Pakistani pilot Saiful Azam

[EyelessInGaza]

Hi,

Do you guys know about the atrocities the jews committed upon the russians---millions of russians were killed by the jews----.

Why do you think the jews are hated so much----inocent russians in millions muhink rdered in concentration camps.

Pakistanis think of the jews as weak and meek----.

My children----the jews have been the enforcers of the mafia in the u s for the longest term---. Do not ever take them for granted.

What atrocities were these committed by the Jews on the Russians?

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

You're flaming me. My point is, I posted a rebuttal of the "facts" from a source of great quality and you responded by repeating the very thing that was rebutted, without change. Now you're stooping to insult.

Why should other Pakistanis respect you, then? Indeed, why should you respect yourself?

you're picking a fight with one of the most respected members on the forum

and you're no David, brah. . .


the subject here is about one of the most celebrated pilots in the history of the PAF and some shmuck-tards are bringing up some event which happened AGES and AGES ago --- an event which didn't affect us, had not connection to us -- and quite frankly - 100% of the people on this forum weren't even alive when this overly-sensationalized (ammunitionized) event took place --- one in which MANY MANY non-Jewish european nationals/dissenters were also sent (i.e. the concentration camps)

so give it a God damned rest --- nobody here cares about talking about the holocaust. This is a defence forum. Go work for AIPAC or go join another political forum where such things can be discussed. Here, nobody cares. Doesnt mean to condone such an atrocity -- but we just dont care to hear it.

i cant speak on everyone's behalf -- but I'm telling it how it is. Move the f*ck on and stop crying over something that happened quite close to a friggin century ago.


God damn!

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Hi,

Do you guys know about the atrocities the jews committed upon the russians---millions of russians were killed by the jews----.

Why do you think the jews are hated so much----inocent russians in millions muhink rdered in concentration camps.

Pakistanis think of the jews as weak and meek----.

My children----the jews have been the enforcers of the mafia in the u s for the longest term---. Do not ever take them for granted.

well to their credit -- through hook or by crook they worked hard and stayed united; they pool their resources.....they mix religion with business (kosher just means that jews go buy food that's been blessed by a jew and prepared a certain way -- meaning patrons and patronage within that group)

we're not too different...i drive half hour out of my way to go to a halal meat shop rather than local grocery store (as some of you know, im currently living in the west as a grad student under modest accommodation)

i can understand Hitler's nationalism and fury -- though it didnt justify the whole "cleansing part"

i wont call it ethnic cleansing because "jew" sure as hell aint an ethnic group; it was just a mass murder of presumably innocent people





thats it on jewery and so-called holocausts......lets all revert back to THE ACTUAL topic

 

[500]

Israel was not alone. It had the backing of USA the SATAN himself.

No, USA was not on Israel's side in 1967.

If Israel had been in danger, then USA would have stepped in to help it out.

No, even after 1967 US would never intervene.

And also, Israel attakced the Arab armies on Eid day when most of the army was off on holidays.

Rubbish.

Its Arabs who attacked Israel on its holiest day in 1973.

 

[EyelessInGaza]

.........
i can understand Hitler's nationalism and fury -- though it didnt justify the whole "cleansing part"

...........

This is all OT, but since you've mentioned it....

What part of Hitler's nationalism and fury can you understand? And if it did not justify the whole "cleansing", what part of the cleansing would it have justified?

 

[Solomon2]

you're picking a fight with one of the most respected members on the forum and you're no David...

I was thinking the same thing but drew a completely different conclusion: since MY arguments can be backed up and Windy's can't, then it's everybody who respects Windy who is at at fault, not myself. Doubtless many Pakistanis find such a conclusion repugnant - but it's all a piece with the problems Pakistan has had since Day One, and continues to have today: the enshrinement of convenient opinion over fact, "convenience" being defined as acceding to the wealthy or powerful rather than pursuing the inconvenient and more difficult path of justice.

