Pakistan in talks for 4 Ada Class Corvettes, T-129 Helicopters & modernization of agosta fleet

[Gryphon]

There is variant with hangar version with medium lift helicopter that is offered too. and a 24 cell HHQ 10 version for ships too. Surface Ship Torpedo Defense is one of the reasons I see Ada is better. The major reason I see is diplomatic decision to create more/even better ties with Turkish people.

I didn't find it appropriate to compare Ada with Type 056. Yes, the Chinese can offer a larger ship depending on customer requirements.
Ada's SSTD isn't Turkish. It is possible for Pakistan to buy such systems directly from British/German OEM's (for a Chinese ship design).

IMO, the decision is technical. Ada can data-link with PN MPA's (Orion/ATR-72) providing better ASW capability. Some equipment currently on board ageing Type 21's may be reused as well.

STM CEO Davut Yilmaz said each ship will cost 250 million USD (instead of the original 300 million USD) because Pakistan plans to source some of the equipment from its own industry.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...loi-for-four-turkish-ada_class-corvettes.html

What can the Pakistani industry provide except SLTA sonar and ESM systems?

You cannot say Chinese Avionics suite is inferior, times have changed the rate at which Chinese are getting upper hand in technology its not more than a decade the suites will be better than most of what will be available at that time. Current Chinese naval platform have done some serious things like Chinese sub getting closer to american carrier group. Avionics wise we cant compare both of the ships, we don't know what both are offering.

While comparing Ada with Type 056, I said the former had better weapons & sensors.

Not that all Chinese weapons/sensors are inferior. The Chinese have ready for export OTH radars. It comes down to what you can afford.

There are several variants of 056 corvette. Not to mention the one variant for Argentina that only adds the additional 300 ton displacement for enhanced area for hanger and accommodates the ~9 ton helicopter named sea king. So it can be assumed that 10 ton helicopter is no exception.

The ship offered to Argentina costs roughly 50 million USD and probably has steel superstructure. Isn't that more like Swiftships 75m corvette (though better armed)?

 

[alimobin memon]

I didn't find it appropriate to compare Ada with Type 056. Yes, the Chinese can offer a larger ship depending on customer requirements.
Ada's SSTD isn't Turkish. It is possible for Pakistan to buy such systems directly from British/German OEM's (for a Chinese ship design).

IMO, the decision is technical. Ada can data-link with PN MPA's (Orion/ATR-72) providing better ASW capability. Some equipment currently on board ageing Type 21's may be reused as well.

STM CEO Davut Yilmaz said each ship will cost 250 million USD (instead of the original 300 million USD) because Pakistan plans to source some of the equipment from its own industry.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...loi-for-four-turkish-ada_class-corvettes.html

What can the Pakistani industry provide except SLTA sonar and ESM systems?



While comparing Ada with Type 056, I said the former had better weapons & sensors.

Not that all Chinese weapons/sensors are inferior. The Chinese have ready for export OTH radars. It comes down to what you can afford.



The ship offered to Argentina costs roughly 50 million USD and probably has steel superstructure. Isn't that more like Swiftships 75m corvette (though better armed)?

but it has a larger hanger means that can be applicable for type Pak navy is looking.

 

[Gryphon]

but it has a larger hanger means that can be applicable for type Pak navy is looking.

Do you think it is a better replacement of Type 21's over Link 16 compatible Milgem design for ASW?

You are comparing a US$ 50 million OPV with a low RCS ASW corvette.

 

[alimobin memon]

Do you think it is a better replacement of Type 21's over Link 16 compatible Milgem design for ASW?

You are comparing a US$ 50 million OPV with a low RCS ASW corvette.

50 million dollars ? dude you are ignoring what I am saying completely. type 056 is a 200 million dollar ship base. the Argentinian version is not the full scale version. read here the Chinese navy operates different type that is 200 million dollar ship that is what I am referring to, That 200 million dollar ship can be further modified to have an enhanced hangar and better avionics as well if need be better avionics. Chinese ships are cheaper to maintain and operate.

 

[royalharris]

50 million dollars ? dude you are ignoring what I am saying completely. type 056 is a 200 million dollar ship base. the Argentinian version is not the full scale version. read here the Chinese navy operates different type that is 200 million dollar ship that is what I am referring to, That 200 million dollar ship can be further modified to have an enhanced hangar and better avionics as well if need be better avionics. Chinese ships are cheaper to maintain and operate.

