Presser by PM Kakar regarding Afghanistan situation

[lastofthepatriots]

MPGA!!!

Build the wall!

 

[TheSolution]

I think you will see it advance into pubjab/sindh.

If it gets hot enough you will settle for a new status quo and a new informal border (maybe formal?) The same one we have had for 1000s of years. Geographical boundaries are forever. Lines change all the time.

And why not? They sense weakness. The coffers are empty. There is no air campaign coming unless you get someone else to fund it. There is no way you can ramp up internal security enough to secure pakistan unless you get someone else to fund it.

2030, if this forum is still around ill come back to this thread and post the new map.

I understand what you are saying, and I think a lot of people acknowledge this possibility but I think if funding was that desparately needed it could be diverted from other areas

But I guess you are right on one thing, unless Pakistan adopts policies like the Taliban where they are actively altering demographics then maintaing security/territory will be difficult because there'll always be those that sympathise on the grounds of ethnicity

 

[SaadH]

Fair assessment, but what did IK ever do on the matter?

He may be a Caretaker PM, & he may not be around for the long haul, but atleast the ball started to roll as soon as he came into the picture.

Lets just hope we can evict as many as possible before the (new) selected PM takes the throne.

Whoever is selecting the PM's are making these decisions and certainly on demand...

MPGA!!!

Build the wall!

Wall already exists and like all walls is breached everyday by the Afghans just like their Indian and Central American counterparts on US southern border...

 

[Trailer23]

Whoever is selecting the PM's are making these decisions and certainly on demand...

Yaar, Politics aside...

...and whatever you, I and/or what the others make of the (current) CoAS...

...lets just get these MF's out of Pakistan first.

Politics tou Pakistan may chulti-rhti hai. Like the say goes: Never a dull moment in Pakistan.

(If) something good comes out of the current Boss, i'll take it.

I've had just about enough of these freeloaders from across the Boarder.

And keep in mind, this is coming from the guy who has spent a great deal of time in Afghanistan and know exactly what they think about our people.

 

[nibba]

I understand what you are saying, and I think a lot of people acknowledge this possibility but I think if funding was that desparately needed it could be diverted from other areas

But I guess you are right on one thing, unless Pakistan adopts policies like the Taliban where they are actively altering demographics then maintaing security/territory will be difficult because there'll always be those that sympathise on the grounds of ethnicity

A country based on ethnicity then.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Let me load up 23andme dna testing results and contemplate the possibilites

 

[RescueRanger]

Wall already exists

this wall will be better, it will be a Great Wall, the Great Wall of kickbacks!

 

[lastofthepatriots]

Wall already exists and like all walls is breached everyday by the Afghans just like their Indian and Central American counterparts on US southern border...

Looks like comprehending sarcasm is not your strong suit my Bihari fraand.

 

[OldenWisdom...قول بزرگ]

The macho Tarzans here don't get it or want to get it... the narrative built over time is bearing it's fruits... it is called conditioning for a reason.

Who on this board will show up saving a disintegrating state?
Who will fund a forceful integration?
These borders were gifted, nation was not!
Belligerent's will get their rods removed and present prostrating necks!

If you don't get, you don't get it!

 

[maithil]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1722572156071293369

Nice step..

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

"My center is giving way, my right is in retreat; situation excellent. I shall attack." - Marshal Foch, C-in-C of the Allied forces in WW1

It's a "now or never" for the Pak Deep State....

 

[SaadH]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1722572156071293369

Afghanistan's diplomatic positioning even vis-a-vis western countries is a lot more stable and on equal footing than the sepoy subordinates of the faujeet colony. They don't need sepoy slaves vouchimg for them.

They are quite adequately forging their path internationally with China being their biggest patron and india being their other potential backer.

 

[TheSolution]

Bugti this caretaker cabinet is actually based

https://twitter.com/x/status/1722689492803305736

 

[CivilianSupremacy]

-Pakistan should carry out airstrikes and destroy all of Taliban's ammunition storage centres, and military equipment like helicopters and vehicles to weaken their stronghold.

-Then it needs to create a supply line that can provide constant resupply of weapons to the Northern areas and set up training camps all across Tajik/Hazara dominant regions. The ideology should be a Khorosani-Farsi ideology that hates the Afghans. It should disarm everyone of weapons that are against it.

-Shut down Af-Pak border, mass surveillance and minimal movement.

Make them wage war against the Taliban. It's the only proper way to retaliate. This group will accept the border and keep the others in check.

TALIBAN WILL NEVER BE RELIABLE. ONLY AN INCLUSIVE GOVERNMENT OF ETHNIC MINORITIES. OTHERWISE IT WILL GET WORSE FROM HERE.

@PanzerKiel

Bro, In other words, you are suggesting the end of Pakistan.

Pakistan would be the greatest fool on earth to start a war against Afghan Taliban.

Even Super-powers cannot survive in a geographic situation like Pakistan that is sandwiched between two very long borders, the major threat is eastern border where all the capability is focused to. Pakistan would be the greatest fool on the planet ever to exist that will intentionally make its western longest border of 2700 km to become a warzone.