It really isn't fair that Pakistan's bravest tend to get murdered by cowardly militants. Then again, it's very bad the the Bhuttos and Taseers and Shahzads die and the response of so many of Pakistan's young is to cheer and continue to look for ways to make money and increase their personal prestige, rather than spend an ounce of time and effort respecting their sacrifice and working to improve public welfare.

the subject here is about one of the most celebrated pilots in the history of the PAF -

Oh, is that right?

and some shmuck-tards are bringing up some event which happened AGES and AGES ago ---

In short, you don't want your preferred story to be challenged by facts.

Move the f*ck on and stop crying over something that happened quite close to a friggin century ago.

At the rate your going some day it'll be YOUR funeral when people will say, "Forget about how he died, let's just move the f*ck on."

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

I was thinking the same thing but drew a completely different conclusion: since MY arguments can be backed up and Windy's can't, then it's everybody who respects Windy who is at at fault, not myself. Doubtless many Pakistanis find such a conclusion repugnant - but it's all a piece with the problems Pakistan has had since Day One, and continues to have today: the enshrinement of convenient opinion over fact, "convenience" being defined as acceding to the wealthy or powerful rather than pursuing the inconvenient and more difficult path of justice.

you don't have an argument

It really isn't fair that Pakistan's bravest tend to get murdered by cowardly militants. Then again, it's very bad the the Bhuttos and Taseers and Shahzads die and the response of so many of Pakistan's young is to cheer and continue to look for ways to make money and increase their personal prestige, rather than spend an ounce of time and effort respecting their sacrifice and working to improve public welfare.

sounds more like you're talking about certain media networks which one would think are in cahoots with the enemies of Pakistani Nation and people, or some of those so-called "lawyers" who showered petals on Mumtaz Qadri

Oh, is that right?

yeah it's right look at the fuckin subject

In short, you don't want your preferred story to be challenged by facts.

i dont want to be talking about some stupid holocaust crap in a thread about a Pakistani Air Force Pilot

At the rate your going some day it'll be YOUR funeral when people will say, "Forget about how he died, let's just move the f*ck on."

I really pray to God that this is exactly how things happen when I die, however i die. I dont want to be remembered at all; roll me up in rags and bury me in some orchard somewhere and dont even have my name written on it

move the f*ck on indeed..

 

[MastanKhan]

What atrocities were these committed by the Jews on the Russians?

Hi,

If you have a russian colleague---please ask them----but make sure he / she is not a russian jew.

 

[MastanKhan]

The information is all over the web---I got mine from my first wife---I asked the same question---wtf---russian jews killing russians! ---Was a shocker for me as well.

I keep telling pakistanis---don't under estimate the israelis---. Paf pilots did what they did in the past---don't brag about what they did---. These things are better kept hidden under the rug.



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Jewish Bolsheviks Murdered
66 Million In Russia
From Dick Fojut
7-21-7

To Ian Punnett, Coast To Coast AM radio
From Dick Fojut in Tucson, Arizona
r.fojut@worldnet.att.net

ABOUT "HOLOCAUSTS"...

Ian, following up on a Fast Blast I sent you last Saturday during your Coast To Coast Radio program, about ANOTHER "Holocaust" not mentioned by yourself and your guest Dan Kurzman, who spoke about Hitler's "Death Camps." Two revealing articles follow.

How many people did Russia's Bolshevik Communists kill?

* Israel's YNET News admits: "at least 20 million."

- or -

* Alexander SOLZHENITSYN states flatly: "66 million."

First Article...

YNET: At Least 20 Million Killed By Jewish Bolsheviks...

Following is a surprising article from respected news source YNET in Israel, about the Jewish-Bolshevik conquest of Russia after 1917... (unlikely to ever be reprinted or reported by America's major print, TV or radio "news" media.)

STALIN'S JEWS - Opinion from Israel, Ynetnews

12-21-6 Excerpts only...

