Pakistan buys Chinese subs to counter India 'threats'

[Xracer]

Finally

Finally

 

[Comrade]

Indians will also be eating uranium and plutonium for like 6 months underwater.

Indefinite word for nuclear subs is too much farfetched.

It may seem somewhat strange for India to lease a Russian nuclear submarine, and at a heavy cost those nuclear subs are a burden on Indian tax payers nothing else.

The 10-year lease is costing India a billion dollars. Remember just for leasing.

and don't forget the fatal gas leak killing 20 crew members occurred during the submarine’s sea trials in November 2008...

though It is difficult to detect a nuclear submarine at sea by conventional means. However, satellite sensors that can locate what lies below the earth’s surface can also look below the sea surface. or with a quiter AIP system capable sub which PN has.

The best way to neutralize the submarine is when it is in harbor, and there are half a dozen methods to achieve this, and PN has a strategic plane for that implemented as well and that plane solely rallies on PN's subs.

The Arihant submarines of IN are powered by an 83 MW pressurized water reactor (PWR) with highly enriched uranium fuel all the nuclear subs of IN are designed to keep an edge over china not Pakistan because of a possible Sino Pak joined help.

the interim plans of leasing nuclear subs from China is again a burden on the economy of Pakistan.

But PN wants it and that shows that IN's nuclear subs are a threat.

Also remember that the Agosta 90B's AIP system is the first conventional submarine in the Indian Ocean to feature the AIP system (in this case a 200KW liquid oxygen MESMA AIP), improving its stealth characteristics and no doubt a thread to IN's nuclear subs.

INS Arihant of IN, an indigenous nuclear-powered submarine capable of firing strategic weapons is a major thread to both Pakistan and China.

the under-water version of the Pakistani Babur cruise missile was already said to be functional in PN can be an answer but that needs a nuclear sub to be submerged for a strategic value in case of a nuclear war. but for small skirmishes the Agusta 90B is a nightmare for indian navy but if integrated with a cruise missile its more dangerous then INs nuclear subs keeping in mind the strategic edge of Arabian sea Pakistan has got.

The Pakistani delegation being rushed to China soon after the Chakra induction, for talks and discussions shows nuclear subs thread.

No doubt PN desperately seeks a nuclear submarine to counter Indian naval strength not for Indian subs but for large strength of Indian navy.

Pakistan wants to acquire a nuclear submarine, initially may be on lease and then build its own one with Chinese transfer of technology.

Here is another problem with china its self sine China itself doesn't have enough to spare one for PN, so discussion are going on for what can be done.

If china provides technology transfer of nuclear subs it will get hostile world opinion and chines don't want that.

so both countries are equipped and Pakistan's submarine fleet is capable of creating a nightmare for india.

Do you atleast know what a CO2 cylinder is?

what ever it is it slapped u.
killing ur crew and distroying IN's image.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

" SUB " by AzadPakistan2009
Written on March 10th


Ye Sub , wo Sub
Hum Sub , Tum Sub
Sub Kuch howa bhi
Sub kuch howa na bhi

Kabhi Sub ati hai
Kabhi Sub jati hai
Neend nahi ati Sub ko
Ratoon ko jata hoon Sub ko

China ne promise kiya hai aek Sub ka
America bhi cahata hai bhalla Sub ka
Defence forum wale bhi tung agye Ab tu
Aaaaa....bhi ja mere jan-e-wafa ab Tu

Ye Sub , wo Sub
Hum Sub , Tum Sub
Sub Kuch howa bhi
Sub kuch howa na bhi


Scorpean Sub ke Peeche Bhagtein hain ye India walle
Asi terhan , jesai Imran Khan ko follow kertain hain Sub Insaf ke Jialle
Sub Challe Gai , mager na Imran aya , no Scorpean !!
Ab siruf reh gai ha , raat ki tareeki aur Sub machar


Azad ko poet bana dala , Sub ne
Koi kehta hai majnu , to koi kehta hai lala
Sub Kuch kaho mager Ashiq no kehna
ab bohot muskil hai , Sub ka Doost Rehna

 

[Genesis]

getting 6 subs by 2016 is very difficult. especially if reports regarding transfer of technology and some will be built at kaaarachi are true. more relaistic figure will be around 2025 we will get all of them
regarding AIP only last 2 of scorpion will have AIP not first four

Scorpene submarine project to miss target again as Spanish consultants quit - The Times of India





also although pakistan has all three mesma system we are not sure whether hey have been installed on first two agosta subs? as there were some reports that AIP will be installed after 1st life upgrade. the thrid one had AIP from the start

I think the transfer of tech is very likely to be on the cards, the money could be to build, train and design the subs.

