Pakistan Army's VT-4 Main Battle Tank | Updates & Discussions

[ghazi52]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1447953525351329803

 

[ghazi52]

 

[rvats]

They are harmonizing fast. besides do not neglect their LAT and HAT battalions which are getting beyond the line of sight ATGMs in great quantity.

Unlike the Pakistan Army, the Indian Army does not have dedicated HAT or LAT battalions. Earlier, there used to be some dedicated ATGM battalions, but all of them are now mechanized infantry. ATGMs are held by the infantry battalions. With Milan-2T (tandem warhead), and Konkur-M being the stable ATGMs. Spike-ER has entered service in relatively limited numbers. Over next 2-years, expect to see induction of homegrown 3rd Gen Fire-&-Forget, man-portable ATGM.

 

[PanzerKiel]

Unlike the Pakistan Army, the Indian Army does not have dedicated HAT or LAT battalions. Earlier, there used to be some dedicated ATGM battalions, but all of them are now mechanized infantry. ATGMs are held by the infantry battalions. With Milan-2T (tandem warhead), and Konkur-M being the stable ATGMs. Spike-ER has entered service in relatively limited numbers. Over next 2-years, expect to see induction of homegrown 3rd Gen Fire-&-Forget, man-portable ATGM.

Their Guards battalions are fully equivalent to our HAT units while their R&S units are equivalent to our LAT units.

 

[rvats]

Their Guards battalions are fully equivalent to our HAT units while their R&S units are equivalent to our LAT units.

(1) Mechanized Infantry in the Indian Army comes from two regiments - The Mechanized Infantry Regiment (MIR), and the Brigade of the Guards Regiment. These are all equipped with BMP-2 IFVs.

(2) R&S Battalions, or Recce & Support Battalions are specialized battalions for the role as their name says. These are again of two types - R&S (Wheeled), and R&S (Tracked). Both MIR and The Brigade of The Guards Regiment have few R&S battalions each.

- Apart from all RAPIDs. few infantry divisions also have R&S battalions.
- Tracked R&S are equipped with BMP-2, while Wheeled R&S are equipped with Jeeps, and earlier, BRDM-2 as well.
- But there's more to them than simply AT role. They comes equipped with varied surveillance equipment.

 

[PanzerKiel]

(1) Mechanized Infantry in the Indian Army comes from two regiments - The Mechanized Infantry Regiment (MIR), and the Brigade of the Guards Regiment. These are all equipped with BMP-2 IFVs.

(2) R&S Battalions, or Recce & Support Battalions are specialized battalions for the role as their name says. These are again of two types - R&S (Wheeled), and R&S (Tracked). Both MIR and The Brigade of The Guards Regiment have few R&S battalions each.

- Apart from all RAPIDs. few infantry divisions also have R&S battalions.
- Tracked R&S are equipped with BMP-2, while Wheeled R&S are equipped with Jeeps, and earlier, BRDM-2 as well.
- But there's more to them than simply AT role. They comes equipped with varied surveillance equipment.

Units belonging to brigade of guards are numbered like 19 guards battalion etc.... They are more than half a dozen such units providing heavy anti tank support to armored divisions, RAPIDS and selected infantry divisions in good tank terrain.

R&S units mostly form part of defensive RAPIDS and selected infantry divisions in good tank terrain for providing anti tank and recce support over large frontage.

All of the IFVs can be equipped with ATGMs.... We can imagine their firepower, with 52 BMPS to each guards unit.

 

[sparten]

Their Guards battalions are fully equivalent to our HAT units while their R&S units are equivalent to our LAT units.

I thought our LAT had been disbanded and we now only have the erstwhile MAT and HAT, basically ATGM units.

 

[PanzerKiel]

I thought our LAT had been disbanded and we now only have the erstwhile MAT and HAT, basically ATGM units.

LAT and HAT both are now based on M113 platforms equipped with BSWS and mostly TOW 2As.

 

[Great Janjua]

LAT and HAT both are now based on M113 platforms equipped with BSWS and mostly TOW 2As.

Wouldn't it be better to upgrade HAT m113 to IFVs with 27 or 30mm turret systems encompassing ATGMs? BMP terminator type turret system.

LAT should be based upon land rover or Hilux platforms.

 

[rvats]

Units belonging to brigade of guards are numbered like 19 guards battalion etc.... They are more than half a dozen such units providing heavy anti tank support to armored divisions, RAPIDS and selected infantry divisions in good tank terrain.

R&S units mostly form part of defensive RAPIDS and selected infantry divisions in good tank terrain for providing anti tank and recce support over large frontage.

All of the IFVs can be equipped with ATGMs.... We can imagine their firepower, with 52 BMPS to each guards unit.

