Pakistan Has Settled All Scores With India

[Paitoo]

I say this for both countries -

From time to time it is good to indulge in these feel good theories. But like a drug that gives you high, overuse is dangerous. We have all seen in state sponsored TV serials what happens to drug addicts. They thrash around in a hospital bed in agony, sometimes they have to be tied up, sometimes they have to be slapped to bring them to their senses. It is ok if the nurse is the one doing the slapping. Not so good if any Tom, Dick and Harry takes a swipe at you.

 

[SD 10]

Pakistan has settled all of its scores with India - Refute me if but the below are facts.

India

1947/1948
In the first 1947/48 war Pakistan captured over 86,268 sq Km of territory - this is an area larger than the European country of Austria.

Whilst India will argue it controls the Kashmir Valley and the more fertile area, the fact remains that Pakistan's gains in that war gave it a border with China and denied India a border with Afghanistan, not just that the enduring benefit that this territory is providing Pakistan and China in terms of CPEC, not to mention it gained K2 and the majority of the 8000m peaks in the world, therefore the more strategic part of Kashmir was gained by Pakistan.

1965
India failed to use its numerical superiority to win after crossing the international boundary - It was a stalemate but ofcourse given the David and Goliath nature of the battle fighting India to a stalement and denying it victory is a huge achievement. India has failed in every single war to capture Lahore which given it is barely 17 KM from the international border shows the utter failure of Indian forces, I am sure they would like to have captured Lahore to use it as a bargaining power given it is the second largest city of Pakistan.

1971
We lost this war - But we forget that we played a role in the partition of India and divided them first in 1947. The land of Pakistan was carved out of the womb of mother India with the British being an eager midwife. So if any Indian likes to remind us of the 1971 war - we must ofcourse remind them of the partition of 1947.

Infact, the Indian Army, Navy, Airforce itself was partitioned, so if they say 90000 POW, We must remind them of the 140,000 men of the India army that went to Pakistan as a result of the partition of India without a shot fired. Indian army has failed since 1947 to undo its own partition and the partition of its motherland.

1984
India captured some part of the Siachen glacier - but we also control an area of the glacier, More Indians have died on the glazier and will continue to die due to harsh weather, not to mention the cost involved for them to maintain forces, so it has and will continue to be a thorn on the side of Indians.

1974/1998
We settled all nuclear tests in 1998 - One for Smiling Bhudda in 1974 and five for Pokharan - These were the actual words use by Nawaz Sharif in May 1998.

1999
Status Quo Ante Bellum - We did not loose any territory, better we ingress into Indian held areas than wait until they ingress into ours, our nuclear deterrent held.

2001
Standoff - Pakistan nuclear deterrent held, more Indian soldiers died in the mobilisation

2019
A total failure and miss by IAF - They did not need to wait long the response at Rajauri, lost a Mig 21, MI-17, 6 IAF and 1 civillian, and 1 POW.

So, We should be proud of our performance given that India is much larger, we have bloodied them repeatedly and continue to be a massive thorn.

Pakistan has since its inception punched well above its weight - India, USSR, USA etc.

But I ask any Indian reading this, Why is it the only time India fought a country of equal size namely China in 1962 it lost?

no we haven`t.

 

[Rank]

1947/1948

india was managed to captured 70℅ of j& k after late join to war... Once, it migrated.

We lost to China in 1962, some parts..

1965

why was the was started? I guess for kashmir? Right?

Ended with saving lahore, it says a lot.. Actually..

1984
most of the parts..

1999
Again, what was the motive of war? It that achieved? After loosing many solders?

It is best called "disaster of Musharraf"".


2001
more Indian Army casualties? When? From where you get such bs data?

lol in all cases Pakistan despite being 7 times smaller country has shown enormous guts to attack the larger enemy - simply means Pakistan doesn't give a **** to Indian so-called military might, military deterrence, whatever the results, Pakistan Army has shown to have the courage to attack its enemy whereas you phutu Army and govt keep ranting about AJK and never dare to attack Pakistan LOL a spineless shit in the history first time trying their best to create a drama of surgical strikes and end it up with bloody nose.... lost 40 soldiers, aircrafts, POW, helicopter, 6 crew whata **** global level embarrassment of third class so-called military might IN THE BROAD DAY LIGHT in modern war 2019 not fucking 50 years old event.

PS: Pakistan every time initiated a war to liberate IOK, each and every time you responded back to Pakistan with the motive of "DESTROY and FINISH entire Pakistan". You guys were miserably FAILED to completely finish and destroy Pakistan. Period!

