Pakistan's Army Is the Real Obstacle to Peace

[lionheart1]

And if you show us that Pakistan's civilian leadership has demonstrated accountability to the people of Pakistan, we all will SHUT UP.

when army has ruled your country more than half of your independent history , how much more accountable they where than civilian leadership . due to democracy , civilian have power to remove your government , if they really didnt liked your present govt , but what about dictatorial leadership

all the dictator of pakistan are from army - how good they where there

 

[pak-marine]

its a bitter truth our armed forces are no saint , they are the biggest obstacle in peace and they are responsible for where the country is today

 

[W.11]

zia introduced laws in the late 80s, but the scums are now trying to question it, where was taseer in benazir's time??, where were these people who are now getting assassinated????

zia was right, pakistanis supported him, but this zardari party is destroying the image of pakistan along side nurturing cia in its backyard...

 

[rockstarIN]

Mira sethi is Najam sethi's daughter so no wonder that there is similarity in views.

Sethi was born in May, 1948. He is married to Jugnu Mohsin who is Managing Editor of The Friday Times and Good Times. Their son Ali Sethi is a novelist and daughter Mira Sethi works at the Wall Street Journal in New York.

However my advice to Mira sethi!

It is because of this army that you are sitting comfortably in your home typing this nonsense. It is the same army who is fighting WOT .The same army who guard the borders day in and day out without any idea that there services could be belittled by such self pro-claimed writers.

Thats their job, like a farmer, accountant etc. Give them respect because their job is risky but why are you giving them the power to dictate you? they are not train to do that.

 

[Solomon2]

why are you dragging in the moderator thingy ??...I replied you as a Pakistani and not as a moderator.

And that is how I understood you. I just wrote "moderator" to distinguish you from the other commentators, that's all.

when the dictator comes why don't you guys sanction that country ??

Because the U.S. has to work with foreign governments to achieve its own ends the U.S. can't always make the saintly and aloof choice. Why would that excuse ANY Pakistani?

you, the so called biggest champion of democracy around the world, should have acted like one...

You think I didn't? When my government failed me I did my best to stand with the champions of democracy: linkI could wish there were more Americans who do the same as I.

i did not defended the army, i said they are the same, wht makes them different, they are human being too, thus prone to blunders.

It is an excuse for not opposing evil, Taimikhan. Jews see a lot of this and many know it for what it is.

do criticize the political leadership too, which leaves vacuums to be filled by the army.

In a proper democracy there are no "vacuums": the armed forces are accountable to the elected leadership. In Pakistan the generals kick out the elected leadership when they feel personally threatened. It's backwards.

when politicians are not upto their mark, who else will take their place, the army obviously...Had political leaders been strong -

Strength belongs to the Army. In a democracy legitimacy belongs to the elect. That's why in America generals who appeal to public opinion in defiance of the President are removed from command.

alas here, when politicians are removed, ordinary masses distribute sweets on getting rid of the politicians and welcome the army and the cycle goes on.

The generals aren't yours; they belong only to themselves. Only your elected politicians are yours. But in defiance of reality you don't see things that way. Maybe now you can understand why we Americans, from puny advocates like me to movie stars to ambassadors, feel frustration and despair at the way Pakistanis of all classes think, evaluate, and make value choices.

 

[Xeric]

An ill-researched article.

Not that i am belittling them, but i never knew that ST and Bhatti were the face of the Pakistani leadership.

95% of the total blasphemy cases were registered against Muslims, only 5% non-Muslims (that is to Christians) were involved in this. With this, bringing in the Bhatti-Blasphemy-Murder tinge to the story tells us alot about the 'indepth' analysis conducted by Ms Mira to conceive this article. Not that Mr Bhatti was not struggling for a righteous cause, also we all know that he was a brave man with strong resolve who stood against all odds and in the end sacrificed his life for it, but then for fcuks sakes let's not politicize this event. It's sick!!

