Pakistan Air Force | News & Discussions.

[zebra7]

Duh. And are you really that pompous to think the PAF hasn't got answers for them?

I would like to hear the answer to that ? Give it a try.

Little do you know that so is PAF's F-7PG

Does it is BVR Capable, have helmet high bore sight cued missile abroad, what is the range of the Radar --Griffo

MiG had (rather crappy)IRST and AA-11 Archer even prior to upgrade. So what's the point of flaunting 'em now!

LOLZ, Russians have a long history and experience with the IRST, and it is an standard part of the Russian/Soviet birds. For crappy IRST, and AA-11 Archer -- Should I laugh.
R73, with the sensetive, cryogenic cooled seaker, can see the target 40 km away, and could be targeted by just looking toward the target, with cueing with the Helmet mouted display, and have bore sight, and is considered as very dangerous and lethal weapon by US and NATO.

Currently the R-73 is the best Russian short range air-to-air missile. Apart from an exceptional maneuverability, this missile is also directly connected to the pilot's helmet, which allows engagement of targets lateral to the aircraft, which cannot be engaged by missiles with a traditional system of targeting and guidance. The R-73A, an earlier variant of this missile, has a 30 km range, while the most recent R-73M can hit targets at a distance of 40 km.

The R-73 short-range, close-combat standardized missile was developed in the Vympel Machine Building Design Bureau, and became operational in 1984. The R-73 is included in the weapon complex of MiG-23MLD, MiG-29 and Su-27 fighters and their modifications and also of Mi-24, Mi-28 and Ka-50 helicopters. It also can be employed in flying craft which do not have sophisticated aiming systems.

The missile is used for engaging modern and future fighters, attack aircraft, bombers, helicopters, drones and cruise missiles, including those executing a maneuver with a g-force up to 12. It permits the platform to intercept a target from any direction, under any weather conditions, day or night, in the presence of natural interference and deliberate jamming. It realizes the "fire and forget" principle.

The missile design features a canard aerodynamic configuration: control surfaces are positioned ahead of the wing at a distance from the center of mass. The airframe consists of modular compartments accommodating the homing head, aerodynamic control surface drive system, autopilot, proximity fuze, warhead, engine, gas-dynamic control system and aileron drive system. The lifting surfaces have a small aspect ratio. Strakes are mounted ahead of the aerodynamic control surfaces. The combined aero-gas-dynamic control gives the R-73 highly maneuverable flight characteristics. During flight, yaw and pitch are controlled by four aerodynamic control surfaces connected in pairs and by just as many gas-dynamic spoilers (fins) installed at the nozzle end of the engine. Control with engine not operating is provided by aerodynamic control surfaces. Roll stabilization of the missile is maintained with the help of four mechanically interconnected ailerons mounted on the wings. Drives of all missile controls are gas, powered from a solid-propellant gas generator.

The passive infrared homing head supports target lock-on before launch. Guidance to the predicted position is by the proportional navigation method. The missile's combat equipment consists of an active proximity (radar or laser) fuze and impact fuze and a continuous-rod warhead. The engine operates on high-impulse solid propellant and has a high-tensile steel case. Russia's Vympel weapons designers have developed a one-of-a-kind air-to-air missile, which NATO has dubbed as AA-11, for use on foreign fighter planes. Techically and militarily the new missile, meant for quick-action dogfights, leave its foreign analogues far behind. Vympel experts have also made it possible for the new missile to be easily installed on all available types of aircraft. The AA-11 can also be used on older planes which will now be able to effectively handle the US' highly maneuverable F-15 and F-16 jets. The AA-11 missile is based on all-new components, use new high-energy solid fuel and an advanced guidance and control system which has made it possible to minimize their size. Their exceptionally high accuracy is ensured by the missile's main secret, the so-called transverse control engine, which rules out misses during the final approach trajectory. The transverse control engine is still without parallel in the world.
Russia has offered the export-version R-7EE air-to-air missile system for sale so that it can be fitted to foreign-made fighter aircraft. Developed by the Vympel state-sector engineering and design bureau, the R-7EE is designed for close-quarters aerial combat. Vympel specialists have developed a way of ensuring that the missile system can be fitted to virtually any type of aircraft. It can be fitted to older aircraft, which feature heavily in third-world countries' air forces.

