Pakistan Army's T-129 ATAK Helicopter Deal | Updates & Discussions.

[RadarGudumluMuhimmat]

You have been kicked out of the F-35 program even though your produce parts for it lol that to under complete TOT from the US. Turkey has honestly contributed nill to the F-35 or else it wouldnt have been so easy for the US to kick it out of the program.. hell even the israelis got the F-35 before you guys

Pakistan has been producing UAVs since the 80s... we have more advnaced UCAVs and have put them to use on the battle field a decade before you did. We have blasted terrorist from afghanistan to india without any losses whereby your UCAVs have been shot like hot cakes in syria and libia.. We have been producing the jf-17 since the early 2000's while you are stuck making sub components of the f-16...

Our aerospace industry is atleast a decade ahead of yours... turkey cannot even produce ballistic or cruise missiles whereby we have been making those since the 80s... if your wanna include even more advanced tech such as nukes we are a good 40 years ahead of turkey... that is including all the western help you guys received compared to us being sanctioned



I fail to see what any partnership with the turks has helped us achieve in the last few decades... only issue after issue with them and their weapons have proven to be subpar in both syrian and libia... id rather stick to fully indigionus or work with the chinese

We do everything, not the lower parts of the 2nd F16. And while comparing a 3rd class garbage with a Ukrainian engine with a new radar added to mig 21 with f16, you will first bring destur. These works are not like combining 2 - 3 pieces of china-made litter in your country and saying "Baktar - Shikan". Turkey produces many years of ballistic missiles and cruise missiles. Our ballistic missile is probably still behind, but our cruise missiles are still very far ahead and come with their own engine, with its own native contribution. We do not collect from aliexpress like you. Even the dream that we use in our products (ship systems - land vehicles - atgms - uav - electro optic systems - ew - radar) cannot catch up. Keep crying buddy, they made you sleep a little too much. Do not forget to take the submarine from our country.

And let's put everything aside, you say "even Israel". It will not take a week for Israel to straighten Pakistan, my friend. I think someone in this forum is boosting someone in dreams too much. The only thing you are good at is Solid and Liquid fuel engines, you are behind Iran. Even if you claim that you are good at rocket science, you are unable even to build an air defense system.




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We hit more Tank - Sam - Soldiers in Syria, Afghanistan, or in any Indian geography with the systems you call trash, even in your dreams. Also these were made with videos, not with lies that Indians and Pakistani loved.

 

[KaiserX]

We do everything, not the lower parts of the 2nd F16. And while comparing a 3rd class garbage with a Ukrainian engine with a new radar added to mig 21 with f16, you will first bring destur. These works are not like combining 2 - 3 pieces of china-made litter in your country and saying "Baktar - Shikan". Turkey produces many years of ballistic missiles and cruise missiles. Our ballistic missile is probably still behind, but our cruise missiles are still very far ahead and come with their own engine, with its own native contribution. We do not collect from aliexpress like you. Even the dream that we use in our products (ship systems - land vehicles - atgms - uav - electro optic systems - ew - radar) cannot catch up. Keep crying buddy, they made you sleep a little too much. Do not forget to take the submarine from our country.

What a joke.

Turkey is the only country in the world which managed to have one of the best tanks lepeard 2 be blown to pieces by low grade syrians... your f-16s were shot through the skies by greeks.. your ucavs are shot by hot cakes daily in lybia and syria... you cant even produce simple manpads to protect your troops in syria/lybia were the russians bombed them.

Even simple components such as manpads pakistan has proven to shot down 3 indian aircrats... lets go to higher grade... we produced better tanks ie al khalid which proved itself with insurgents...

Now higher grade tech... jf-17 all you guys have is atak and that to with unreliable american engines

Missile tech... babur1 babur 2, Raad, countless classes of ballistic missiles... no comparison you are stuck shopping for chinese off the shelf short range missiles lol

You talk about baktar shikan??? funny thing is turks begged us for these to transfer to the muslims in kosovo and they proved themselves in combat...decade later you begged us for some more to give to your allies in syria... once again proved themselves to blow syrian/russian tanks to bits.. if your missiles are sooo good then how come you didnt supply any in both wars???

 

[RadarGudumluMuhimmat]

What a joke.

Turkey is the only country in the world which managed to have one of the best tanks lepeard 2 be blown to pieces by low grade syrians... your f-16s were shot through the skies by greeks.. your ucavs are shot by hot cakes daily in lybia and syria... you cant even produce simple manpads to protect your troops in syria/lybia were the russians bombed them.

Even simple components such as manpads pakistan has proven to shot down 3 indian aircrats... lets go to higher grade... we produced better tanks ie al khalid which proved itself with insurgents...

Now higher grade tech... jf-17 all you guys have is atak and that to with unreliable american engines

Missile tech... babur1 babur 2, Raad, countless classes of ballistic missiles... no comparison you are stuck shopping for chinese off the shelf short range missiles lol

You talk about baktar shikan??? funny thing is turks begged us for these to transfer to the muslims in kosovo and they proved themselves in combat...decade later you begged us for some more to give to your allies in syria... once again proved themselves to blow syrian/russian tanks to bits.. if your missiles are sooo good then how come you didnt supply any in both wars???

