Pak may never try another Kargil, but it could get worse

[kṣamā]

@mafiya: Sir even you are not setting six sigma standards for him to learn from. Both the parties are wrong at some or other point (ie, their tone in making a point). You being an intelligent member can take a high road and instead of such a post counter with some rock hard facts with their source. Internet is filled with fools pls donn let yourself be counted in them. Pls rise above from the average.

 

[Bratva]

double post

 

[INDIC]

They went to America begging to stop war which shows their backs were kicked so Hard and fast but internet hindus ignoring this..... Alas!

Shortage of coffins, where you got this bullshit.

Internet hindus have long tongues and no brain inside them. What Their General said they are constantly ignoring this. They had shortage of Coffins they are ignoring this,,,

Proves my point.

 

[RazPaK]

Indian logic:


Pakistanis were entrenched in higher dug out posts and had the advantage of height.


But IA still killed more of them, then the casualties they received.



Really?


The first two Indian raiding parties were completely annihilated with hundreds of men left KIA, or wounded.

Most neutral sources were laughing at the figures the Indian media was putting out.

Indians were claiming men to be killed that were still alive.



The evil Indian propaganda machine took life from the Kargil affair, and restlessly churns out Anti-Pakistani articles on a daily basis since then.

Many responsible members of media were even banned from covering the front.

 

[Bratva]

@mafiya: Sir even you are not setting six sigma standards for him to learn from. Both the parties are wrong at some or other point (ie, their tone in making a point). You being an intelligent member can take a high road and instead of such a post counter with some rock hard facts with their source. Internet is filled with fools pls donn let yourself be counted in them. Pls rise above from the average.

When outsider badmouthing your country and your army, your blood boils sire. Anyways, i will try to remain calm.

Internet hindus are being owned big time. There Army was faked the deaths of Pakistani soldiers shows their professionalism.

 

[GoodBoy]

TIGER HILL point 5353 is in pakistan controll higest peak in the region
who have clear view on national highway 1.D

what Tiger hill is point 5353.

As per the Pakistani history books Tiger Hill is Point 5353 and they won Kargil War as well, not to mention they WON 1947,1965 and 1971 as well

bunny:

 

[Bratva]

Shortage of coffins, where you got this bullshit.


Proves my point.

Proves my point how uneducated you are. Google.com is made for such kind of guys. Go and search this thing, you will find more info.

 

[Windjammer]

The Bharti bubble bursts at what their own media or International observers disclose, but hey, Pakistan media suddenly proves more credible to them, but not when the same media talks about 1965.

Indian newspapers and their public believe--or say they believe--that the conflict in Dras-Kargil last year was a military victory for India. In fact, it was a war 'won' by briefings and a slavishly supportive media. The Indian public wanted to be assured of 'victory,' and every effort was made to provide that assurance. Kargil was disastrous for Pakistan in worldwide political terms, and was an important public relations coup for the Indian government, both internally (in the run-up to the election), and internationally. But militarily it was a shambles for India whose brave but ill-prepared soldiers suffered gravely and would have sustained even heavier casualties had the conflict continued. The prime minister of Pakistan was ordered by the president of the United States to withdraw his troops from a successful military operation and this was done in time to save the Vajpayee government from the wave of criticism that would have swamped it had the confrontation not been stopped.

Tehelka - The People's Paper

 

[Bratva]

As per the Pakistani history books Tiger Hill is Point 5353 and they won Kargil War as well, not to mention they WON 1947,1965 and 1971 as well

bunny:

4000 Pakistani Deaths could only be achieved through FAKE ENCOUNTERS..... Shows how much your army was desperate....

 

[Joe Shearer]

Internet hindus have long tongues and no brain inside them. What Their General said they are constantly ignoring this. They had shortage of Coffins they are ignoring this,,, They went to America begging to stop war which shows their backs were kicked so Hard and fast but internet hindus ignoring this..... Alas!

stand infront of mirror you will see the bad mouth and than come back read the previous pages of this thread and your own posts too

I am getting sick and tired of ignorant idiots citing the first memorable phrase that comes to their minds, without knowing anything about the situation that is being discussed, the reasons for people like General Pal saying what they are saying, the personalities involved and their roles in the Kargil Incident, and the reasons for that flurry of newspaper reports and interviews.

Could you please come back after you have checked the facts? Or do you prefer to rely on laddish language and the vocabulary and intelligence of football fans?

So too for the coffins affair. Try and get what transpired, and why it made news, and do not depend on your half-baked ill-digested impressions.

