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China and Pakistan Air Forces Launch Joint Training Exercise
The joint training exercise was launched this Saturday and is slated to run until April 30.

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By Franz-Stefan Gady for The Diplomat
April 12, 2016


The People’s Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF) and the Pakistan Air Force (PAF) kicked off a joint training exercise this weekend, Xinhua news agency reports. The military drill, code-named “Shaheen (Eagle)-5” began on April 9 in Pakistan and is scheduled to run for three weeks until April 30.

“China’s Air Force hopes to widen the scope of cooperation and dialogue with all countries and regions,” the Chinese Ministry of Defense statement said in a statement quoted by Reuters. Neither China nor Pakistan offered additional details on where the exercise is being held or how many aircraft and troops –including combat pilots, air defense controllers, and technical ground crew–will be involved in the next three weeks.

Last year’s installment of the military drill, dubbed Shaheen-4, featured fourth-generation fighter jets and bombers as well as airborne early warning and control (AEW&C) aircraft. The PAF alone participated with three different types of frontline fighter aircraft from different squadrons (likely the JF-17 Thunder, Dassault Mirage III/5, and F7 PG fighter aircraft).

The PLAAF and PAF have held regular drills since March 2011 with the first Shaheen exercise held in Pakistan. The second training exercise took place in the Xinjiang Uygur Autonomous Region in western China in September 2013, the third was held in Punjab, Pakistan, in May 2014.

Speaking to Reuters, the PAF second-in-command, Air-Vice Marshal Muhammad Ashfaque Arain, said that the PAF heavily relies on its fleet of around 70 U.S.-made F-16 fighter jets in its anti-terrorist operations in Pakistan. Whether any F-16 aircraft will participate in the training exercise is unknown. In February, the United States finally approved a possible of eight additional F-16 Block-52 fighters to Pakistan in a deal valued at $699 million.

This Monday, the PAF also inducted 16 upgraded JF-17 Thunder Block II combat aircraft during a handover ceremony in Kamra, also known as Aviation City, the center of aircraft manufacturing in Pakistan. The JF-17 Thunder combat aircraft has been jointly developed by the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex and Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation (PAC/CAIC) and is meant to replace the PAF’s aging fleet of Dassault Mirage III/5 fighter jets by 2o20.

The chief of air staff, Air Chief Marshal Sohail Aman, said that Pakistan achieved its goal of producing 16 JF-17 Thunder aircraft in 2015 and intends to up the production to 24 jets in 2016. Pakistan is looking to replace 190 aircraft—primarily Chengdu F-7 and Dassault Mirage III/5 fighter jets—by 2020 presumably with a mixture of F-16 and JF-17 aircraft. Pakistan, however, is also allegedly in talks with Russia over the purchase of Su-35 multi-role fighters.
 
.Air Marshal Asghar Khan with his team of senior officers visiting a logistic unit in Turkey 1964… and saluting the turkish flag while the turkish national Anthem is playing

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would request you to post this in Turkish Defence section ....
 
Who is underestimating it? The only IAF aircraft people talk about here is the MKI and rafale. While M2k and Mig-29 are good they are roughly in league with F-16 and JF-17 but its the MKI AND Rafale combo that worries PAF.
 
Who is underestimating it? The only IAF aircraft people talk about here is the MKI and rafale. While M2k and Mig-29 are good they are roughly in league with F-16 and JF-17 but its the MKI AND Rafale combo that worries PAF.


Both aren't the cutting edge of IAF and if PAF is ready for the cutting edge (Flanker) then these two can be dealt with by default and mind you, without underestimating them! IAF will not be using M2K as 1st line aerial fighter anyway in the conflict.

About Fulcrum, during the Kargil Conflict our Fighting Falcons got almost in the firing envelope of their Sidewinders with Mig-29s HEAD ON before pulling back and without being detected (well......in time). And that was poor PAF hammered by sanctions and limited resources with 80s fighters. Today's PAF is ten-fold more resourceful in terms of equipment and training.
 
The Mig29 and m2k of today in IAF a different beasts than they were. Still inferior in my estimate to F-16 block 52 but as good if not slightly better than JF-17.
 