 

[Chak Bamu]

Crap thread, borne of need for validation. Same goes for sock puppets looking for attention by being boisterous & abusive.

 

[VkdIndian]

Pakistan every time initiated a war to liberate IOK

And failed. That’s called a failure.

 

[Chak Bamu]

And failed. That’s called a failure.

Keeping an issue alive is not failure. Post-1974, liberation of Kashmir via war was not feasible. Kashmiris are not Indians & they do not wish to live with you guys. Pakistan has kept this issue alive at every forum & that is a success not a failure. When India heads towards dissolution (a question of when, not if - given the history of the region), guess who would be the first to secede?

 

[Maula Jatt]

Pakistan is barely surviving. It goes to IMF with begging bowl in hand every few years. It runs to Saudi, UAE, China etc for emergency loans. Is it called surviving with dignity?

India was a proper basket case for major part of it's history only in 2000s did things start to improve
It needed a miracle to survive for more than 50 odd years? What crap logic is this

Imf is not a charity organization to call it a begging bowl- large receiving of aid is begging so...

Pakistan has a decent old industrial setup that up till now only served it's own country, due to lack of export orinted policies add in young population dividend that should start in couple of years, older education system, worlds top 5-10 number of IT professionals, prime real state in the map economically and geopolitically speaking, decent urban pop for devoloping countries, surely doesn't need a miracle to survive
to the contrary if done right is on the cursp of something good

Barely 15-20 years of performance with a war cannot be the judge of future when you have doing decently to good without all these plueses lining up, for a lot longer than you have done bad

My advice is just stop you have been thinking like that for so decades
But it isn't working- pakistan is a reality that is here and is fast approaching a century of existence
You have to engage with this reality, wet dreaming is not a policy

 

[graphican]

I disagree. Pakistan is yet to equalise its score with India:

• Pakistan is yet to avenge Indian terrorism in East Pakistan that lead to the creation of Bangladesh
• Paksitan is yet to liberate Jammu&Kashmir and the state of Junagadh illegally occupied by India
• Pakistan is yet to avenge the deaths of 80 thousand Pakistanis who lost to Indian terrorism.

There will be a day InShaAllah when we will settle the score pay Baniya its due.

 

[Wood]

An all-out war between India and China today will only result in a nuclear armaggadon for both countries and infact entire planet. In a limited war, outside of border areas, it will be difficult to sustain the attack and it is easy to dug in for defence. At best, India will lose few square miles of territory. But the damage to trade relations will be immense (China will lose more on that since it exports so much to India). Also, world over countries would become wary of China and will start to pull out of BRI deals.
For foreseeable future, China will only threaten or at best indulge in small skirmishes rather than risk actual war.

I think that the Indian side tends to overestimate the cushion that trade volume between India and China will offer in preventing a Chinese incursion into India. I can only hope that this does not influence military preparedness on the Indian side. While India does have credible nuclear deterrence against China, the Chinese side can operate well under its nuclear threshold to engage India.

Every country that has beef with China wants to get rid of its trade deficit. But this is not possible because China produces goods at a cheaper rate (and acceptable quality) compared to most competition. This is especially true for low income countries. It means that the local industries and consumers within India will not be able to sustain an import restriction of Chinese goods for any significant length of time. The Chinese are well aware of all these problems that India has to deal with.

Until and unless India reaches at least 50% of Chinese GDP, the only salvation for Indian side is to completely align with US in an open military partnership. This will mean that India cannot afford the 'strategic autonomy' that it publicly endorses.

 

[VkdIndian]

Keeping an issue alive is not failure. Post-1974, liberation of Kashmir via war was not feasible.

If it was not feasible to win a territory by force then it was not wise to try that method. When a side starts a conflict with an objective and fails to achieve it then it is a failure.
Pakistan should have found other ways to keep it alive.

By this logic will Pakistan attack India again?

 

[Tornado23]

Pakistan army was 30km from Srinagar before India joined the war in 48. Guess where the loc is now.

Pak army didnt join until later on... That was the pashtun warriors

 

[GumNaam]

Pakistan has settled all of its scores with India - Refute me if but the below are facts.

India

1947/1948
In the first 1947/48 war Pakistan captured over 86,268 sq Km of territory - this is an area larger than the European country of Austria.

Whilst India will argue it controls the Kashmir Valley and the more fertile area, the fact remains that Pakistan's gains in that war gave it a border with China and denied India a border with Afghanistan, not just that the enduring benefit that this territory is providing Pakistan and China in terms of CPEC, not to mention it gained K2 and the majority of the 8000m peaks in the world, therefore the more strategic part of Kashmir was gained by Pakistan.