Do you have any idea, how much local support the Taliban will have in pashtun regions of Pakistan. Pakistan will not survive a month. You have zero money for imports and you are suggesting a war with such a vicious and resilient afghan Taliban?

Two of the world's greatest super-powers with 100,000 times more resources than Pakistan got consumed and exhausted in their bid to defeat them and they failed. You won't make even an impact before they burst into your fragile societies and corrupt and injustice system.



Shutting Border is impossible task. Its unthinkable and its hillarious when people suggest this.

Shut down Af-Pak border

LMAO! You know you have literally broken economy. right ?

Even with a trillion dollar economy, Shutting down the border is practically IMPOSSIBLE. There are 1000s of people who cross the border on daily basis undetected. There is no amount of man-power, no amount of technology that can seal a treacherous 2700 km long AF-Pak border that has caves, that has rivers, that has valleys, that has mountains.
I give you two examples:
i) Gaza has only 40 km border with Israel. Israel has all the technology of the world, they got powerful economy, they got all the resources in the world to check this 40 km long border but still every now and then Hamas was able to breach.

ii) You remember President trump was building a wall on Mexican border. That's because a super power like USA is unable to stop inflitration despite all the technology, all the satellites, drones etc.

and You got nothing in comparison, you got broken economy, you are the verge and you are suggesting to start a war with most resilient people on earth? You got open borders everywhere, your entire capability in barely enough to focus on eastern border with india. Even BLA fighters easily come and go from Baluchistan-Iran border. In such scenario, you should know how to survive and how to think with political mind rather then military appraoch. You need to make friends and allies.


VALUE OF AF-TALIBAN
Now let's see What Afghan Taliban has replaced. Afghan Taliban has replaced a very notorous afghan govt that was entirely 100% pro-indian. Their afghan presidents used to spew venom on Pakistan on every international forum and used to speak indian narrative. India had complete access over the Afghanistan, they had their RAW operations are many consulates in forward positions with Pak-border. One must bother why Indians needed so many consulates otherwise. You also need to understand, how much terrorists (TTP) had gained during the rule of previous afghan govt. TTP was largely present and had control over various tribal agencies they had defacto rule and their justice system was being used. They had even reached till Swat. They did their most successful attacks damaging Pakistan military over billions of dollars like attacks on Kamra, Mehran bases. They had full NDS (previous afghan govt intelligence agency) backing. NDS was funded by RAW. The afghan Taliban were enemy of NDS and Afghan national army. Afghan taliban were fighting against them. It was blessing for Pakistan when such Pro-indian govt was removed by Taliban.

Now, on TTP why do you expect Taliban to actively go against them and start a war with them? From their country perspective, TTP is no threat to Afghanistan. No country start a war with a group that is no threat to them but to a third country. They can only assist you if you behave and earn their trust. By the way, with previous ISI chief and right after Taliban take over there were many TTP members that were assasinated in Afghanistan. The Taliban were assisting you but with CIA backed regime change in Pakistan, the new approach is on suicidal path, The CIA backed regime change was for US interests. Pakistan needed to focus on its own interests.

If Pakistan was any smart, it should have made Afghan-Taliban its friend , ally and asset rather thinking to make it an enemy.

Fair assessment, but what did IK ever do on the matter?

He may be a Caretaker PM, & he may not be around for the long haul, but atleast the ball started to roll as soon as he came into the picture.

Lets just hope we can evict as many as possible before the (new) selected PM takes the throne.

Bro, I think you missed mass protests in Swat and other areas of KP. Where people of KP were disgusted on the actions of new ISI chief. Pakistan deliberately allowed TTP fighters to return to Swat with all their gear. ISPR was asked the same question, You know what was the response of ISPR? .. The ISPR said "Some" people are allowed to return to their homes.
BTW, whether its KAKAR or IK these security related decisions are always taken by the GHQ. That's why we don't see any long time or meaningful solutions, because those decisions lack political approach. We see everything with narrow military mind and that's why we are in this mess. Please also see my note above on importance of Afghan Taliban and what kind of notorious pro-indian govt it replaced.

 

[TheSolution]

Bro, In other words, you are suggesting the end of Pakistan.

Pakistan would be the greatest fool on earth to start a war against Afghan Taliban.

Even Super-powers cannot survive in a geographic situation like Pakistan that is sandwiched between two very long borders, the major threat is eastern border where all the capability is focused to. Pakistan would be the greatest fool on the planet ever to exist that will intentionally make its western longest border of 2700 km to become a warzone.

Do you have any idea, how much local support the Taliban will have in pashtun regions of Pakistan. Pakistan will not survive a month. You have zero money for imports and you are suggesting a war with such a vicious and resilient afghan Taliban?

Two of the world's greatest super-powers with 100,000 times more resources than Pakistan got consumed and exhausted in their bid to defeat them and they failed. You won't make even an impact before they burst into your fragile societies and corrupt and injustice system.



