Pakistan Could Have Technical Edge on Indian Air Force Despite Rafale Jet Deployment: IAF Veteran

[Haris Ali2140]

So you have attended classified briefings about aChinese missiles in India and are now sitting on the net telling us how you are aware of classified information. Now where do I start tearing a hole in your post. Unlike bharat ratshit there are some sane heads around here so cool it laddie.
What is a person with classified info doing sitting on the net. The RAW should have a whale of a time drilling your orifices.
Secondly not much is known about the PL15 barring some basic data. So what is the Indian source of such vedic information. Did you stand on the himalayas and catch the wind coming from the China side? Or was it just the Corona Virus.
If you want to let loose a lie at least make it credible. Otherwise as they say ""shut the fudge up"
People we have a choro in our midsts.
A

Maybe IAF also got to know PL-15 when they detected J-20 flying deep inside China using hi-tech radars.

@Deino @LKJ86 @Beast @ziaulislam

 

[The Eagle]

Any wonder they keep bringing back B S Dhanoa to keep blowing wind up their Sarees with a wry smile.

You know what happened to them which was totally disappointing and demoralizing. They have been learning throughout every exercise with USAF - Red Flag or Singaporeans, how to notch or deploy some falre chaff and turn cold by cobra maneuver while always trying to remember the firing range of C5. They have been attending exhibitions and airshows to remember SD-10 range or PL-12s. What they will never know are firing parameters, performance parameters and then tactics with double digit variables, if I must say. IAF didn't even know what's coming unless, those went pit bull and left them merely 10 seconds to evade despite the full range/maximum envelope shot. That was just a brain storm that took them by surprise... Remember the so-called evasive maneuvers and those amraam dodgers? They can calculate where they found C5 struck and when it came off the rail but in fact they cannot will never know... Fire and forget and they thought it just came off from F-16.

When faced, oh God that was like 90 seconds in hell making them to forget anything they could ever remember in range area. What's next? They before the engagement which they pulled merely basing upon numbers on the paper, went to French and Israeli's. Any Indian can confirm the date of finalizing Rafale and package and that's actually the fact as what happened to them. Yeah, they were actually thinking that can outrage C5 and could do for SD-10 which wasn't even an issue for them due to mindset. As they got to learn meteor and ebris e, a missile namely PL-15 came into play. Now the issue isn't in regard to weapons performance and affective range etc but its more like a situation which is right in front of IAF but hard like stone to digest. They were just about to get over the paper range of existing threat yet they got another shocker.

I tell IAF that PL-15 will come definitely but even before that, you are just so ignorant and unaware of PAF store. These boyeeez had the homework but from shows, pamphlets and above all the internet and solely relied as such to pull a stunt. Instead of learning, they are into same self belief state of mind but will learn more hard way. They can bring anything they want, PAF will shoot first... Wise words. IAF was just getting over C5 but, unless they don't dare, will never know the surprise from above.

For IAF again: how do they rate AIM C7? Brace yourself.

 

[araz]

PL-15s touted range will be of significance if the radar on board JF-17 can lock Rafaels that carry Meteor. We will have to wait for a real conflict to see if this is possible. Until then, only personal bias can make one weapon system better than the other.

I agree with your very sane post that all the proof will be in the pudding and till we set sights on it we will all remain unaware.
However, may I most humbly point out that the debate has now receded into the Indian posters recognizing the entity called JFT and are forced to compare it with the Rafale. That in its own rights is a feather in JFTs cap. Secondly you will also realize the significance of a home grown fighter howsoever much the Indians have denegrated it in enhancing the fire power of an air force. Essentially we can add whatever weapon or hardware or upgrade its software at a fraction of the cost it would need IAF to procure a fighter from a foreign source.
I wonder if HAL/private sector will now make efforts towards your own indegenous fighter.

May be, General Bakshi was also on PDF and got banned.

Made my day. If I could have given you another like for your post I would have done so.
Kind regards
A

 

[dbc]

I have attended classified briefings on Chinese weapons incl. Pl-15 during quad exercises.
So I know very well PL-15 & it's reality.

@The Eagle Please Please don't ever ban @silent_poison he is funnier than Michael McIntyre

 

[Wood]

I agree with your very sane post that all the proof will be in the pudding and till we set sights on it we will all remain unaware.
However, may I most humbly point out that the debate has now receded into the Indian posters recognizing the entity called JFT and are forced to compare it with the Rafale. That in its own rights is a feather in JFTs cap. Secondly you will also realize the significance of a home grown fighter howsoever much the Indians have denegrated it in enhancing the fire power of an air force. Essentially we can add whatever weapon or hardware or upgrade its software at a fraction of the cost it would need IAF to procure a fighter from a foreign source.
I wonder if HAL/private sector will now make efforts towards your own indegenous fighter.

An acceptable platform (for PAF) with weapon systems that can be economically mass produced is the real threat for IAF. If PAF can agree to wage war with the machine, then that is all the feather that the JFT needs. I don't know why you or any Pakistani would stop to consider what netizens from other countries opine. It should also not matter to discuss if JFT was homemade or foreign made. All that matters is your ability to economically mass produce the platform without being subject to sanctions and spare parts restrictions.

For what it is worth, this seems to be what the new IAF chief fancies as well. He has repeated his intention to accept Tejas and AMCA even with downgraded configuration. I'm hopeful that his wishes would be honored. Fancy planes like Rafale will always be stopgap measures even if they sport superior tech.