The export version of Type 056 is around 130 million, it is more advanced than PLAN self used version.
PLAN use type 056 as Offshore defense and anti submarine
Export version will take more responsibility with more Weaponry

 

[alimobin memon]

The export version of Type 056 is around 130 million, it is more advanced than PLAN self used version.
PLAN use type 056 as Offshore defense
Export version will take more responsibility with more Weaponry

even better more for modification

 

[Army research]

Does the type 56 have VLS?

 

[Gryphon]

50 million dollars ? dude you are ignoring what I am saying completely. type 056 is a 200 million dollar ship base. the Argentinian version is not the full scale version.

Refer here for details about the ship offered to Argentina.

read here the Chinese navy operates different type that is 200 million dollar ship that is what I am referring to, That 200 million dollar ship can be further modified to have an enhanced hangar and better avionics as well if need be better avionics.

Chinese can come up with a dozen designs based on the Type 056, including larger variants. What is your point?

ASW involves surface ships, submarines as well as aircraft. I have mentioned in my previous post that Ada has the advantage of interoperability with PN MPA's.

Chinese ships are cheaper to maintain and operate.

You better support this argument with reliable source(s).

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Refer here for details about the ship offered to Argentina.



Chinese can come up with a dozen designs based on the Type 056, including larger variants. What is your point?

ASW involves surface ships, submarines as well as aircraft. I have mentioned in my previous post that Ada has the advantage of interoperability with PN MPA's.



You better support this argument with reliable source(s).

In all honesty, the genuinely shady deals have been the Damen OPV and Swift Corvette. Both ships have hulls and superstructures built of steel, so they aren't terribly complicated where if given the technical documentation KSEW couldn't have built them itself (albeit with imported materials).

IMHO the Damen OPV, Swift Corvette and PMSA 1,500 ton MPV could have been standardized onto a single platform design (with varying subsystems and weapons), which could have been an opportunity to have KSEW work with an experienced ship designer to come up with an original design for manufacturing and marketing from Pakistan.

 

[syed_yusuf]

In all honesty, the genuinely shady deals have been the Damen OPV and Swift Corvette. Both ships have hulls and superstructures built of steel, so they aren't terribly complicated where if given the technical documentation KSEW couldn't have built them itself (albeit with imported materials).

IMHO the Damen OPV, Swift Corvette and PMSA 1,500 ton MPV could have been standardized onto a single platform design (with varying subsystems and weapons), which could have been an opportunity to have KSEW work with an experienced ship designer to come up with an original design for manufacturing and marketing from Pakistan.

i agree and add to it the corvette of Ada class that PN is perusing. all combine will give PN a buying power of 10+ ships from single core. this would have propelled KSEW and other affiliate companies to new level.

 

[AKINCI]

Admiral Zafar Mahmood Abbasi visited Turkey on 10-14 December 2017

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

 

[niaz]

I was talking about the 1970s’ at that time there were no sanctions on either country. I had however heard from an ex Gen Mgr. of Shell Pakistan that Shah of Iran had offered Ayub Khan to build a refinery but Pakistan needed to sign a 20 year agreement with Iran to buy all the crude oil import from Iran. Ayub Khan did not want to put all the eggs in one basket and declined. The refinery was eventually built with Abu Dhabi financing and now called PARCO.

I had heard rumours about 2009 but nothing concrete, so in fairness can’t comment. However, experience of living has taught me that there are no ‘Free lunches’ in this world. There is always a ‘Quid pro quo’; it could be in material form or in ‘Kind’. But no one, certainly no country will give you anything without expecting something in return.

 

[Gryphon]

Pakistan's 4 MILGEM Island has begun to prepare for the final week of contracting for the sin class. 2 in Turkey of the ships, to be built at about the interviews studies in Karachi of which lasts 2.

https://twitter.com/x/status/946264568917123073

 

[jupiter2007]

Pakistan's 4 MILGEM Island has begun to prepare for the final week of contracting for the sin class. 2 in Turkey of the ships, to be built at about the interviews studies in Karachi of which lasts 2.

https://twitter.com/x/status/946264568917123073

I think it's already finalized, last 2 will be build in Pakistan.