Pakistan's Mirage 2000 Saga

[Abingdonboy]

Any update on UAE Mirage-2000-9? Are we still interested in them?

Very unlikely. The PAF is short on funds and is making up for this with the cheap JK-17s. The F-16s make up the high end of the PAF- no need to add M2Ks to the mix now.

 

[shanixee]

Very unlikely. The PAF is short on funds and is making up for this with the cheap JK-17s. The F-16s make up the high end of the PAF- no need to add M2Ks to the mix now.

As per my information, PAF is still interested in UAE Mirages and they are still in talks with them...because of few small hitches its still not finalized...but the project is not dead this is for sure...

 

[Abingdonboy]

As per my information, PAF is still interested in UAE Mirages and they are still in talks with them...because of few small hitches its still not finalized...but the project is not dead this is for sure...

Highly unlikely IMHO. Seems to be same stuck record with PAF- shows interest in everything under the sun but actual concrete deals seem to be very few and far between. And is the PAF really so eager to trust the supplier of spares and maintenance for M2Ks who is about to get up to $20BN from Pakistan's arch rival in the near future?


And will the PAF want to be operating 5 different types of single engine fighter in the near future?


Then there is the question of finance- those UAE M2Ks aren't going to come cheap.


Which ever way you cut it a M2K for the PAF looks unlikely.

 

[shanixee]

The information I shared is from a very reliable source...sorry cant quote the source but yes PAF is still under talks with the UAE...Money is 1 factor because of which the deal has not struck till now...remember PAF has mirage rebuilt factory and lots of past experience in Mirages....this is 1 reason PAF is very interested in MK2 and been told to me...
The offer which PAF has made UAE wants more then that...few more reasons they are not that big..
but things are still hot...

 

[shanixee]

I wish i could reveal my source....but unfortunately i cant...but things were very hot 4-5 months ago..i dont know wats the latest now..

 

[FaujHistorian]

As per my information, PAF is still interested in UAE Mirages and they are still in talks with them...because of few small hitches its still not finalized...but the project is not dead this is for sure...

There is just one "small hitch" my friend, just one! Money money money money money!


Our people and our army wants to bamboozle the West, and then expect that the same West and its gulf allies will give us expensive stuff for free. yes free free free free free.

This is the same reason, Chinese have run away from us. Because our government doesn't want to pay or doesn't have money to pay for the big stuff like fighter planes, power plants etc.

Not to TC, even Turkey is sick and tired of our shenanigans. Look how we confiscated their power plant carrying ships.

Unless we fix our attitude as a nation, and start working nicely as a nation to help out the West and its allies, the Mirages will remain a mirage in the gulf desert (if you know what I mean).

peace

 

[shanixee]

There is just one "small hitch" my friend, just one! Money money money money money!


Our people and our army wants to bamboozle the West, and then expect that the same West and its gulf allies will give us expensive stuff for free. yes free free free free free.

This is the same reason, Chinese have run away from us. Because our government doesn't want to pay or doesn't have money to pay for the big stuff like fighter planes, power plants etc.

Not to TC, even Turkey is sick and tired of our shenanigans. Look how we confiscated their power plant carrying ships.

Unless we fix our attitude as a nation, and start working nicely as a nation to help out the West and its allies, the Mirages will remain a mirage in the gulf desert (if you know what I mean).

peace

.............................................

 

[Liquidmetal]

There is just one "small hitch" my friend, just one! Money money money money money!


Our people and our army wants to bamboozle the West, and then expect that the same West and its gulf allies will give us expensive stuff for free. yes free free free free free.

This is the same reason, Chinese have run away from us. Because our government doesn't want to pay or doesn't have money to pay for the big stuff like fighter planes, power plants etc.

Not to TC, even Turkey is sick and tired of our shenanigans. Look how we confiscated their power plant carrying ships.

Unless we fix our attitude as a nation, and start working nicely as a nation to help out the West and its allies, the Mirages will remain a mirage in the gulf desert (if you know what I mean).

peace

Excellent post, but Fauji... what do u expect when our country is being run by crooks. Our PM is a not to bright but corrupt as hell idiot, how can we be taken seriously when our President is a man of so many 10%s. Our other leaders are the same and then we have the born again muslim Khan to look forward to. We have to wake up and smell the coffee, let us start with making peace with the world, imagine how quickly those mirages will become real if we started diplomatic relations with Israel!!!

Peace to you too.

 

[Edevelop]

Highly unlikely IMHO. Seems to be same stuck record with PAF- shows interest in everything under the sun but actual concrete deals seem to be very few and far between. And is the PAF really so eager to trust the supplier of spares and maintenance for M2Ks who is about to get up to $20BN from Pakistan's arch rival in the near future?


And will the PAF want to be operating 5 different types of single engine fighter in the near future?


Then there is the question of finance- those UAE M2Ks aren't going to come cheap.


Which ever way you cut it a M2K for the PAF looks unlikely.

Why not ? Today, Mirage III/V, F-7PG, F-16, JF-17 (the existing fighters) are all single engined aren't they ?

Since UAE's fleet is like around 60-65, you never know they might sell 1 squadron each to respective countries that are showing interest (Pakistan, Iraq, Egypt).