Ms Mira wrote laurels while she educated us all regarding how the Pakistan Army created the mujahideens, brought them up and still pampers them, but she shamelessly forgot the sacrifices that the same Army has given to eliminate terrorism. She also skipped that 9/11 was planned and executed by Arabs (AQ) and NOT Pakistanis or Talibans, but still it is Pakistan who has suffered the most and still continues to suffer since that day it joined hands with the US on WoT. She probably doesnt know (and i dont blame her as we all can see the effort that has been put in while penning this article) that the only sin the Talibs committed was to 'shelter' UBL, thereon it was the fcuked up strategy of the US (who the heck had to ensure stuff like sealing the border ect) which brought their war upon us and still the likes of Solomon has the cheeks to tell us who is right and whois not. Believe me S, with the kind of repo your nation enjoys, you dont have any right to play a righteous dude here, come what may.

So, let's not overload our common sense, we all for one know very well who brought this shyt across our borders and how, yes we had our reasons for justifying some of our locals providing support to these thugs, but then we are quite lucid as regards to the difference between some indigenous movements (to some extent TNSM in Swat can fit in this category) and the planned ingress of marauders and well-deliberated transition of our society.

BTW, if anyone didnt know, today Pakistan has a very dynamic and clear-headed civil society who has the ability to decide upon the issues at their own ends without any help from some uber-liberal expatriates. No one, i repeat no one with a sane mind and a certain level of awareness has displayed joy over the murders of ST and Bhatti, only those with a skewed view point and those who has a tunnel vision 'celebrated' the incidents, but the guess what, dont every nation have their own share of a$$holes on this planet we call Earth, these days? Or may be you people want me to narrate them all, that too in chronological order (this is with reference to the likes of Solomon and my omni-clean indians)?!

 

[Solomon2]

95% of the total blasphemy cases were registered against Muslims, only 5% non-Muslims (that is to Christians) were involved in this. With this, bringing in the Bhatti-Blasphemy-Murder tinge to the story tells us alot about the 'indepth' analysis conducted by Ms Mira to conceive this article.

Mira didn't claim that Bhatti was murdered for blasphemy, but for "doing his job."

Not that Mr Bhatti was not struggling for a righteous cause...but -

In other words, you refuse to make his righteous cause your own. Is that an appropriate way to honor his memory?

Ms Mira...shamelessly forgot the sacrifices that the same Army has given to eliminate terrorism.

And you are glossing over the incompetence and irresponsibility of an Army that bred "stateless" terrorists to go after its enemies yet allowed the to escape control and run amok among its own citizens instead. Those soldiers didn't have to die if Pakistan wasn't so keen on embracing terrorism.

She also skipped that 9/11 was planned and executed by Arabs (AQ) and NOT Pakistanis or Talibans, but still it is Pakistan who has suffered the most and still continues to suffer -

She thinks that 9/11's most important effect is that it allowed Pakistan's Army to extract huge funds from the U.S. once more. You know your officials. Would they really think sacrificing a couple of thousand little Pakistanis and a few big opponents wasn't worth the price of keeping their wealth and power? Their fathers, after all, were the ones who invaded and raped and slew East Pakistan into Bangladesh, and were not called to account afterward.

She probably doesnt know (and i dont blame her as we all can see the effort that has been put in while penning this article) that the only sin the Talibs committed was to 'shelter' UBL

Xeric, I think you're among the more sane Pakistanis here, but this line either shows you as ignorant or (more likely) as one who makes extremely repulsive value choices if you think that was the Taliban's only sin!

, thereon it was the fcuked up strategy of the US (who the heck had to ensure stuff like sealing the border ect)

As the P.A. knows quite well, "sealing" borders is a fool's errand that wastes resources, not sound strategy.

still the likes of Solomon has the cheeks to tell us who is right and whois not.

Yes.

Believe me S, with the kind of repo your nation enjoys, you dont have any right to play a righteous dude here, come what may.

I do not believe you. Among the Egyptians it was precisely the righteousness of the Bush Administration at democracy-promotion that the revolutionaries found appealing.

So, let's not overload our common sense, we all for one know very well who brought this shyt across our borders -

The P.A. did when it provided refuge to the Talibs in 2001.

and how, yes we had our reasons for justifying some of our locals providing support to these thugs, but then we are quite lucid as regards to the difference between some indigenous movements (to some extent TNSM in Swat can fit in this category) and the planned ingress of marauders and well-deliberated transition of our society.

