Pakistan in talks for 4 Ada Class Corvettes, T-129 Helicopters & modernization of agosta fleet

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

I think KS&EWs should join this program with Turkey other than these 4. It's far better than Chinese ones.

IMO ... try splitting the requirement.

Go with China's CSOC for strategically valuable FFG. The CSOC 4,000-ton design can be adapted for carrying long-range SAM and LACM. The cost of APAR and OTHR will always be on the high-side, but you can balance that off with a potentially lower-cost hull built at CSOC. Capitalize on those savings by upping the subsystem selection.

However, to complement those you could build a larger fleet of lighter ships for front-line ASW, including the role of guarding the CSOC AAW frigate. The platform you select for this will have to be feasible from in operational costs, e.g. fuel, automation (reducing manpower needs) and reliability, and equipped with a top-end sub-sensor suite. While relatively costly upfront, the long-term savings (from operating costs) are key.

It seems the MILGEM was designed to be like that, all the more helpful with a low-RCS, low-acoustic and low-IR design. That said, one can still save somewhat with the MILGEM by taking control of the supply of sensors, CMS, ESM and weapon systems (e.g. AShM, SAM, ASW LWT, etc.). For example, each MBDA-Thales equipped Gowind 2500 costs around $250-275 m a ship. Assuming the MILGEM's hull costs around the same as the Gowind 2500, you can get some savings by swapping the French sensors and weapons with Turkish and South African equivalents.

 

[Gryphon]

Details on the STM MILGEM CF3500

• Displacement: 3,440 tons
• Length: 115.2 m
• STM says it has 70-80% commonality with the MILGEM Ada
• Optional radar, EO/IR, FCS, Sonar, ESM, CMS, etc
• Armaments
  • 12-cell VLS
  • 2x4 AShM
  • 2x3 ASW LWT
  • x1 Phalanx CIWS
  • x2 12.7 mm RCWS
• CODAG
• Range: 4,000 nm at 15 knots
• Endurance: 25 days
• Crew: 100 + 30
• Sea State 6+
• Aft deck for 10-ton helicopter
• x2 RHIB

http://www.edrmagazine.eu/stm-eyes-the-pes-programme

@cabatli_53 @T-123456 @Nutuk @Combat-Master @Gryphon @Penguin

A bigger ship than the Istanbul Class but only 8 AShM vs 16 AShM.

12 VLS cells? Probably counted on the model.

CODAG vs CODAD (on LF-2400). However, that is a conceptual design.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

A bigger ship than the Istanbul Class but only 8 AShM vs 16 AShM.

12 VLS cells? Probably counted on the model.

CODAG vs CODAD (on LF-2400). However, that is a conceptual design.

Yep ... the CF3500 is very close to the Ada (e.g. CODAG), albeit much more in displacement. The LF-2400 is only 50 tons more, so I wonder where the extra displacement is coming from; is it extra volume for fuel and supplies?

 

[Gryphon]

Yep ... the CF3500 is very close to the Ada (e.g. CODAG), albeit much more in displacement. The LF-2400 is only 50 tons more, so I wonder where the extra displacement is coming from; is it extra volume for fuel and supplies?

Istanbul Class uses CODAG as well.

The more displacement comes from (i) the lengthened hull (15.7 m more than Ada), (ii) More fuel enabling a range of 4000 nm, (iii) Extra supplies for more crew (for longer endurance), (iv) Addition of 16 cell VLS

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Istanbul Class uses CODAG as well.

The more displacement comes from (i) the lengthened hull (15.7 m more than Ada), (ii) More fuel enabling a range of 4000 nm, (iii) Extra supplies for more crew (for longer endurance), (iv) Addition of 16 cell VLS

But the LF-2400 is also longer (9 m) and has a range of 5,000 nm at 15 knots, but it's 2,350 tons.

I guess the difference then is that the LF-2400 was a preliminary concept, while the I-Class - and potentially CF3500 - had undergone proper design tests for center-of-gravity, etc.

 

[Gryphon]

But the LF-2400 is also longer (9 m) and has a range of 5,000 nm at 15 knots, but it's 2,350 tons.

I guess the difference then is that the LF-2400 was a preliminary concept, while the I-Class - and potentially CF3500 - had undergone proper design tests for center-of-gravity, etc.

CODAD is very efficient.

 

[POPEYE-Sailor]

Guys ,
Pakistan signs deal for 4 Milgem Ada Class Corvettes with Turkey

This deal has been done or still under observation ?

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Guys ,
Pakistan signs deal for 4 Milgem Ada Class Corvettes with Turkey

This deal has been done or still under observation ?

In late Nov. the MoDP said it's under talks, Pakistan will review financial proposals.