Just cuz India paid more than enough for Mirage-2000 upgrade, doesn't make 'em 5th gen fighters. They are still 4th gen fighter and can be countered.

LOLZ, India paid more for Mirrage 2000 Upgrade compared to whom F-16 A/B of PAF MLU ??

1. Does the MLUes part includes the extensive upgrade e.g the Modular Mission computer Artitecture.

2. Does the MLU also includes the BVR 400 MICA IR/RF.

3. Does the MLU/upgrade will allow 40year/6000 hours of the life. (Better ask your senior, whether the MLU Package of the F-16 A/B contains any Engine Pratt and Witney F-100 PW-200 turbofan OR lust the MRO kit)

Yes I know and so does the PAF.

Then PAF might know that the RAM coating developed exclusively for the MIG-21 Bison, reduces the RCS to 1/10 of the RCS of the Mig-21, and with Israeli Elta EL/L-8222 Jammer, is also equipped with R-77 long range BVR, and lethal R-73 (AA11 Archer)

Isn't this exactly what India has tried to pull off? and that too not using planes but JAHAAZs if you know what I mean

No I don't understand the meaning of JAHAAZ but yes the idea is the Brahmos-NG/MINI which will enable every planes of the IAF to carry them, and the JAHAAZ (MKI) might be able to carry 5.

 

[IrbiS]

LOLZ, Russians have a long history and experience with the IRST, and it is an standard part of the Russian/Soviet birds. For crappy IRST, and AA-11 Archer -- Should I laugh.
R73, with the sensetive, cryogenic cooled seaker, can see the target 40 km away, and could be targeted by just looking toward the target, with cueing with the Helmet mouted display, and have bore sight, and is considered as very dangerous and lethal weapon by US and NATO.

Don't put your words in my mouth. I called IRST crappy not the ARCHER. If I wanted to, could've written two crappies!

Come on. you know it cant hit a target when fired from 40km away. Didn't reckon u are kinda guy to believe paper specs.

LOLZ, India paid more for Mirrage 2000 Upgrade compared to whom F-16 A/B of PAF MLU ??

1. Does the MLUes part includes the extensive upgrade e.g the Modular Mission computer Artitecture.

2. Does the MLU also includes the BVR 400 MICA IR/RF.

3. Does the MLU/upgrade will allow 40year/6000 hours of the life. (Better ask your senior, whether the MLU Package of the F-16 A/B contains any Engine Pratt and Witney F-100 PW-200 turbofan OR lust the MRO kit)

Let's talk money. We paid $650 million for a ton of weapons including 500 AMRAAMs among other items.

$1.3 billion for 60 upgrade kits plus $150 million for structural modifications and Engine enhancement from F-100-200 to F-100-229 (Pakistan had upgraded to 100-200 years ago along with structural upgrades during sanctions period) and will seek update in the future as Lockheed is currently developing 6000 hours upgrade.

Then PAF might know that the RAM coating developed exclusively for the MIG-21 Bison, reduces the RCS to 1/10 of the RCS of the Mig-21, and with Israeli Elta EL/L-8222 Jammer, is also equipped with R-77 long range BVR, and lethal R-73 (AA11 Archer)

ROSE and JF-17

No I don't understand the meaning of JAHAAZ but yes the idea is the Brahmos-NG/MINI which will enable every planes of the IAF to carry them, and the JAHAAZ (MKI) might be able to carry 5.

Kamra doesn't ring a bell?

 

[zebra7]

Don't put your words in my mouth. I called IRST crappy not the ARCHER. If I wanted to, could've written two crappies!