JF-17s and F-16 MLU (up to 350 aircrafts) will replace ageing aircrafts and swill probably be used for defence. Only the F-16 Block 52 (18 aircrafts) right now are used for special missions. The Mirage 2000's are basically strike fighters therefore adding 1 squadron (18 aircrafts) could very well fit in with Block 52s.

J-10B (another single engined) is also a significant asset out there but PAF will probably induct no more than 50 due to financial restrictions. I guess they could replace JF-17 Block 1s and increase the total inventory. They have to be bought to counter IAF's Rafale.

 

[FaujHistorian]

Excellent post, but Fauji... what do u expect when our country is being run by crooks. Our PM is a not to bright but corrupt as hell idiot, how can we be taken seriously when our President is a man of so many 10%s. Our other leaders are the same and then we have the born again muslim Khan to look forward to. We have to wake up and smell the coffee, let us start with making peace with the world, imagine how quickly those mirages will become real if we started diplomatic relations with Israel!!!

Peace to you too.

Thank you.

Our leaders are from us. They are not from Mars or another galaxy.

Sure they ought to be blamed.

But at the same time, us the educated elite must take 80% of the blame.


We are the ones driving the trends and thoughts in the country.

If we in a majority decide to make our country an honest, and tolerant place for every man and woman regardless of their religion or race, we can.

If we in a majority decide to make our country an good place of business (like China) for every country regardless of their religion or race, we can.

So the blame goes to us the educated elite if our country is in the ditches

And

hopefully one day

our country will be prosperous and forward looking, then the credit will go to us as well.

Gadari, rental raja are just drama. So please do not focus too much on them.


peace

 

[Abingdonboy]

Why not ? Today, Mirage III/V, F-7PG, F-16, JF-17 (the existing fighters) are all single engined aren't they ?

5 different fighters for a force as small as the PAF with the budget constraints of the PAF equals a major logistical nightmare. At a time when the PAF should be looking to decrease the diversity of its fleet you are calling for the additional of even more different fighters? The PAF doesn't seem to have any long-term planning or atleast the funds to meet long-term plans as the procurement is very "higgldy piggldy"/patchwork. With a few batches here of x, a few here of y. And the fact is most of the different fighters in the PAF serve the exact same role so adding layer after layer of different a/c is only adding to logisictal, maintenance and training costs and not actually adding to the lethality of the AF.

 

[shanixee]

Thank you.

Our leaders are from us. They are not from Mars or another galaxy.

Sure they ought to be blamed.

But at the same time, us the educated elite must take 80% of the blame.


We are the ones driving the trends and thoughts in the country.

If we in a majority decide to make our country an honest, and tolerant place for every man and woman regardless of their religion or race, we can.

If we in a majority decide to make our country an good place of business (like China) for every country regardless of their religion or race, we can.

So the blame goes to us the educated elite if our country is in the ditches

And

hopefully one day

our country will be prosperous and forward looking, then the credit will go to us as well.

Gadari, rental raja are just drama. So please do not focus too much on them.


peace

My friend this discussion is not about our politician or about the people..we all know wat they are like and wat we are..

I just shared my info about the MK2 deal which is still on hold...this is it...

 

[Edevelop]

5 different fighters for a force as small as the PAF with the budget constraints of the PAF equals a major logistical nightmare. At a time when the PAF should be looking to decrease the diversity of its fleet you are calling for the additional of even more different fighters? The PAF doesn't seem to have any long-term planning or atleast the funds to meet long-term plans as the procurement is very "higgldy piggldy"/patchwork. With a few batches here of x, a few here of y. And the fact is most of the different fighters in the PAF serve the exact same role so adding layer after layer of different a/c is only adding to logisictal, maintenance and training costs and not actually adding to the lethality of the AF.

As Shanixee mentioned, we have Mirage rebuilding factory. This means, maintenance and training will not be an issue. No doubt our air force has a limited budget, but if our friend has pointed out the fact that there is an interest, then i think its best for us to keep quite and let the professional force make moves that they think could work.

 

[shanixee]

5 different fighters for a force as small as the PAF with the budget constraints of the PAF equals a major logistical nightmare. At a time when the PAF should be looking to decrease the diversity of its fleet you are calling for the additional of even more different fighters? The PAF doesn't seem to have any long-term planning or atleast the funds to meet long-term plans as the procurement is very "higgldy piggldy"/patchwork. With a few batches here of x, a few here of y. And the fact is most of the different fighters in the PAF serve the exact same role so adding layer after layer of different a/c is only adding to logistical, maintenance and training costs and not actually adding to the lethality of the AF.

not exactly...because PAF has an experience of maintaining Mirages since 40 years and we hve got a big infrastructure of mirages as rebuilding not to forget PAF is keen to replace their old Mirages and F7p... so I dont think so it ill create a big problem or nightmare...
the air to ground capability of MK@ which UAE has is better then F16 block 52

 

[Abingdonboy]

not exactly...because PAF has an experience of maintaining Mirages since 40 years and we hve got a big infrastructure of mirages as rebuilding not to forget PAF is keen to replace their old Mirages and F7p... so I dont think so it ill create a big problem or nightmare...
the air to ground capability of MK@ which UAE has is better then F16 block 52

Fair enough, we will have to wait and see but all i am saying is that this deal is very unlikely. Good luck anyway!