Possible Solution of Kashmir issue...Your Opinion

[monitor]

Very simple yet difficult give ballot a chance in place of bullet .

 

[Joe Shearer]

Grief and sympathy is in my opinion no substitute to action. There are many members on both sides who are well meaning and decent human beings - no less can be expected from them and no less they will offer. However at large among the populace there is feeling of smug satisfaction and joy.

I am not talking about schools and intellectuals of Delhi and Mumbai but masses of small towns and villages.

All I say is let us have 10 years of uninterrupted peace and then try CBMs this way we can avoid the feeling of betrayal which looms large after every such incident.

There is very little daylight between our positions, actually. As far as the hoi polloi are concerned, those are the same yobs who pelt our cricketers' houses when these cricketers lose a match. Should we bother about them? We already know that their sentiments can be moulded.

 

[nForce]

Very simple yet difficult give ballot a chance in place of bullet .

They have been putting a stamp over that ballot for years. You should check that.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Very simple yet difficult give ballot a chance in place of bullet .

No hard feelings, but that's easy to say for someone who's from one of the successful countries in south Asia.

Being calm and serene isn't quite so possible for us from the less successful countries.

 

[SamantK]

No hard feelings, but that's easy to say for someone who's from one of the successful countries in south Asia.

Being calm and serene isn't quite so possible for us from the less successful countries.

Sir, I agree its not possible for us to be calm and serene cause its the lack of action which leaves a vacuum which gets filled with outrage.

The frantic patriotism on display and the outrage which is generated comes from the fact that we hardly take action over time which creates a vacuum only to be filled with outrage. I would like our leaders to understand that keeping clam does not mean lack of action and if action can be seen the frantic patriotism and outrage will find an ever shrinking real estate.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Sir, I agree its not possible for us to be calm and serene cause its the lack of action which leaves a vacuum which gets filled with outrage.

The frantic patriotism on display and the outrage which is generated comes from the fact that we hardly take action over time which creates a vacuum only to be filled with outrage. I would like our leaders to understand that keeping clam does not mean lack of action and if action can be seen the frantic patriotism and outrage will find an ever shrinking real estate.

Bear with me while I talk to myself, trying to understand the situation (in fifteen minutes or so from now).

 

[Spectre]

There is very little daylight between our positions, actually. As far as the hoi polloi are concerned, those are the same yobs who pelt our cricketers' houses when these cricketers lose a match. Should we bother about them? We already know that their sentiments can be moulded.

Very interesting question which has occupied social scientist for decades.

Who are the primary Shapers of Public Opinion?

1. Media
2. Leaders
3. Entertainment

Now the tricky part is that all three of the above are themselves are driven by public opinion as they essentially cater to the wishes of masses. There is no clear cut causal relationships.

What can be done is to build up a narrative to suit your purpose but the whole thing will come down like a pack of cards as soon as there is an instigating event.

The buffer or the elasticity factor is present In Indo-China relationship but not here because of the repeated violation of trust by both sides.

Hence we need a long cooling off period before we can press the re-set button and restart the CBMs otherwise all we would see are the abortive attempts like NSA talks as public opinion in both countries are against any rapprochement.

 

[SirHatesALot]

Just keep the LOC calm.
As for solution this generation cant give it hopefully next one will.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Very interesting question which has occupied social scientist for decades.

Who are the primary Shapers of Public Opinion?

1. Media
2. Leaders
3. Entertainment

Now the tricky part is that all three of the above are themselves are driven by public opinion as they essentially cater to the wishes of masses. There is no clear cut causal relationships.

What can be done is to build up a narrative to suit your purpose but the whole thing will come down like a pack of cards as soon as there is an instigating event.

The buffer or the elasticity factor is present In Indo-China relationship but not here because of the repeated violation of trust by both sides.

Hence we need a long cooling off period before we can press the re-set button and restart the CBMs otherwise all we would see are the abortive attempts like NSA talks as public opinion in both countries are against any rapprochement.

Point taken, but that's sidestepping. It was a fact that your model of an interaction was useful. It was unusual and thought-provoking.

 

[nForce]

I think best solution is for Pakistan India is to nuke each other. Than Bangladesh Iran and Afghanistan can divide that land with each other

Why nuke each other ? If both countries nuke each other, then each gets a nuke right ? Tell you what, just nuke yourself. We will just pass.

 

[Bang Galore]

As I mentioned, I don't agree.