Come on. you know it cant hit a target when fired from 40km away. Didn't reckon u are kinda guy to believe paper specs.

Ok, then I take my words back. But doesn't the High Bore sight, high maneuverable IR guided WVR Missile of long range is a great threat.

Let's talk money. We paid $650 million for a ton of weapons including 500 AMRAAMs among other items.

OK but the Mirrage 2000 H upgrade to Mirrage 2005 includes the MICA IR/RF BVRAAM

$1.3 billion for 60 upgrade kits plus $150 million for structural modifications and Engine enhancement from F-100-200 to F-100-229 (Pakistan had upgraded to 100-200 years ago along with structural upgrades during sanctions period) and will seek update in the future as Lockheed is currently developing 6000 hours upgrade.

1. Just give me the Link that shows the Engine enhancement from F-100 200 to F/100-229 upgradation kit instead of MRO kit.

2. The F-16 A/B purchased with Peace Gate 1 and Peace Gate 2 -- 40 in number minus 8 loss was desinged for the A2A role, and the life of the Structual Airframe depends on the Stress, but since PAF was forced to use it for A2G laid down heavy stress. The structural Modifications kits includes only the modification of certain parts, prone to cracks and deformation due to stress. It allows to give strengthening of the airframe parts but not rectify the cracks which is already been done. And by 2007, PAF already conducted 100,000 hours of flight with its 32 birds.

3. The Phalcon SLEP program, by the LM to increase the Airframe of the F-16 Block 30 (F-16 C/D) and not for the F-16 A/B, thats why there are so many countries in the world waiting so desperately for the F-35.

4. Why looking at the price tag with narrow mind, when not comparing the comprehensive Upgradation, and the partial upgradation. In short Mirrage 2005 would be able to give its service to IAF till 2030-35, if you think the MLUed F-16 A/B could also do that, than its good for you.

ROSE and JF-17

ROSE Upgradation won't allow the Mirrage 3/5 to make them worthy till 2030, like Jaguar Darin -3, which includes the Honeywell Engine. P.S. HAL have all the tools, and jigs to license produce its airframe anytime.

JF-17 Still in IOC stage, though been supported by PAF, and inducted into service. But question is does it is PAR to F-16 Block 52, and answer me unbiased.

Kamra doesn't ring a bell?

What ring a bell ??

HAL, Tata Aerospace, Reliance Aerospace, Godrej Aerospace, Mahindra Aerospace there are 20 Aerospace Pvt company in India now.

And don't undermine Tata, Reliance, Godrej, Mahindra budget and turnover. The top 4 Indian company turnover is equal to the whole GDP of the Pakistan.

Does it ring a Bell Brother.

 

[IrbiS]

But doesn't the High Bore sight, high maneuverable IR guided WVR Missile of long range is a great threat.

Yeah and you will be facing similar threat on the western border in coming days

OK but the Mirrage 2000 H upgrade to Mirrage 2005 includes the MICA IR/RF BVRAAM

You will be buying MICA from MBDA, why is Dassault charging that much? Like F-16 were upgraded by LM but Raytheon provided missiles and 500 AMRAAMs cost around $250 million.

1. Just give me the Link that shows the Engine enhancement from F-100 200 to F/100-229 upgradation kit instead of MRO kit.

2. The F-16 A/B purchased with Peace Gate 1 and Peace Gate 2 -- 40 in number minus 8 loss was desinged for the A2A role, and the life of the Structual Airframe depends on the Stress, but since PAF was forced to use it for A2G laid down heavy stress. The structural Modifications kits includes only the modification of certain parts, prone to cracks and deformation due to stress. It allows to give strengthening of the airframe parts but not rectify the cracks which is already been done. And by 2007, PAF already conducted 100,000 hours of flight with its 32 birds.

3. The Phalcon SLEP program, by the LM to increase the Airframe of the F-16 Block 30 (F-16 C/D) and not for the F-16 A/B, thats why there are so many countries in the world waiting so desperately for the F-35.

