Featured Project Azm: Pakistan's Ambitious Quest to Develop 5th Generation Military Technologies.

[Trailer23]

make an important difference between a stupid fan and a serious analyst or watcher.

First off, there was silly discussion going about the name & all. I just wanted to break the fight off and continue with the discussion.

And i'm not an 'Analyst' or atleast I don't get paid to be one. So I guess i'll take the 'stupid fan' remark.

Second, why has this constantly to be discussed in the PAF AZM thread? So far the FC-31 is one option, but far from a chosen one and as such anyone interested in that type, might better look here (https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/sac-fc-31-stealth-fighter-news-discussions.207796/page-262) but should otherwise not permanently span this thread with off-topic posts.

As for you head-banging ( ) abilities, I thank Al' Mighty Allah that the name of the forum is still 'Pakistan Defence Forum' & that you're not a Mod 'round here. And am pretty certain NO ONE has elected you to speak on behalf of others.

 

[LKJ86]

First off, there was silly discussion going about the name & all. I just wanted to break the fight off and continue with the discussion.

If FC-31 gets the name J-xx from PLA, it means that it has got orders from PLAAF/PLAN.

 

[MIRauf]

When developing JFs, the PAFs pilots' inputs also played a big role in making that jet. Now, I am thinking, from where we will arrange such experience for AZM?

This alone should be one big reason to go for F-16 Block 72s which has F-35 DNA. Other sources likely be from what is available on the internet ( published documents ) along with input from PLAAF and or TuAF.

 

[Trailer23]

This alone should be one big reason to go for F-16 Block 72s which has F-35 DNA. Other sources likely be from what is available on the internet ( published documents ) along with input from PLAAF and or TuAF.

Block 72's do NOT have the F-35 DNA.

The one that has the so-called F-35 DNA is the F-21 which is currently being pitched to India. There is still NO Test Prototype for that jet.

 

[StormBreaker]

Block 72's do NOT have the F-35 DNA.

The one that has the so-called F-35 DNA is the F-21 which is currently being pitched to India. There is still NO Test Prototype for that jet.

Still, the DNA doesn’t count as you know as well.
If only Erdogan hadn’t messed up badly with F-35, we might have got a chance to ride it or not us hut at least them and then we could have gotten Turk AF pilot’s input...

 

[aliyusuf]

Still, the DNA doesn’t count as you know as well.
If only Erdogan hadn’t messed up badly with F-35, we might have got a chance to ride it or not us hut at least them and then we could have gotten Turk AF pilot’s input...

Rightly or wrongly ... Erdogan feels that his enemies have changed after the "Gulent" affair. Against his current perceived enemies, these F-35s won't work. Russia is no longer an enemy. The Arab's are not that big a threat for Turkey, that they would require F-35. S-400 has a better chance of working against his new perceived enemies.

 

[MIRauf]

Block 72's do NOT have the F-35 DNA.

The one that has the so-called F-35 DNA is the F-21 which is currently being pitched to India. There is still NO Test Prototype for that jet.

Yup, I stand corrected, Thank you, just AESA features that are common.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Rightly or wrongly ... Erdogan feels that his enemies have changed after the "Gulent" affair. Against his current perceived enemies, these F-35s won't work. Russia is no longer an enemy. The Arab's are not that big a threat for Turkey, that they would require F-35. S-400 has a better chance of working against his new perceived enemies.

Who in his right mind would bring the "Trojan Horses" inside the Fort, and that too paying from his own coffers????

 

[DrWatson775]

But as i recall, Turkey scrapped the delta and single engine TF-X for a simple F-22 look alike dual engine TF-X design.

This doesn’t fit the equation !!!

It does. Twin engine low observable aircraft with high survivability (+/- supercruise) is the future.

 

[Ultima Thule]

It does. Twin engine low observable aircraft with high survivability (+/- supercruise) is the future.

F-16 still one of the most maneuverable/agile jet, which is single engine jet, and tell me why USA develop single engine F-35 without supercruise

 

[Cool_Soldier]

YJ 27 A news was circulating few days earlier with some images at Minawalli PAF BASE
Any confirmation yet. Such Radars are need of time because they provide early sophisticated information against any joint aggressive plan India+ Israel. (Rafael and F-35)
In past, many example were there to attempt Air attack on Pakistan.

Why...have you peroanllybtested the j31 and know that it fits the criteria for PAF or is it that you think it's cool? Buying a fighter is not that same as buying a cricket bat

It will be tested and evaluated by PAF according to its needs. But, yes whatever deficiencies are there, China is trying to make it lethal and true stealth Fighter.
It is economical as compared to J-20 and other than these Two Planes, no other option is offered to Pakistan.
As I earlier said, that Project AZM will take time to come in reality and get mature.Meanwhile, we need something in reasonable numbers to tackle quality build up from enemy side. Do not just include India as several times other enemies were part of the game physically when their planes were ready to attack Pakistan

 

[Trango Towers]

YJ 27 A news was circulating few days earlier with some images at Minawalli PAF BASE
Any confirmation yet. Such Radars are need of time because they provide early sophisticated information against any joint aggressive plan India+ Israel. (Rafael and F-35)
In past, many example were there to attempt Air attack on Pakistan.