Let me try this again -

1. We've 25+ Infantry Regiments. Of these, only two i.e. The Brigade of the Guards, and The Mechanized Infantry Regiment, are mechanized, and equipped with BMP-2s.

2. This is unlike your army where battalions across different infantry regiments are mechanized.

3. There is no difference between equipment profile of MIR and Brigade of Guards (BOG).

4. The mechanized infantry component of all armored divisions, (I) Armored Brigades, (I) Mechanized Brigades, and RAPIDs, comes from both MIR, and BOG.

5. Few battalions from MIR and BOG are equipped for R&S role.

6. And while all BMP-2 can fire Konkur-M missiles, which gives them AT capability, we don't classify these battalions as ATGM battalions.

7. IA actually had certain battalions within BOG marked as ATGM battalions which provided ATGM detachment as per requirement. Some of these detachments fought in Kargil War as well.

8. But, we no longer have dedicated ATGM battalions. All of them are mechanized now.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Looking at the video I thought we'd be going with the box style camo design as below not this old school style. Wasn't their a study done showing the below is more effective:

View attachment 784288

Unfortunately we still have patwaris in airforce army and navy who have the crapiest paint schemes.

 

[PanzerKiel]

Let me try this again -

1. We've 25+ Infantry Regiments. Of these, only two i.e. The Brigade of the Guards, and The Mechanized Infantry Regiment, are mechanized, and equipped with BMP-2s.

2. This is unlike your army where battalions across different infantry regiments are mechanized.

3. There is no difference between equipment profile of MIR and Brigade of Guards (BOG).

4. The mechanized infantry component of all armored divisions, (I) Armored Brigades, (I) Mechanized Brigades, and RAPIDs, comes from both MIR, and BOG.

5. Few battalions from MIR and BOG are equipped for R&S role.

6. And while all BMP-2 can fire Konkur-M missiles, which gives them AT capability, we don't classify these battalions as ATGM battalions.

7. IA actually had certain battalions within BOG marked as ATGM battalions which provided ATGM detachment as per requirement. Some of these detachments fought in Kargil War as well.

8. But, we no longer have dedicated ATGM battalions. All of them are mechanized now.

We might be saying the same things.

1. Agreed.
2. Agreed.
3.Agreed. However, due to their different roles (MIR and ATGM) their tasks and employment pattern is different. Thats my point.
4.Agreed.
5. Battalions in R&S role have 24 BMPs and 28 wheeled BRDMs. Thats the main different with other MIRs / BOGs units which have normally 52 BMPs.
6.Agreed.
7.Main difference between ATGM and BOG units is the level of mechanization. ATGM units fought in Kargil because they are not mechanized.
8.Dedication ATGM units (MILAN) are there, plus mechanized ATGM units are there in the form of BOG units which are dedicated to specific Corps.

Such examples (ATGM) of BOG units are 5, 15, 17 and 19, to name a few. I can tell you their today's location as well....you can visit them to see their equipment and role.
Interestingly, in R&S units, normally they are from MIR, like 17, 19 and 23 MIRs (naming a few)...but even here, there is a BOG unit (12 Guards) which is also R&S. Its there in Jaisalmer, try visiting it if possible.

 

[iLION12345_1]

Unfortunately we still have patwaris in airforce army and navy who have the crapiest paint schemes.

…That’s not how camo schemes work. Just because it looks cool or is digital camo doesn’t mean it’s superior. I suggest leaving the camo designs to the people who know what they’re doing. The tanks are painted like that for a reason. There’s also a reason there’s 4 different camos for the VT-4.

 

[rvats]

<SNIP>
8.Dedication ATGM units (MILAN) are there, plus mechanized ATGM units are there in the form of BOG units which are dedicated to specific Corps.

Such examples (ATGM) of BOG units are 5, 15, 17 and 19, to name a few. I can tell you their today's location as well....you can visit them to see their equipment and role.

Interestingly, in R&S units, normally they are from MIR, like 17, 19 and 23 MIRs (naming a few)...but even here, there is a BOG unit (12 Guards) which is also R&S. Its there in Jaisalmer, try visiting it if possible

8. Let me repeat again, we don't have dedicated ATGM units. Each infantry unit in plains uses a mix of Milan-2/2T and Konkur-M and packs a pretty powerful ATGM punch.

- 17 Bn, BOG is a R&S (Tracked) Unit.
- 19 Bn, BOG is a R&S (Wheeled) Unit.
- 19 Bn, MIR is also R&S (Tracked)
- 23 Bn, MIR is R&S (Tracked)

* And it is no surprise that Jaisalmer has a R&S Battalion; the armored bde of a RAPID is based there.

 

[iLION12345_1]

Semi-automatic loading process in VT-4 (similar system present in Al-Khalid, T90, T80, T72 and likely also ZTZ-96 and 99). Used as a backup in case auto-loader has a fault. Shown in detail here by a Thai tanker.