming against India, but India is arming against China. JF 17 type fighter will not cut it for India

Ukrainian GDP per capita is 1/3 Russian but Indian GDP per capita is 1/6 Chinese. Ukraine is relatively stronger vs Russia than India is vs. China.

 

[Wood]

Ukrainian GDP per capita is 1/3 Russian but Indian GDP per capita is 1/6 Chinese. Ukraine is relatively stronger vs Russia than India is vs. China.

Are you on the wrong thread? Or you just felt like boasting for no reason?

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

Are you on the wrong thread? Or you just felt like boasting for no reason?

Ukraine can afford a higher budget relative to Russia than India can relative to China. Indian air force can't afford to replace Russian planes.

 

[Wood]

Ukraine can afford a higher budget relative to Russia than India can relative to China.

Okay. So you were just boasting on the wrong thread. Keep it up

 

[Yasser76]

Neither Indonesia nor Belarus ordered from HAL.
In the year Russia delivered Sukhois to Indonesia their factories produced a total of 23 Su-30 that year, of which only a few were for Indonesia.
Unlike Russia which manufactures Sukhois for multiple customers incl. RuAF at same time, HAL supplies Su-30 to only one customer.

So do you actually have a point?

 

[SQ8]

So do you actually have a point?

Broken tape record on “India is the greatest”
Has Pakistani counterparts as well

You could bring up frying pans and these people will say why India has the best frying pans in the world

 

[SABRE]

Yes I am not an Indian. I am a South Indian.

From which part?

Broken tape record on “India is the greatest”

That is not how the saying goes. It's as follow:

"East or West, India is the Best! ... North or South, Pakistan is Out"

 

[Yasser76]

Broken tape record on “India is the greatest”
Has Pakistani counterparts as well

You could bring up frying pans and these people will say why India has the best frying pans in the world

Yup, I figured as much, anyway, point they are overlooking is average age of the entire IAF fleet is progressively getting older and older. At some point all the Jaguars and MIG-21s will be falling out of the sky, LCA delivieries are at a glacial pace (no single plane in last 18 months delivered to IAF) and the much talked about 20 year MRCA order is no where.

Essentially this means by 2023-2025 IAF will need to lose around 6 MIG-21 units and 6 Jaguar units. Around 40% of it's entire strength.

In the same time period PAF will have an additional 36 J-10Cs and 50-60 more Block III Thunders. No other way of looking at this other then it being a procurement and strategic disaster for the IAF. Had they ordered the 114 MRCA 5 years back and had HAL kept it's promises on the LCA and the SU-30 upgrade commenced, then things would be much rosier, but these three important projects all messed up, handing PAF a major lifeline.

 

[SQ8]

Yup, I figured as much, anyway, point they are overlooking is average age of the entire IAF fleet is progressively getting older and older. At some point all the Jaguars and MIG-21s will be falling out of the sky, LCA delivieries are at a glacial pace (no single plane in last 18 months delivered to IAF) and the much talked about 20 year MRCA order is no where.

Essentially this means by 2023-2025 IAF will need to lose around 6 MIG-21 units and 6 Jaguar units. Around 40% of it's entire strength.

In the same time period PAF will have an additional 36 J-10Cs and 50-60 more Block III Thunders. No other way of looking at this other then it being a procurement and strategic disaster for the IAF. Had they ordered the 114 MRCA 5 years back and had HAL kept it's promises on the LCA and the SU-30 upgrade commenced, then things would be much rosier, but these three important projects all messed up, handing PAF a major lifeline.

It all depends on leadership and how they percolate values downstream. They do have terrific fliers and leadership potential but rumors are that political influence and institutional culture interference is having an impact. Their procurement process was hobbled by bureaucracy and mismanagement of projects(procurement are projects too).
Regardless of the spit shined face the Indian fanboys present here by making tall claims or copy pasting exaggerated links it is a huge mess to fix and really needs some diligent and empowered leadership to create the right impact. In some ways they do mirror the Russians in the sense they have great equipment but training standards aren’t being enforced or coordination is all over the place.

So, yes - what is helping the PAF is the IAF’s own issues. If they overcome it they will wax the floor with the PAF after day 2 of an air war.

Let’s not forget, just be sheer size, momentum and a superpower(some Indian had an orgasm) of a technology growth base in the private sector they are poised(if not focused or prepared) to start competing with China on certain aspects.

That isn’t to take away from the PAF’s own issues and personal fiefdoms delaying or sabotaging projects but I will say the PAF is ever so slightly ahead of the team/training curve vs the IAF…. For now