If Chinese weapons have shown in the past, especially these kind of weapons systems, they are never exactly going out as we have them. They will be redesigned with up to date tech and according to specifications of the buyer.

But more importantly I believe China wants an ally that is strong, the US also does too, but they don't see Pakistan as an ally like they see the UK.

India will be the main rival China will have in the future, maybe not right now, or even 20 years from now, but that is increasingly likely. Pakistan could be the decider in the Chinese Indian race. If for some reason in the future selling to Pakistan is more difficult due to the relationship with India, then Pakistan should have the infrastructure in place to better defense with minimal Chinese input.

This is an investment in the long term.

 

[kurup]

True, first two didnt have them, third had it from the word go, remaining two were retrofitted.

the MESMA unit is a plug in unit which can be retrofitted during construction or while mainteance.

So that means the MESMA unit can be added to the non-AIP scorpenes if required .

 

[aliaselin]

Whether can Pakistan designate the ship-builder？If so, I hope Pakistan ask Jiangnan shipyard but not Wuchang shipyard to build these submarine.

 

[Yogi]

So that means the MESMA unit can be added to the non-AIP scorpenes if required .

Technically, yes but there a few things that one should consider:

1.It'll become much more easier if there is some space left to fit AIP in future as AIP is fitted in the middle of the Sub. Bcoz ur basically suggesting to cut the sub into 2 n then put an AIP in between so it ain't coming cheap.

2.Since Scorpenes will start rolling out only in 2016 i.e. Newly made so don't expect any AIP on initial 4 for quite some time as AIP will be a major refit n nobody will be interest to cut them atleast for next 8-10 yrs.

 

[godofwar]

I think the transfer of tech is very likely to be on the cards, the money could be to build, train and design the subs.

If Chinese weapons have shown in the past, especially these kind of weapons systems, they are never exactly going out as we have them. They will be redesigned with up to date tech and according to specifications of the buyer.

But more importantly I believe China wants an ally that is strong, the US also does too, but they don't see Pakistan as an ally like they see the UK.

India will be the main rival China will have in the future, maybe not right now, or even 20 years from now, but that is increasingly likely. Pakistan could be the decider in the Chinese Indian race. If for some reason in the future selling to Pakistan is more difficult due to the relationship with India, then Pakistan should have the infrastructure in place to better defense with minimal Chinese input.

This is an investment in the long term.

And what if I told you Pakistan is an Indian ally in the long term ?

 

[Mav3rick]

we have nuclear submarines and there is a lot of difference between AIP and nuclear

Which ones???

 

[kurup]

Which ones???

INS Chakra 2 and INS Arihant .

 

[Yogi]

Which ones???

Akula II from Russia(lease) n INS Arihant currently under sea trails.

 

[SrNair]

Which ones???

INS chakra SSN from Russia
INS Arihant SSBN
Another one may lease from Russia.

Indians will also be eating uranium and plutonium for like 6 months underwater.

Indefinite word for nuclear subs is too much farfetched.

It may seem somewhat strange for India to lease a Russian nuclear submarine, and at a heavy cost those nuclear subs are a burden on Indian tax payers nothing else.

The 10-year lease is costing India a billion dollars. Remember just for leasing.

and don't forget the fatal gas leak killing 20 crew members occurred during the submarine’s sea trials in November 2008...

though It is difficult to detect a nuclear submarine at sea by conventional means. However, satellite sensors that can locate what lies below the earth’s surface can also look below the sea surface. or with a quiter AIP system capable sub which PN has.

The best way to neutralize the submarine is when it is in harbor, and there are half a dozen methods to achieve this, and PN has a strategic plane for that implemented as well and that plane solely rallies on PN's subs.

The Arihant submarines of IN are powered by an 83 MW pressurized water reactor (PWR) with highly enriched uranium fuel all the nuclear subs of IN are designed to keep an edge over china not Pakistan because of a possible Sino Pak joined help.

the interim plans of leasing nuclear subs from China is again a burden on the economy of Pakistan.