 

[SABRE]

Generally speaking, such statements by the top military officials in India (or even elsewhere) are usually geared towards extracting additional budgetary payments and more hardware from the political leadership. In India its the political leadership and civil bureaucracy that processes and drives arms acquisition, instead of the military. Additionally, Indian political leadership also encourages these statements from the top military officials. This has two advantages. 1) The politics of arms acquisition helps them portray India as a global power both internationally and domestically, and 2) this helps them provide security rationale for certain arms purchases that come with considerable "commission benefits" for them (if you know what I mean --> %).

 

[araz]

An acceptable platform (for PAF) with weapon systems that can be economically mass produced is the real threat for IAF. If PAF can agree to wage war with the machine, then that is all the feather that the JFT needs. I don't know why you or any Pakistani would stop to consider what netizens from other countries opine. It should also not matter to discuss if JFT was homemade or foreign made. All that matters is your ability to economically mass produce the platform without being subject to sanctions and spare parts restrictions.

For what it is worth, this seems to be what the new IAF chief fancies as well. He has repeated his intention to accept Tejas and AMCA even with downgraded configuration. I'm hopeful that his wishes would be honored. Fancy planes like Rafale will always be stopgap measures even if they sport superior tech.

It would be acceptable platform for PAF as it was designed with the PAF and the nascent Pakistani aviation industry. Ireally do not care any zens whether with their netties or not! I merely pointed out the direction the debate was taking.
As to IAF and HAL my own humble opinion is Tejas time has come and gone. Even if you could station it in sufficient numbers and in a suitable role the war theatre will make it obsolete just as most if not all 4th generation fighters will find life hard. But again this is the future and we need to see. I wish the Tejas the best of luck.
A

 

[s@@d]

So you have attended classified briefings about aChinese missiles in India and are now sitting on the net telling us how you are aware of classified information. Now where do I start tearing a hole in your post. Unlike bharat ratshit there are some sane heads around here so cool it laddie.
What is a person with classified info doing sitting on the net. The RAW should have a whale of a time drilling your orifices.
Secondly not much is known about the PL15 barring some basic data. So what is the Indian source of such vedic information. Did you stand on the himalayas and catch the wind coming from the China side? Or was it just the Corona Virus.
If you want to let loose a lie at least make it credible. Otherwise as they say ""shut the fudge up"
People we have a choro in our midsts.
A

level ustad g...
itni methi methi besti.. loved it because it is comming from you..

 

[TsAr]

Fortunately he is wrong as PL-15 is much inferior to Meteor, PL-15 is regarded as comparable to AIM-120D (Meteor is 2 times superior to AIM-120D in every engagement envelope).

More importantly PL-15 is fitted with dual pulse motor which is a much older tech compared to Meteor's Ramjet engine, which is why Meteor's No escape zone is a whopping 60-70 km & that of AIM-120C is only 25 km & for AIM-120D 35 km (same as PL-15).
Thanks to ramjet, Meteor is the only operational air to air missile in the entire known universe that is capable of terminal stage manuevers.


https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/pl-15.htm


He never said that.
What he said that is we need more than 36 Rafale or equivalent jets and the long range engagement capabilty of Rafale must also be possesed by other jets, which is why IAF has begun induction of Astras for Su-30, MiG-29 and Tejas.

When did you test all these air to missiles?

 

[Kabotar]

IIRC China is also developing new variants of the PL-12, including a rumoured ramjet version. So, the PAF could have the chance to experiment and get a decent idea how each type of AAM works at various altitudes, ranges, etc.

Wasn't that canceled in favour of PL-15.

 

[airmarshal]

These indians have such a big bamboo sticking up their arse that they cannot even admit to be completely humiliated, with their planes shot out of the sky like flies, and their pilot dragged through mud like animals. Such shameless creatures that now they talk about Rafale and meteor missiles as some big shi.*, same way they were calling MKIs as the most advance fighter in existence on this planet. Indians are only good for a few things - mainly opening their big mouths to lie, dance, crappy music, and idiotic movies.

Since Feb 27th, not a single thread here on how brilliant Su-30MKI is. Did not you notice that? Before, every other day.

 

[Wood]

Generally speaking, such statements by the top military officials in India (or even elsewhere) are usually geared towards extracting additional budgetary payments and more hardware from the political leadership. In India its the political leadership and civil bureaucracy that processes and drives arms acquisition, instead of the military. Additionally, Indian political leadership also encourages these statements from the top military officials. This has two advantages. 1) The politics of arms acquisition helps them portray India as a global power both internationally and domestically, and 2) this helps them provide security rationale for certain arms purchases that come with considerable "commission benefits" for them (if you know what I mean --> %).

I doubt that this is the case. It is quite possible that arms acquisition can lead to corruption. But military officials and their statements are not much talked about in India. Majority of Indian public do not pay attention to statements from the security establishment and cannot even identify the service chiefs.

 

[Path-Finder]

Since Feb 27th, not a single thread here on how brilliant Su-30MKI is. Did not you notice that? Before, every other day.

those specialist are being re-educated in the brilliance of Rafale. so the next mini AEW&C is Rafale but maybe it will be classed as something else.

 

[StormBreaker]

Thanks to ramjet, Meteor is the only operational air to air missile in the entire known universe that is capable of terminal stage manuevers.


https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/pl-15.htm

This guy needs some education about Ancient Lingum Tech and the Flying Donut .

I guess India’s Mars mission failed to find better AAMs with Marians

 

[ziaulislam]

Wrong.
It only either matches the AIM-120D or is very slightly better.
Obviously one cannot expect mighty USAF to be happy with a similar capability /performance weapon which is why they are developing AIM-260 which will outrange the PL-15 by a huge factor, just like AIM-120D outranged China's PL-12 by a large margin.

Aim260 is dirt as it doesnt has ramjet engine...just like pl15 as meteor is only one in universe..your words not mine