"We mustn't forget that some of greatest murderers of modern times were Jewish.

We cannot know with certainty the number of deaths Cheka was responsible for in its various manifestations, but the number is surely at least 20 million, including victims of the forced collectivization, the hunger, large purges, expulsions, banishments, executions, and mass death at Gulags.

Whole population strata were eliminated: Independent farmers, ethnic minorities, members of the bourgeoisie, senior officers, intellectuals, artists, labor movement activists, "opposition members" who were defined completely randomly, and countless members of the Communist party itself.

And us, the Jews? An Israeli student finishes high school without ever hearing the name "Genrikh Yagoda," the greatest Jewish murderer of the 20th Century, the GPU's deputy commander and the founder and commander of the NKVD. Yagoda diligently implemented Stalin's collectivization orders and is responsible for the deaths of at least 10 million people. His Jewish deputies established and managed the Gulag system. After Stalin no longer viewed him favorably, Yagoda was demoted and executed, and was replaced as chief hangman in 1936 by Yezhov, the 'bloodthirsty dwarf'."

Stalin's Jews - Israel Opinion, Ynetnews

THE SECOND ARTICLE...

SOLZHENITSYN: 66 Million Murdered By Jewish Bolsheviks...

Henry Makow PhD (an anti-Zionist Canadian Jew), in his "Red Symphony" essay (see Makow's savethemales.com website archives) claims that from the behind the scenes, the ROTHSCHILD BANKING CARTEL financed and controlled the BOLSHEVIKS who took over Russia.

If one wants to know the extent of the STATE TERROR and HORROR inflicted upon people in Russia since 1917 AFTER the JEWISH BOLSHEVIKS of Lenin (and his Party competitor) Trotsky, took TOTAL power, read the following informative short article by TEXE MARRS (not related to Jim Marrs) about historian Solzhenitsyn's latest book (banned in the West), "Together for Two Hundred Years."

Solzhenitsyn: The "Conscience of the 20th Century"

TEXE MARRS at: ConspiracyWorld.com:

If not exaggerated, Solzhenitsyn asserts that since 1917, the Bolsheviks, continuing under assassin Stalin, through and even after WW2, systematically executed, and inside (and outside) their thousands of Gulags, worked, starved and froze to death, SIXTY-SIX million people, not all, but most of them CHRISTIANS (whom the Bolsheviks hated). This mass death was THE LARGEST REAL "HOLOCAUST" in modern history - but totally unknown today by most Americans, British and western Europeans and absent from our school books. Of course no publisher in the Western world dares reprint Solzhenitsyn's book in English.

http://www.conspiracyworld.com/index0064.htm



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[500]

The information is all over the web---I got mine from my first wife---I asked the same question---wtf---russian jews killing russians! ---Was a shocker for me as well.

Lenin was not a Jew, Stalin was not a Jew, overwhelming majority of NKVD were not Jews and numbers are inflated.

 

[EyelessInGaza]

Hi,

If you have a russian colleague---please ask them----but make sure he / she is not a russian jew.

It is a common mistake- and a common charge- to confuse the fact that Yagoda and some others in the Soviet hierarchy were Jews with making Jews as a people responsible for the mass murder of Soviet people.

In reality there is no connection, and this is another conspiracy theory. For one, the ultimate Soviet mass murderer was Stalin who personally disliked Jews. Two, the majority of people doing the killing were non-Jews. Three, the prominence of Jews in the communist party was greatly exaggerated; there is a term for this conspiracy theory- Jewish Bolshevism.

 

[Windjammer]

You're flaming me. My point is, I posted a rebuttal of the "facts" from a source of great quality and you responded by repeating the very thing that was rebutted, without change. Now you're stooping to insult.

Why should other Pakistanis respect you, then? Indeed, why should you respect yourself?