Sorry, don't understand, could you expand this explanation further?

today Pakistan has a very dynamic and clear-headed civil society who has the ability to decide upon the issues at their own ends without any help from some uber-liberal expatriates. No one, i repeat no one with a sane mind and a certain level of awareness has displayed joy over the murders of ST and Bhatti -

Judging by the cheering lawyers who supported ST's murder, aren't the "sane minds" less clear-headed than they have ever been?

dont every nation have their own share of a$$holes on this planet we call Earth, these days?

I call that the "everyone is equally good" fallacy. Take a tour of a prison sometime. Doesn't it have its own share of a$$holes? Who is to say that the population in a prison is any better than the one outside it? Aren't prisoners just as good as everyone else?

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Ms. Sethi, a native of Lahore, Pakistan, is assistant books editor at the Journal.

nice fantasy writer
if that writer is really a Lahore native then she should pray that the evil army doesnt feed her to taliban

 

[Karachiite]

Exactly it's the army that's saving her butt from being wrecked by the taliban. And is she related to that bser Najam Sethi?

 

[Shinigami]

I blame India for what is happening today in pakistan.

If India did not break pakistan in 71, "Radical Islamization" of the society would not have occured.

Oh... the futility of war.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

I blame India for what is happening today in pakistan.

If India did not break pakistan in 71, "Radical Islamization" of the society would not have occured.

Oh... the futility of war.

Sarcasm?.................

 

[Pak_Sher]

Pakistan's Army Is the Real Obstacle to Peace

Mira Sethi: Pakistan's Army Is the Real Obstacle to Peace - WSJ.com

By MIRA SETHI

Two months after Salman Taseer, the governor of Pakistan's Punjab province, was assassinated by his own bodyguard for criticizing the country's blasphemy law, the only Christian member of the Pakistani cabinet, Minorities Minister Shahbaz Bhatti, was killed for doing his job—advocating protection of the country's two million Christians.

Taseer's assassination prompted a debate: Was the blasphemy law, introduced by Gen. Zia ul-Haq in the 1980s in his bid to "Islamize" Pakistan, being exploited for mundane interests? Was it leading to witch hunts? Bhatti's death should prompt Pakistanis to ask themselves an equally disquieting question: Does Pakistan have a future as a successful nation state, at peace with itself and the world?

The civilian government's reaction to Bhatti's death has outraged many Muslim and Christian Pakistanis. As after Taseer's murder, it retreated into vague bromides. At Bhatti's funeral in Islamabad, Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gillani vowed to "do the utmost to bring the culprits to justice." There was no mention of who these culprits were (the Tehreek-e-Taliban of Punjab has claimed responsibility), no mention of the ideologies, religious parties and jihadi organizations fueling their actions, and no mention of the blasphemy laws that Bhatti had campaigned against.

But the deaths of Taseer and Bhatti are the outcome not just of the Pakistan People's Party abandonment of the principles that once made it an appealing, popular force. They are the result of a decades-long imbalance in governance and power, which now has the PPP and other liberal and centrist civilians cowering in fear.

The failure of the political classes to initiate democratic, constitutional reform after Pakistan's separation from India in 1947 enabled the military to quickly define "national interest" as an anti-India ideology. This ideology, a type of Islamic nationalism, is one from which the Pakistan military has reaped rich dividends. It has kept civilian politicians on the defensive and the people numbed.

With the onset of the Cold War the U.S. armed Pakistan for its own strategic purposes. When the Pakistani army undertook adventures creating instability in the region—wars with India and attempts, eventually successful, to build nuclear weapons—the U.S. suspended military and economic aid.

But the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan in 1979 put the Pentagon and the Pakistani army on good terms again. This time, Gen. Zia extracted huge sums from Washington: Pakistan's army was paid billions of dollars in direct correlation to its usefulness in organizing an anti-Soviet Islamic jihad. The '90s saw a nasty separation—aid was suspended again—and a reunion followed after 9/11, when the U.S. needed Pakistan's help in Afghanistan.