The Mig29 and m2k of today in IAF a different beasts than they were. Still inferior in my estimate to F-16 block 52 but as good if not slightly better than JF-17.

They upgraded and so did we, so no worries.
 
Why are we underestimating IAF SU30? It is a credible threat. We have become a very defensive force.

I am friendly with a retired RAF Group Captain at my Skeet Shooting club. He was an ex RAF Jaguar & Harrier pilot.

Apparently main problem with Soviet fighters is shorter life span of airframe & engines, which makes maintenance quite onerous. Hence greater lifetime cycle cost. According to the Groupie; Flanker ( SU-27) is one of the best fighter plane ever designed and Eurofighter Typhoon project had the primary object to come up with a plane that would beat the Flanker. SU-30 Mk1 & SU-35 are improved versions of SU-27.

Unless there is an actual dogfight combat you would never know. It is possible that F-16 Block 52 in the fighter mode ( missiles only & no bombs) could outclass a fully loaded Su-30 Mk1, but in my humble opinion, it is the Rafael, Typhoon & F-16 Block 60 that are probably at par with Su-35 and marginally better than Su-30 MK1 with thrust vectoring engines. We under estimate MK1 at our peril.
 
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They upgraded and so did we, so no worries.

Do the upgraded one have IRST, Internal Jammers, Hobs Missiles like R-73.

Does the fight is fought on one on one basis.

Have you checked the Mirrage 2000 UPG specs, Mig 29 UPG Specs, Jaguar Darin - 3 Specs.

Do you know MIG-21 Bison is also BVR Capable, was very sucessful against the USAF during Dact exercise, when backed by MKI.

Do you know, after the war broke up, the first target would be the airbases of the PAF AWAACs and airdefence systems like Radar installations, with the long range Supersonic Cruise missiles like Brahmos.
 
Do the upgraded one have IRST, Internal Jammers, Hobs Missiles like R-73.
Internal Jammer with DFRM - Check
HOBS - No...AMRAAM's all the way!
IRST - Overrated (especially if russian)

Do you know MIG-21 Bison is also BVR Capable, was very sucessful against the USAF during Dact exercise, when backed by MKI.

Little do you know that so is PAF's F-7PG

Do you know, after the war broke up, the first target would be the airbases of the PAF AWAACs and airdefence systems like Radar installations, with the long range Supersonic Cruise missiles like Brahmos.

Duh. And are you really that pompous to think the PAF hasn't got answers for them?
 
scary..... now one can understand why suddenly there is a lot of activity in PAF procurement of assets, exercises and Arial drills going on, in and out side country.

replying to this:-
About Fulcrum, during the Kargil Conflict our Fighting Falcons got almost in the firing envelope of their Sidewinders with Mig-29s HEAD ON before pulling back and without being detected (well......in time). And that was poor PAF hammered by sanctions and limited resources with 80s fighters. Today's PAF is ten-fold more resourceful in terms of equipment and training.



Source: https://defence.pk/threads/pakistan-air-force-news-discussions.8600/page-165#ixzz46OLih59X
 
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Do the upgraded one have IRST, Internal Jammers, Hobs Missiles like R-73.

MiG had (rather crappy)IRST and AA-11 Archer even prior to upgrade. So what's the point of flaunting 'em now!


Have you checked the Mirrage 2000 UPG specs, Mig 29 UPG Specs, Jaguar Darin - 3 Specs.

Just cuz India paid more than enough for Mirage-2000 upgrade, doesn't make 'em 5th gen fighters. They are still 4th gen fighter and can be countered.


Do you know MIG-21 Bison is also BVR Capable, was very sucessful against the USAF during Dact exercise, when backed by MKI.

Yes I know and so does the PAF.

Do you know, after the war broke up, the first target would be the airbases of the PAF AWAACs


Isn't this exactly what India has tried to pull off? and that too not using planes but JAHAAZs if you know what I mean :azn:

scary..... now one can understand why suddenly there is a lot of activity in PAF procurement of assets, exercises and Arial drills going on, in and out side country.

In short words, they could and should do better.
 

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