Just now, there is a pall of gloom over our little group, because of the evident and palpable grief of our Pakistani friends. When a nasty incident happens in India, there is a similar pall of gloom, and completely unrestricted, unrestrained, warm sympathy from them in turn. That includes incidents which under different circumstances, they might have glossed over. Not worse than that, but it's a long distance from where they are.

Sometimes I wonder whether the only thing that happens with such contacts is a creation of a bubble, that tend to grow more & more isolated before being popped. Friendships have that effect.

I believe that the events of 26/11 have changed us as a people.Many Pakistanis & some Indians attribute the recent tensions on the border/LoC and the diplomatic impasse on the arrival to the scene of Mr.Modi. That obfuscates the fact that 65 years of Indo-Pakistani relations had passed before his arrival. The events of 26/11 happened on the watch of PM Manmohan Singh, probably the last in terms of generation & temperament who were willing to go the extra mile with Pakistan. Yet the man who had come so close with Musharraf ended his term with some of the highest friction with Pakistan, both on the border from 2013 onwards and on the diplomatic front (too many people focus on Modi cancelling the FS talks of last year, not on the fact that he attempted to restart it after 3 years of no talks)

My submission is that this is a much deeper problem, not something that will be sorted out by things like people to people contact etc. One may be friends with specific Pakistanis but that will, if it has to survive, become a friendship inspite of their nationality, not because of it. I do not believe that can ever have more than a notional impact on the debate, especially when most Indians think that ordinary Pakistanis have little ability to influence their establishment. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for more people to people contacts etc, direct people to people contacts. Not necessarily seminars & conferences which will be generally dismissed as attracting people of a particular manner of thinking alone. I just don't think that by itself, it will make a fundamental difference to the situation.

 

[hamayunpk]

Why are we even having this discussion. There lies a simple solution that was determined by UN in 1948. Simple as that. I am Pakistan but seriously, who are we to decide? There must be an independent voting in both parts of the valley at once and under UN observation. But then again, India knows the result, so they won't agree on it.

 

[Butchcassidy]

Solution number 1 is: Give Kashmir Valley to Pakistan and keep rest of Kashmir
Solution number 2: Leave it as it is and focus on other things
Solution number 3: war and snatch each others land
Solution number 4: referendum as agreed on first day of dispute and let people decide about their fate. The only logical solution is the solution number 4

Solution 2 is the only logical solution mere bhai. Neither India nor Pakistan is going to give up an inch of their land. Make loc the IB, and solve other problems that plague south asia

 

[Shamain]

Let the people decide.

Solution 2 is the only logical solution mere bhai. Neither India nor Pakistan is going to give up an inch of their land. Make loc the IB, and solve other problems that plague south asia

Kashmiri freedom fight is indigenous. Even if ib is formed u think those oppressed ppl will abandon arms? Do u even realize the ppl of valley have seen so much pain that they dont even care for pakistani support. They know they have to fight whether pakistan stands by them or not.
This is just in ur head that there will be peace in south asia. There will never be peace in south asia unless kashmir matter is resolved per kashmiris' and other ppl's wishes who inhabit the region, whether pakistan actively pursues the issue or not. Let it stay this way ,let ur massive number of troops sit their snd take a toll on treasury, let them commit suicide out of depression, and let the killng and rape of kashmiris go on as perhaps ur forces enjoy doing thsy but in turn also enjoy the killing of ur own troops by the freedom fighters.

Let it go on.

 

[Bang Galore]

Let the people decide.

Kashmiri freedom fight is indigenous. Even if ib is formed u think those oppressed ppl will abandon arms? Do u even realize the ppl of valley have seen so much pain that they dont even care for pakistani support. They know they have to fight whether pakistan stands by them or not.
This is just in ur head that there will be peace in south asia. There will never be peace in south asia unless kashmir matter is resolved per kashmiris' and other ppl's wishes who inhabit the region, whether pakistan actively pursues the issue or not. Let it stay this way ,let ur massive number of troops sit their snd take a toll on treasury, let them commit suicide out of depression, and let the killng and rape of kashmiris go on as perhaps ur forces enjoy doing thsy but in turn also enjoy the killing of ur own troops by the freedom fighters.

Let it go on.

We can live without peace then. The idea here is to offer what people think are workable solutions, i.e. that which all parties concerned can live with, status quo is fine if there isn't one. Pipe dreams can be enjoyed elsewhere.