Now Zia's "children" have come of age. Extremists of all stripes—the Taliban and the mujahedeen—roam the streets of Lahore and Karachi unchecked by the security agencies who once thought it would be a good idea to arm them. Anger and frustration fueled by inequality are making young Pakistanis turn to religion for answers.

As in Egypt, over 60% of the population of Pakistan is under 25. Unlike Egypt, they want an Islamic revolution, not a democratic one. Salman Taseer's police bodyguard—all of 26 years old—killed him for "insulting" the Prophet Muhammad. (The governor had criticized a manmade blasphemy law, not the Prophet, but his assassin didn't know the difference).

Slowly, the U.S. is beginning to understand that Pakistan's existential confusion is the result of the grand strategic designs of the Pakistani military, an army that has carried out three coups to thwart the development of a democratic political system. In the process, Pakistan's civilian leadership has been eliminated—Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto hanged, Benazir Bhutto, Taseer and Bhatti assassinated—the country dismembered, ethnic subnationalism, regional tension and inequalities aggravated.

The U.S. must support civilian supremacy and recognize the Pakistani army's game for what it is. Alarmed by the idea that if America leaves Afghanistan its U.S. funds will dwindle, the military is loath to crush the Islamist warriors who can be "calibrated" to deliver strategic value to it. Until the U.S. recognizes this, Pakistan's military will continue to hold the world to ransom.

Ms. Sethi, a native of Lahore, Pakistan, is assistant books editor at the Journal.

Just opinion and WSJ Employment bias. Ms. Mira may get laid off, if she writes the truth. Western sources are all biased just like western policies. Bahrain King killing his own people, but US Naval Fleet is there, no-fly zone, NO NO. Libya against Israel, Yes Yes, no-fly zone snce Libya is killing its own people.

Such BS.

 

[IND151]

Another Indian BULLSHIT like always crying like always. India is always behind Pakistan I think India should take care of its poor country where 55 freedom movements are in effect in India. So please shut up....

any source for bolded part? dont you guys back arundhati Roy's anti India statements?

 

[jahangeer yousaf]

writer has gone mad he needs some treatment ..... he should visit mental hospital near by cardialogy...........and dr should give him shock over there idiot

 

[kursed]

Criticizing security policies of a certain institution is not automatically akin to withdrawing support from your troops, that's the argument which Republicans waged against the Democrats, before the last Presidential election. And it was as hollow in their case as it is here.

That said, both civilians and the armed forces personnel need to realize the fact that they belong to the same country. And not one party, neither the civvies nor the military folks are to 'question' each others patriotism, should differences exist b/w their points of view. Just because a person chooses to question or even criticize certain policies followed by the armed forces, it doesn't make him any less patriotic than any other Pakistani. The same argument goes for the civilians as well, which have more recently resorted to blaming the army for every evil that Pakistan confronts today.

Yes, politicians do actually invite the military to take part in politics, but this should also not be forgotten that the very people responsible for the making of the state of Pakistan were sidelined by the military back in 1958. The present lot of politicians (or the lack thereof) didn't come out of a vacuum. This phenomenon has very specific and certain reasons, which explain why we have such an incompetent lot of politicians ruling us today.

And in the same vein, no one - not even the army (except for the time of Gen. Zia) has ever stopped the civilians from paying attention to the well being of civil institutions, be it public services or simply good governance or even law and order. In that case, civilians are very much responsible for losing sight of what was supposed to be their ultimate duty towards the state of Pakistan.

But yes, as of today, the need is essential to stop considering security and foreign policies as means of enhancing clout of one single institution only. The armed forces of Pakistan need to increase civilian input when devising their policies (and not just intimidate them of their decisions). The legitimacy that they crave, can only be obtained via this way. The time to twist arms and doing what they thought was best, is fast running out.

P.S.
The idea that a soldier wages war at the borders while the rest of Pakistanis sit home and enjoy themselves is fallacious because the same soldier is paid for by the taxes of millions of Pakistanis in the country. The army does not generate funds on its own, it's run by the money of people of Pakistan. The points here is not to undermine the army, but to make clear that no Pakistani can gloat about his moral superiority over the other based on their nature of work.

That's the precise thought process, which leads to further divisions between the military and civil mindset - eventually leading to both sides opting to pick each other apart over every tiny issue.