But PN wants it and that shows that IN's nuclear subs are a threat.

Also remember that the Agosta 90B's AIP system is the first conventional submarine in the Indian Ocean to feature the AIP system (in this case a 200KW liquid oxygen MESMA AIP), improving its stealth characteristics and no doubt a thread to IN's nuclear subs.

INS Arihant of IN, an indigenous nuclear-powered submarine capable of firing strategic weapons is a major thread to both Pakistan and China.

the under-water version of the Pakistani Babur cruise missile was already said to be functional in PN can be an answer but that needs a nuclear sub to be submerged for a strategic value in case of a nuclear war. but for small skirmishes the Agusta 90B is a nightmare for indian navy but if integrated with a cruise missile its more dangerous then INs nuclear subs keeping in mind the strategic edge of Arabian sea Pakistan has got.

The Pakistani delegation being rushed to China soon after the Chakra induction, for talks and discussions shows nuclear subs thread.

No doubt PN desperately seeks a nuclear submarine to counter Indian naval strength not for Indian subs but for large strength of Indian navy.

Pakistan wants to acquire a nuclear submarine, initially may be on lease and then build its own one with Chinese transfer of technology.

Here is another problem with china its self sine China itself doesn't have enough to spare one for PN, so discussion are going on for what can be done.

If china provides technology transfer of nuclear subs it will get hostile world opinion and chines don't want that.

so both countries are equipped and Pakistan's submarine fleet is capable of creating a nightmare for india.


what ever it is it slapped u.
killing ur crew and distroying IN's image.

Only for short term.Pakistan present advantage may over in 2020.Because now you can see an aggressive acquisition of submarines for IN in near future.Both indigenous and foreign.

 

[Dazzler]

INS chakra SSN from Russia
INS Arihant SSBN
Another one may lease from Russia.



Only for short term.Pakistan present advantage may over in 2020.Because now you can see an aggressive acquisition of submarines for IN in near future.Both indigenous and foreign.

and pakistan will sit idly till 2020?

Once the contract is done, the first AIP sub from China may well be on its way by 2015 or 2016 at best.

By 2020, PN is likely to have 6 or even 7 (3 A-90B, 3-4 Chinese) and this is NOT an optimistic estimate.

Considdering the fact PN received 3 F-22ps within a two year span. Chinese shipyards are well known for their construction speed and timely delivery.

 

[SrNair]

and pakistan will sit idly till 2020?

Once the contract is done, the first AIP sub from China may well be on its way by 2015 or 2016 at best.

By 2020, PN is likely to have 6 or even 7 (3 A-90B, 3-4 Chinese) and this is NOT an optimistic estimate.

Considdering the fact PN received 3 F-22ps within a two year span. Chinese shipyards are well known for their construction speed and timely delivery.

But that may not enough.By 2020 our 5 scorpene submarines (half of them may be AIP) will induct.We have already two nuclear submarines ,another one also purchase from Russia.INS Aridhaman construction is now in top gear.We planned 6 nuke subs and by 2020 you can see at least 3 indigenous submarines in IN.Now some submarines already in our arsenal may upgrade.A new indigenous SSN also is in pipeline.It work already started.
In addition to this we have advanced indigenous ASW corvette with stealth chara.A fleet of Poseidon P-8i is also in hands of IN.
So I already told thats may not enough.

 

[Dazzler]

But that may not enough.By 2020 our 5 scorpene submarines (half of them may be AIP) will induct.We have already two nuclear submarines ,another one also purchase from Russia.INS Aridhaman construction is now in top gear.We planned 6 nuke subs and by 2020 you can see at least 3 indigenous submarines in IN.Now some submarines already in our arsenal may upgrade.A new indigenous SSN also is in pipeline.It work already started.
In addition to this we have advanced indigenous ASW corvette with stealth chara.A fleet of Poseidon P-8i is also in hands of IN.
So I already told thats may not enough.

you have oo many fantasies regarding your IN. Dream on. Keep it on Submarine please instead of bringing the entire naval fleet.

2 Scorpene will have AIP, not 5, detecting an AIP sub is no joke buddy, they are known as hunter killers for a reason. Having 9 AIPs, IN better watch its back.