He added the process to procure the aircraft was “90 percent complete”, adding that proposals had been analyzed and financial aspects were being considered.

“There is another project: the MILGEM [Turkey’s national warship] naval ship. The process is completed and construction of the ship will start in near future.

“Technical and financial proposal will be going to open in Pakistan on Monday. So, this project is almost complete.”

http://aa.com.tr/en/asia-pacific/pakistan-looks-for-helicopters-naval-ships-from-turkey/979403​

 

[Gryphon]

http://en.c4defence.com/Agenda/colombia-move-by-stm/5255/1

 

[Incog_nito]

IMO ... try splitting the requirement.

Go with China's CSOC for strategically valuable FFG. The CSOC 4,000-ton design can be adapted for carrying long-range SAM and LACM. The cost of APAR and OTHR will always be on the high-side, but you can balance that off with a potentially lower-cost hull built at CSOC. Capitalize on those savings by upping the subsystem selection.

However, to complement those you could build a larger fleet of lighter ships for front-line ASW, including the role of guarding the CSOC AAW frigate. The platform you select for this will have to be feasible from in operational costs, e.g. fuel, automation (reducing manpower needs) and reliability, and equipped with a top-end sub-sensor suite. While relatively costly upfront, the long-term savings (from operating costs) are key.

It seems the MILGEM was designed to be like that, all the more helpful with a low-RCS, low-acoustic and low-IR design. That said, one can still save somewhat with the MILGEM by taking control of the supply of sensors, CMS, ESM and weapon systems (e.g. AShM, SAM, ASW LWT, etc.). For example, each MBDA-Thales equipped Gowind 2500 costs around $250-275 m a ship. Assuming the MILGEM's hull costs around the same as the Gowind 2500, you can get some savings by swapping the French sensors and weapons with Turkish and South African equivalents.

Why put all eggs in one basket. No more mistakes again!

 

[Kamil_baku]

Why put all eggs in one basket. No more mistakes again!

Seems like either you got Saudi connection(just kidding) or new in army technology...
Its better to have one type of technology for maintenance cost.. Pakistan can trust Turkey that no power can stop Turkey to deliver the sub components, then why not?
Turkey is going to have AESA radar in 2020, this sheeps could easily be equipped with them in the future too.. its very hard to shot these ships from far away as i mentioned before in this section.

 

[RIP Pak LAW]

Since Zarvan made this thread, the deal hasn't been officially signed yet.

 

[Gryphon]

Submarine Defense Wartime and Exploration Countdown to the export of the Patrol Ship

Turkey's negotiations with Saudi Arabia and Pakistan regarding the export of MILGEM corvettes came to an end.

home > economy 13.12.2017 Al Kuwayt

KUVEYT-Göksel Yıldırım / Mustafa Çalkaya

The most prominent products of the Turkish defense industry in recent years, the Submarine Defense Warfare and Exploration Station Outpost ( MILGEM ) has come to the end of the studies on the issue of export.

Turkey is negotiating the export of MILGEMs, countries that want to overcome and strengthen a fleet of naval vessels.

In this context, 5 contracts are being made to Saudi Arabia and 4 contracts are being contracted to Pakistan. Significant distances to the agreements have been taken, signing the stage with both countries is stated.

The Defense Technologies Engineering and Trade Corporation (STM), the Colombian Naval Forerunner of the new Frigate Procurement Program, is expecting the procurement authority to disclose a short list of 3 firms. It is foreseen that STM will be left on the short list of strong competitors participating in the tender.

STM is also involved in corvette and modernization projects of the Kuwait Navy as part of its work in the Gulf countries.

"Insistent follow-up for concrete results"

Deputy General Director of STM Murat Çift has made comments to his AA correspondent regarding the Gulf Defense and Aviation Fair in Kuwait and his work in the region.

Secondly, we are pleased to see that many countries have expressed their gratitude to MILGEM, saying, "But the interest is high, you are technically good, your proposal is very good and it does not determine the result alone." Other factors are also affecting the process. We will continue to work hard to get tangible results, and we do not get a temporary and high interest. expression.

http://aa.com.tr/tr/ekonomi/denizal...arakol-gemisinin-ihracinda-geri-sayim/1003531

 

[Gryphon]

Towards the end of MİLGEM exports:
- Saudi Arabia and Pakistan are in the process of signing contract negotiations
- @STMDefence, expected to remain on short list in Colombia, deals with corvette and modernization projects in Kuwait

https://twitter.com/x/status/940893726339158016

056 Corvette launches HQ-10 CIWS to intercept the sea skimming anti-ship target missile.

Video: 2 HQ-10 missiles intercept target missile.

https://twitter.com/x/status/939080266844270593

 

[alimobin memon]

What is better in ada that is not in 056 corvette chinese