It will be tested and evaluated by PAF according to its needs. But, yes whatever deficiencies are there, China is trying to make it lethal and true stealth Fighter.
It is economical as compared to J-20 and other than these Two Planes, no other option is offered to Pakistan.
As I earlier said, that Project AZM will take time to come in reality and get mature.Meanwhile, we need something in reasonable numbers to tackle quality build up from enemy side. Do not just include India as several times other enemies were part of the game physically when their planes were ready to attack Pakistan

Jf17 will be there in number and will be able to tackle anything indians throw at us. J31 is years away. By the time it rolls of production line in number project azm will be well on it's way

 

[Shabi1]

J31 is a dead project, no one in PLAAF/PLAAN etc are interested in it, so no point wasting precious money on a dead end project like the J31. And, there is no such thing as J-22...

Lets not discuss J31 in the Azm thread !

According to Chinese sources the enlarged J-31 v3 has too many changes and going to be renamed to J-35 or xxx.

The J-31 is not entering service but it will be the origin or testbed for a third Chinese stealth fighter (J-31v3 renamed). Reason why J-31 is relevant to Azm is that when Sohail Aman was PAF ACM he had said China will be doing the structural/airframe work for the Azm because they have matured infrastructure for the modeling and wind tunnel testing. Pakistan would likely be making and integrating sub systems. With this regard J-31 root of the Azm is very likely. J-31 is being used as a test bed and design being evolved for better performance.

https://quwa.org/2017/12/07/pakistan-collaborating-with-china-on-next-gen-fighter/
In the inaugural session of AirTech ’17, a conference being held at Air University in Islamabad, the Pakistan Air Force (PAF) Chief of Air Staff (CAS) Air Chief Marshal (ACM) Sohail Aman stated that China is supporting Pakistan’s efforts to develop a next-generation fighter, a satellite program and a manned space mission.

“Pakistan is engaged with Chinese experts in manufacturing the next generation aircraft”, Aman told the audience, adding, “China is also providing technical assistance for launching the satellite programme.”

Under “Project Azm” the PAF is seeking to develop its own 5th-generation fighter. Besides having a system to support its future requirements, Project Azm is envisaged to steer Pakistan towards greater autonomy in domestically sourcing big-ticket defence systems and expanding Pakistan’s aviation industry.

Exactly, scrapping after making 3-4 rumored prototypes seems impossible and a hell flop. Plus FC-31 had potential customer’s eyes from all around the world.

View attachment 595123
this strange underside, could this mean installing some anti sub warfare sonar/whatsoever it is called or just an amphibious plane like sea landing hull ?

That is for the EOTS/DAS. Its on both J-21 and J-31V2

Also on the JSF

 

[StormBreaker]

According to Chinese sources the enlarged J-31 v3 has too many changes and going to be renamed to J-35 or xxx.

The J-31 is not entering service but it will be the origin or testbed for a third Chinese stealth fighter (J-31v3 renamed). Reason why J-31 is relevant to Azm is that when Sohail Aman was PAF ACM he had said China will be doing the structural/airframe work for the Azm because they have matured infrastructure for the modeling and wind tunnel testing. Pakistan would likely be making and integrating sub systems. With this regard J-31 root of the Azm is very likely. J-31 is being used as a test bed and design being evolved for better performance.

https://quwa.org/2017/12/07/pakistan-collaborating-with-china-on-next-gen-fighter/
In the inaugural session of AirTech ’17, a conference being held at Air University in Islamabad, the Pakistan Air Force (PAF) Chief of Air Staff (CAS) Air Chief Marshal (ACM) Sohail Aman stated that China is supporting Pakistan’s efforts to develop a next-generation fighter, a satellite program and a manned space mission.

“Pakistan is engaged with Chinese experts in manufacturing the next generation aircraft”, Aman told the audience, adding, “China is also providing technical assistance for launching the satellite programme.”

Under “Project Azm” the PAF is seeking to develop its own 5th-generation fighter. Besides having a system to support its future requirements, Project Azm is envisaged to steer Pakistan towards greater autonomy in domestically sourcing big-ticket defence systems and expanding Pakistan’s aviation industry.


That is for the EOTS/DAS. Its on both J-21 and J-31V2

Also on the JSF

EOTS-86 to be more specific, that’s the name of the system,
And it is J-20 not 21

 

[Shabi1]

EOTS-86 to be more specific, that’s the name of the system,
And it is J-20 not 21

thank you for correction yes J-20