Ahahaha buddy you are really funny. The number of planes we dropped 3 week ago in Syria 1 day is more than you dropped in 20 years. A sorry I didn't count what you fell, right? Ahahaha. Yes. A modified garbage soviet engine is more capable than a mig 21 f16. I hope you haven't forgotten to buy your modernized F16. For years, we have been broadcasting your anti-missile missiles, which we have not seen any other images except the raad or engine of which you have installed the Chinese engine, with their sea skimming capabilities. (Som-Atmaca) The Ts 1400 Turbine engine is something that the country cannot imagine in its life. The money spent only for metallurgy is more than your country's annual defense R&D budget. We have been producing simple manpads in the nato standard since the 80s, so Roketsan was founded, but it is not your fault that you do not know that you can not hit a fighter plane with the manpad, you are a poor person deceived by empty propaganda for years.

Probably you need to also partner with Iran...

By the by, the entire Russian AD, including S300/400, were made dysfunctional as the Asdaidst and Iranian proxy bastards were cut not pieces...

Oh yes, I think some of the bodies we have cut into pieces in Syria, I think, have gone to Pakistan.

 

[Tipu7]

Only in your imagination.. Z-10 is still better than those obsolete cobra and simply put we have no better realistic option... dream all you want but an 3rd party western option will continued to be sanctioned as they were the last few 4 decades..

Pal, you misunderstood. I have questioned the 'goodness' of Z10 by keeping into perspective the capabilities it delivers with respect to problems it causes during daily operations. It's meant to be compared with AH1Z & T129B, with whom it is competing to replace Cobras, not with Cobras it is meant to replace.

And kindly be respectful in your behavior. Not everyone here is a keyboard warrior copying pasting wiki based information.

 

[Sine Nomine]

@waz @jaibi @AgNoStiC MuSliM from page 227 to last one,thread needs cleaning and some needful action against,those who are derailing it by trolling.

 

[cabatli_53]

@The Eagle @waz

 

[nomi007]

MS-500V2 would be under-powered for T129. Best to wait for the TS1400.

Best is to go for AH-1Z, if we cancel the T-129 atak deal and choose 30 AH-1Z than chances for 12+ AH-1Zs delivery will more easier

 

[The Eagle]

No more measuring contest and derailment. Thread topic must remain as per subject and those who can't stick to it, cannot add any thing worthy to discuss, may please remain silent and help us to save from derailment as well as worthless discussion. Few members are now banned from thread and the same action will applied for further violation. Please keep it professional & productive.

Regards,

 

[HRK]

..........

enough of you blabbering posts with flambait attitude .....

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

I fail to see what any partnership with the turks has helped us achieve in the last few decades... only issue after issue with them and their weapons have proven to be subpar in both syrian and libia... id rather stick to fully indigionus or work with the chinese

We never partnered with the Turks on major programs to know any of that. Sure, it's fine if you're reluctant about their end-applications (e.g., T129), but you can still partner with them to co-develop the critical inputs (such as the engine) that you can re-apply to a totally in-house design, one tailored from the ground-up for Pakistan.

That said, the PN's MILGEM deal is a good example. When asked to, the Turks modified the design so that it could carry a 16-cell VLS (for SAMs). In addition, the Turks will transfer turnkey ship design and integration knowledge to the NRDI so that Pakistan can design its own corvettes and frigates in the future.

 

[xbat]

i think PAK factories are busy to manufacture super mushaks for Turkey, any cancellation may effect that program too. by the way when PAK army orders something from china do you guys get off - sets ?

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

army has to realize that defense equipment is becoming unaffordable very fast and just buying off the shelf isnt going to work.
than it has to provide jobs for millions of pakistanis, and imports dont do that.

its better that home grown equipment cots twice as long as it employs people.

if HAL builds a chopper or LCA at twice price it isnt bad..because HAL also employs 1000s of people....and yet even at twice the price it will still be cheaper than any import option.

Pakistan will need 100s of helicopters, tanks, tank engines, artillery and vehicles..and it can't just keep importing them. It needs to patner with china(who don't need us and thus wont be an easy negotiation), turkey, ukrain adn south Africa.

so far PAF is playing it smart, but i dont see any other service even trying. PAF decision not to buy J10 and instead just focus on jf17 is comendable ..

sooner or later people will start hating the military for spending too much ....

The PN also switched to the PAF's line of thinking. The MILGEM-J -- while a custom design from Turkey -- will come with turnkey ship design expertise transfer so that Pakistan can design its own frigate-class ships. The fourth ship will be just that, our first joint-frigate program. Likewise, the PN is also taking up the LRMPA program on its own, the subsystem selection, integration, testing, etc will be done in Pakistan.

i think PAK factories are busy to manufacture super mushaks for Turkey, any cancellation may effect that program too. by the way when PAK army orders something from china do you guys get off - sets ?

Nope. China has zero interest in such a thing.

 

[M.AsfandYar]

i think PAK factories are busy to manufacture super mushaks for Turkey, any cancellation may effect that program too. by the way when PAK army orders something from china do you guys get off - sets ?

no

 

[xbat]

why no?

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

why no?

1. China generally isn't into offsets
2. Our decision makers are lazy about it (even though our procurement policy requires a 15%+ offset).