4. Why looking at the price tag with narrow mind, when not comparing the comprehensive Upgradation, and the partial upgradation. In short Mirrage 2005 would be able to give its service to IAF till 2030-35, if you think the MLUed F-16 A/B could also do that, than its good for you.

It's available u can search if it's worth your time and 229 transformation was done by PAC Kamra. My connection is really giving me a hard time.

Not 32 but 31 of the original 40 are left, one crashed in 2009 which some speculate was purposefully done to provide China with U.S technology

Why do you think we will be out of F-16s? More will be coming

So now I'm narrow minded when u can't tell me why u were overcharged

ROSE Upgradation won't allow the Mirrage 3/5 to make them worthy till 2030, like Jaguar Darin -3, which includes the Honeywell Engine. P.S. HAL have all the tools, and jigs to license produce its airframe anytime.

We don't have to match IAF in numbers. Pakistan got no expansion or global power projection goals, neither that kinda money nor we'll attack India first. It's just for safeguarding our own country

JF-17 Still in IOC stage, though been supported by PAF, and inducted into service. But question is does it is PAR to F-16 Block 52, and answer me unbiased.

PAF doesn't exactly like to make a scrapbook for every step its babies take. That thing which you say is in IOC, is sitting ADA duties with live weapons and is fully integrated in our NetCentric environment with F-16 jocks on controls.

It's like Apples and Oranges, or let me rephrase it : Apple and Huawei You got most sought after product on one hand that got no match but it got restrictions in some areas. On the other hand, you got your own version of Android and you can fiddle with it anyway you want. Now what you asked is if we really like our own Huawei? I think we would've loved us a flagship model better, not a mid-ranger.

Does it ring a Bell Brother.

Was talking about Kamra attack in refrence to your comment that AEW&Cs will be India's 1st priority

 

[HRK]

MIG-21 Bison, reduces the RCS to 1/10 of the RCS of the Mig-21,

I would appreciate any credible link about this CLAIM (other than this no more off topic posting )

& just to straight the record I am attaching some screenshot below

and with Israeli Elta EL/L-8222 Jammer, is also equipped with R-77 long range BVR, and lethal R-73 (AA11 Archer)

Do you know MIG-21 Bison is also BVR Capable, was very sucessful against the USAF during Dact exercise, when backed by MKI.

Link to report CAG report: http://www.cag.gov.in/sites/default...mpliance_Defence_Air_Force_Report_38_2015.pdf
=======================================
General Warning for all members

No more off-topic posting .....

 

[zebra7]

I would appreciate any credible link about this CLAIM (other than this no more off topic posting )

& just to straight the record I am attaching some screenshot below



View attachment 301377 View attachment 301379 View attachment 301378



View attachment 301380
View attachment 301386 View attachment 301387

Link to report CAG report: http://www.cag.gov.in/sites/default...mpliance_Defence_Air_Force_Report_38_2015.pdf
=======================================
General Warning for all members

No more off-topic posting .....

Allow me some time to response to you posting in some other thread, SIR.

I understand, the discussion was going too off topic and I regret for that.

@HRK could you comment on the Engine change from F-100 220 to F-100 229 under Peace Drive -II program done by TAI.

 

[HRK]

Allow me some time to response to you posting in some other thread, SIR.

I understand, the discussion was going too off topic and I regret for that.

@HRK could you comment on the Engine change from F-100 220 to F-100 229 under Peace Drive -II program done by TAI.

Watch PAC documentary at PAC website .... if a I am not wrong Engine issue is mention in that

 

[IrbiS]

I would appreciate any credible link about this CLAIM (other than this no more off topic posting )

& just to straight the record I am attaching some screenshot below



View attachment 301377 View attachment 301379 View attachment 301378



View attachment 301380
View attachment 301386 View attachment 301387

Link to report CAG report: http://www.cag.gov.in/sites/default...mpliance_Defence_Air_Force_Report_38_2015.pdf
=======================================
General Warning for all members

No more off-topic posting .....