Shutting Border is impossible task. Its unthinkable and its hillarious when people suggest this.

LMAO! You know you have literally broken economy. right ?

Even with a trillion dollar economy, Shutting down the border is practically IMPOSSIBLE. There are 1000s of people who cross the border on daily basis undetected. There is no amount of man-power, no amount of technology that can seal a treacherous 2700 km long AF-Pak border that has caves, that has rivers, that has valleys, that has mountains.
I give you two examples:
i) Gaza has only 40 km border with Israel. Israel has all the technology of the world, they got powerful economy, they got all the resources in the world to check this 40 km long border but still every now and then Hamas was able to breach.

ii) You remember President trump was building a wall on Mexican border. That's because a super power like USA is unable to stop inflitration despite all the technology, all the satellites, drones etc.

and You got nothing in comparison, you got broken economy, you are the verge and you are suggesting to start a war with most resilient people on earth? You got open borders everywhere, your entire capability in barely enough to focus on eastern border with india. Even BLA fighters easily come and go from Baluchistan-Iran border. In such scenario, you should know how to survive and how to think with political mind rather then military appraoch. You need to make friends and allies.


VALUE OF AF-TALIBAN
Now let's see What Afghan Taliban has replaced. Afghan Taliban has replaced a very notorous afghan govt that was entirely 100% pro-indian. India had complete access over the Afghanistan, they had their RAW operations are many consulates in forward positions with Pak-border. One must bother why Indians needed so many consulates otherwise. You also need to understand, how much terrorists (TTP) had gained during the rule of previous afghan govt. TTP was largely present and had control over various tribal agencies they had defacto rule and their justice system was being used. They had even reached till Swat. They did their most successful attacks damaging Pakistan military over billions of dollars like attacks on Kamra, Mehran bases. They had full NDS (previous afghan govt intelligence agency) backing. NDS was funded by RAW. The afghan Taliban were enemy of NDS and Afghan national army. Afghan taliban were fighting against them. It was blessing for Pakistan when such Pro-indian govt was removed by Taliban.

Now, on TTP why do you expect Taliban to actively go against them and start a war with them? From their country perspective, TTP is no threat to Afghanistan. No country start a war with a group that is no threat to them but to a third country. They can only assist you if you behave and earn their trust. By the way, with previous ISI chief and right after Taliban take over there were many TTP members that were assasinated in Afghanistan. The Taliban were assisting you but with CIA backed regime change in Pakistan, the new approach is on suicidal path, The CIA backed regime change was for US interests. Pakistan needed to focus on its own interests.

If Pakistan was any smart, it should have made Afghan-Taliban its friend , ally and asset rather thinking to make it an enemy.



Bro, I think you missed mass protests in Swat and other areas of KP. Where people of KP were disgusted on the actions of new ISI chief. Pakistan deliberately allowed TTP fighters to return to Swat with all their gear. ISPR was asked the same question, You know what was the response of ISPR? .. The ISPR said "Some" people are allowed to return to their homes.
BTW, whether its KAKAR or IK these security related decisions are always taken by the GHQ. That's why we don't see any long time or meaningful solutions, because those decisions lack political approach. We see everything with narrow military mind and that's why we are in this mess. Please also see my note above on importance of Afghan Taliban and what kind of notorious pro-indian govt it replaced.

I didn't suggest an invasion of Afghanistan anyway, I suggested providing support to the resistance of minority ethnic groups like Tajiks against the Taliban.

They are the only people who will truly actually put effort into trying to secure the border and not continue land disputes.

Every Afghan Pashtun group no matter the ideology are nationalist chauvinists, everyone suggesting Pakistan did X or didn't do Y or should've made them their friends is naive. They want to occupy KPK and Balochistan, that's the crux of the issue. No amount of swaying can change this.

 

[CivilianSupremacy]

I didn't suggest an invasion of Afghanistan anyway, I suggested providing support to the resistance of minority ethnic groups like Tajiks against the Taliban.

They are the only people who will truly actually put effort into trying to secure the border and not continue land disputes.

LOL! I also didn't said about invasion. I think you are mistaking Pakistan with some great power of the world ? Invasion!! LOL! You should not even think to touch anyone let alone invasion! Don't you think by attacking Taliban's ammo centers you are practically at war with them ?

Do you have even resources or economy for that ? Do you have even have stamina for that ? Do you really hear yourself what you are saying ?

Btw, why do you want to go full circle? Those ethnic groups had a participation in earlier afghan govt and they are totally pro-indian. Your best ever non-indian influence govt is TALIBAN. You wanted this for 20 years and you got this. Taliban are your best chance to have a friendly border Otherwise you are doomed. The non-taliban groups always had a dream to remove Pakistan, so that India and afghanistan can share a border and they get access to the ocean too from baluchistan. You really don't have the idea of the northern alliance which hated Pakistan to the core.

I don't know why I am even debating on this. Or why even there is need to explain this that you cannot start a war that you cannot win. Actually forget winning, you can't even survive after starting that war. You are barely surviving now even without a war.