1965
India failed to use its numerical superiority to win after crossing the international boundary - It was a stalemate but ofcourse given the David and Goliath nature of the battle fighting India to a stalement and denying it victory is a huge achievement. India has failed in every single war to capture Lahore which given it is barely 17 KM from the international border shows the utter failure of Indian forces, I am sure they would like to have captured Lahore to use it as a bargaining power given it is the second largest city of Pakistan.

1971
We lost this war - But we forget that we played a role in the partition of India and divided them first in 1947. The land of Pakistan was carved out of the womb of mother India with the British being an eager midwife. So if any Indian likes to remind us of the 1971 war - we must ofcourse remind them of the partition of 1947.

Infact, the Indian Army, Navy, Airforce itself was partitioned, so if they say 90000 POW, We must remind them of the 140,000 men of the India army that went to Pakistan as a result of the partition of India without a shot fired. Indian army has failed since 1947 to undo its own partition and the partition of its motherland.

1984
India captured some part of the Siachen glacier - but we also control an area of the glacier, More Indians have died on the glazier and will continue to die due to harsh weather, not to mention the cost involved for them to maintain forces, so it has and will continue to be a thorn on the side of Indians.

1974/1998
We settled all nuclear tests in 1998 - One for Smiling Bhudda in 1974 and five for Pokharan - These were the actual words use by Nawaz Sharif in May 1998.

1999
Status Quo Ante Bellum - We did not loose any territory, better we ingress into Indian held areas than wait until they ingress into ours, our nuclear deterrent held.

2001
Standoff - Pakistan nuclear deterrent held, more Indian soldiers died in the mobilisation

2019
A total failure and miss by IAF - They did not need to wait long the response at Rajauri, lost a Mig 21, MI-17, 6 IAF and 1 civillian, and 1 POW.

So, We should be proud of our performance given that India is much larger, we have bloodied them repeatedly and continue to be a massive thorn.

Pakistan has since its inception punched well above its weight - India, USSR, USA etc.

But I ask any Indian reading this, Why is it the only time India fought a country of equal size namely China in 1962 it lost?

please correct your 1999 post, there status quo changed, Pakistan did gain territory, Pakistan took over tiger hill point 5353 that india ruptured her rectum trying to get back but couldn't. It is with us to this very day.

 

[HammerHead081]

We lost 1965 war because we were the ones who initiated it with objective to capture Kashmir but India defended by attacking our Lahore border side. We might have won many battles especially the aerial ones but we lost the war.

Here is an Indian view, since you made the effort to ask for it.

a) India lost the war with China because Indian leadership (at that time) was naive and unprepared for a military confrontation with China. Given that India does not have the same attitude with respect to China, would the result be any different if India were to fight China today? Personally, I think it would be a miracle if India manages to hold its ground against China in an all out war. China is many times more powerful than India now than it was in 1962.

b) India lost the salvo with Pakistan in February 2019. No excuses for this. IAF was simply caught napping and complacent to not expect such shoot and scoot encounters. I can only hope that lessons were learned.

c) India has never strategically lost a full blown armed conflict with Pakistan. I'll not claim that India has militarily won all conflicts with Pakistan because that is debatable. Even today, if Pakistan is to unilaterally attack India (without directly aided by China in a secondary front), India will prevail.

If Pakistanis truly believe that Pakistan has nothing more to settle with India, then both countries can convert LoC to International Border and live in peace

I totally agree, the only solution to this issue right now is to accept LoC as international border and India signs a water treaty.

 

[peacekeeper]

I don't know who has won which war, but certainly the common people of South Asia are losing the battle and are having worst quality of in the world.

 

[mig25]

The idea of Pakistan during partition was a separate country for Muslims. While a new country was formed, the idea that a Muslim land will be carved failed. Several thousand of muslims in India refused to move the new promise land. To add insult to injury, a new country was carved out of the muslim land called Pakistan.

The score is only settled when

1) Indian Muslims get their own land.
2) Pakistan does better in every way when compared to India.

Mr.OP while you just opened a new thread with your narrative, the initial idea of Pakistan remains threatened until your country does better than India or defeat India to carve out a new land for Indian Muslims because as long as Muslims stay reasonably comfortably in India as they are right now and as India keeps adding more and more opportunities, the insecurity you experienced while creating this thread may never go away.

All the best!