Nailed it!

 

[v9s]

Does it is BVR Capable, have helmet high bore sight cued missile abroad, what is the range of the Radar --Griffo

\
Yes it is. I won't hold your hand. You'll have to search.

 

[Quwa]

PAF F-16A/B went through the Falcon STAR program, which is meant to ensure the airframe reaches 8000 hours.

 

[LonE_WolF]

https://twitter.com/x/status/723171639307935744

 

[T-55]

Pakistan‬-‎China‬ air force joint exercise in Pakistan "Shaheen-V"

 

[Introvert]

JF-17 logs over 19,000 operational flight hours

The Pakistan Air Force’s JF-17s have logged over 19,000 operational flight hours, talks are also underway with up to eight countries interested in the Thunder

By Bilal Khan

Alan Warnes, an aviation journalist and leading Pakistan Air Force (PAF) watcher, recently reported that the PAF’s JF-17s have logged more than 19,000 operational fight hours since the fighter’s induction into active service in 2011. There are 65 JF-17s in the PAF (allocated to three operational fighter squadrons and a training unit belonging to Combat Commanders School).

Although the dual-seat JF-17B is slated for induction by April 2017, Alan Warnes was able to learn from PAF officials that the first JF-17B will be delivered to Pakistan by December of this year.

Elsewhere, Pakistan’s Minister of Defence Production, Rana Tanveer Hussain, told Pakistani media outlets that Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) was in talks with “seven or eight” countries over the possibility of selling JF-17s. Details into which countries were not disclosed.

Comment & Analysis

It will be interesting to see how the introduction of the JF-17B will impact those talks. The dual-seat JF-17B is expected to strengthen PAC’s ability to market the Thunder to prospective buyers.

Not only will it offer a familiar means for training and converting to the JF-17, but the PAF could even market the JF-17B as a stand-alone solution. For example, the JF-17B will essentially be used as a lead-in fighter trainer (LIFT) or fighter conversion unit (FCU) platform in the PAF. PAC could market the JF-17B as a low-cost LIFT, one with a comprehensive training package involving high-fidelity simulators as well.

Alternatively, integration with a competitive targeting pod and a wide range of air-to-ground munitions (such as laser-guided bombs, missiles and rockets) and stand-off weapons (such as anti-ship cruise missiles and glide-bombs) could position the JF-17B as a low-cost attack fighter.

For air forces with limited funding and/or access to Western goods, a JF-17B strike platform could be an interesting means to both replace far less capable older jets (such as the MiG-21) as well as affordably build modern qualitative capabilities – such as precision-strike and anti-ship warfare.

In fact, packaging an end-to-end solution that includes various air-to-ground munitions could open up an opportunity for Pakistan to vertically integrate customers, and thus, open up additional opportunities for the Pakistani defence industry.

By being the primary source of the JF-17’s munitions, organizations such as Global Industrial Defence Solutions (GIDS), National Engineering and Scientific Commission (NESCOM), and Pakistan Ordnance Factories (POF) could enhance the JF-17’s value proposition as well as increase the revenue accrued from its sale. This could also be way to offset the cost of raising local production capacities for munitions, particularly expensive ones such as anti-ship missiles or new-generation air-to-air missiles.

http://quwa.org/2016/04/29/jf-17-logs-19000-operational-flight-hours/

 

[PDF]

We might counter Rafale with Euro typhoon. Funding is the main issue but we can come around the problem.

 

[fatman17]

May 3/16: The Sri Lankan media has reported

that Pakistan has offered its JF-17 fighter at $29 million each to the Sri Lankan Air Force (SLAF). Islamabad has been pressing the Sri Lankan government to replace its fleet of MiG-27 and Kfir fleets with its indigenous aircraft, but the deal has been met with opposition from India. Instead, it is thought that the SLAF will purchase fighters from Russia, believed to be in the price range of $20-25 million per aircraft.