How am i flaming you.....you blindly accept one fact of the history since it portrays you as the oppressed yet you are in denial on a much more recent event.....only because it doesn't find a mention in your texts.
Let me put it this way, the wars took place between Arabs and Israelis....our only connection was/is that some of the pilots who participated in the battles were Pakistani......if there's no substance to their claims/achievements.....why the hell would Jordanian and Iraqi authorities decorate him with medals and awards....why not an Arab pilot....it would have benefited the Arab world to create their own hero and place a statue of him beside Saddam Hussain or something.
Moreover the fact that some well respected aviation journals which are hardly inclined to exaggerate Arab claims carried the story should suffice to put rest to any apprehensive minds. !!

 

[Solomon2]

if there's no substance to their claims/achievements.....why the hell would Jordanian and Iraqi authorities decorate him with medals and awards...

Whether Azam shot Israeli planes down or not, he seems to have served under Iraqi and Jordanian command during the Six-Day War. Why shouldn't the Iraqis and Jordanians have honored a foreigner for such enthusiasm?

More topical, however, is how these tales about Azam are used politically. For whenever the institutionalized enmity Pakistan has for Israel is brought up these stories appear about how "the Pakistani Air Force" shot down Israeli planes in previous wars, implying that Israel is Pakistan's enemy.

Thus initiatives to improve Pakistan's relations with Israel die unfulfilled and Pakistanis' unjustifiable hate for Jews/Israel continues to be stoked up year-to-year, generation-to-generation.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Whether Azam shot Israeli planes down or not, he seems to have served under Iraqi and Jordanian command during the Six-Day War. Why shouldn't the Iraqis and Jordanians have honored a foreigner for such enthusiasm?

More topical, however, is how these tales about Azam are used politically. For whenever the institutionalized enmity Pakistan has for Israel is brought up these stories appear about how "the Pakistani Air Force" shot down Israeli planes in previous wars, implying that Israel is Pakistan's enemy.

Thus initiatives to improve Pakistan's relations with Israel die unfulfilled and Pakistanis' unjustifiable hate for Jews/Israel continues to be stoked up year-to-year, generation-to-generation.

see that's the thing


if i see someone saying "yeahhhh he taught those jews a lesson" or garbage like that -- then it's not acceptable to me at least and many others here

on a purely professional level - he carried out his duties and he gave a surprise to the israeli pilots.....the israelis already knew about the existence of Pakistani pilots and they often tried using Punjabi language on the radio -- thinking it would confuse the pilots......not knowing that most radio transmissions in PAF language are done in English

I think it's fair to say most Pakistanis do not appreciate the genocide of Palestinians and the blockade of Gaza (which under international law is ILLEGAL)

the REAL purpose of this thread is to celebrate a respected pilot who devoted his life towards Pakistan (and helping other Muslim countries during their need of the hour). They did their best -- but the onus was on the Arabs to win the war and they all collectively lost.

israel -- we have no diplomatic relations with them; they are in contact i'm sure behind the scenes -- and there's a silent kind of mutual understanding that we wont screw eachother over.....of course there's the plot of israelis and their tail-wagging indian buddies to strike our facilities -- but the ISI was onto them and they dared not do something stupid which they would regret later



p.s. the Jordanians, Iraqis and Syrians provided a lot of breathing space for our pilots actually....there was no strict command being observed. In fact, the Pakistanis were the ones who would later be doing some of the commanding and training --as a courtesy

 

[Slayer786]

No, USA was not on Israel's side in 1967.


No, even after 1967 US would never intervene.


Rubbish.

Its Arabs who attacked Israel on its holiest day in 1973.

Well in 1967 war, "the six-Day war" it was the Israelis who attacked the muslims on Eid day. And yes in 1973 war it was the muslims who attacked the Israelis on their holy day. Tit for tat. I guess.

Well if USA was not going to do anything to help you guys out at that time, it has changed now. Isnt it? You are protected by USA now. Otherwise.............