The episode of NS going to the US at Musharraf's urgent pleading and his single-handed bail-out of the hapless Pakistani forces takes the cake. Have you even bothered to go through the accounts of senior Pakistani military men themselves? Or is the truth too unpalatable for your sensitive souls?

 

[Bratva]

The Bharti bubble bursts at what their own media or International observers disclose, but hey, Pakistan media suddenly proves more credible to them, but not when the same media talks about 1965.


Tehelka - The People's Paper

Indian Army Admits Faking Encounters In Siachen Glacier

The purpose behind all this was to paint the Army officers with false glory that would fetch them coveted gallantry awards.

I am getting sick and tired of ignorant idiots citing the first memorable phrase that comes to their minds, without knowing anything about the situation that is being discussed, the reasons for people like General Pal saying what they are saying, the personalities involved and their roles in the Kargil Incident, and the reasons for that flurry of newspaper reports and interviews.

Could you please come back after you have checked the facts? Or do you prefer to rely on laddish language and the vocBuoRy and intelligence of football fans?

So too for the coffins affair. Try and get what transpired, and why it made news, and do not depend on your half-baked ill-digested impressions.

The episode of NS going to the US at Musharraf's urgent pleading and his single-handed bail-out of the hapless Pakistani forces takes the cake. Have you even bothered to go through the accounts of senior Pakistani military men themselves? Or is the truth too unpalatable for your sensitive souls?

Indian Army Admits Faking Encounters In Siachen Glacier

The purpose behind all this was to paint the Army officers with false glory that would fetch them coveted gallantry awards.

 

[Dark Warrior]

Continuing turmoil in Gilgit-Baltistan

Gurmeet Kanwal

The people are demanding genuine democratic rule and the right to govern themselves.

Reports of a major Chinese presence in the Gilgit-Baltistan area have been pouring in. While Selig Harrison of the New York Times put the figure at 11,000, the Indian Army chief said recently that about 4,000 Chinese workers, many of them PLA soldiers, are engaged in construction and mining activities in the Northern Areas. This unprecedented Chinese presence is being deeply resented by the local people.

The Gilgit Agency and Baltistan in Pakistan Occupied Kashmir (***), that now comprise the Northern Areas, were part of Jammu and Kashmir (J&K) at the time of partition. The woes of the people of the Northern Areas began on November 4, 1947, soon after J&K acceded to India in terms of the Independence of India Act. A young British major who was commanding the Gilgit Scouts overstepped his authority and illegally declared the accession of the Northern Areas to Pakistan. It shall remain one of the quirks of history that a Major of the British Raj could violate good order and military discipline and seal the fate of the people of an area almost as large as England.

Civil administration
Since then, the people of the Northern Areas have been denied all fundamental and political rights by Pakistan just like the Kashmiris in the rest of ***. They had for long been governed with an iron hand by a federal minister for Kashmir affairs and Northern Areas nominated from Islamabad and supported by the Pakistan army. Now, while the governor is still appointed by the president of Pakistan, there is a Legislative Assembly with 24 members.

The Assembly elects a chief minister. The judiciary still exists only in name and civil administration is virtually non-existent. The result has been that almost no development has taken place and the people live poverty stricken lives without even a semblance of health care and with only primitive educational facilities based primarily on madrasas run by Islamist fundamentalists.

These simple and hardy people have never reconciled themselves to their second-class status and have for long resented the tyrannical attitude of the Pakistan government. Consequently, there have been frequent riots and uprisings. The most violent political outbursts took place in 1971, 1988 and 1997.

In fact, it was General Pervez Musharraf, then a brigadier commanding the Special Service Group (SSG) commandos, who had been handpicked to put down a Shia uprising in Gilgit in 1988. He let loose Wahabi Pakhtoon tribesmen from the North-West Frontier Province (NWFP) on the hapless protestors. These tribesmen invaded Gilgit and went on a deliberately unchecked rampage. They lynched and burnt people to death, indulged in loot, rape and arson, ransacked houses and destroyed standing crops and left the area smoldering for years.

The Pakistan army used the people of the Northern Areas as cannon fodder during the 1999 conflict with India. It refused to acknowledge the contribution of the Northern Light Infantry (NLI) battalions to Operation Badr. Of the 772 Pakistani soldiers, including 69 officers and 76 SSG personnel, who laid down their lives for a militarily futile venture, almost 80 per cent belonged to NLI battalions. Of these, over 200 were buried with military honours by the Indian army in graves at heights ranging from 15,000 to 17,000 ft because the Pakistan army had refused to take their bodies back. The people of the Northern Areas were extremely agitated by these developments.

The simmering discontent of the last 60 years and deep resentment against being treated as second-class citizens has led to a widespread demand for the state of Balawaristan. The people are demanding genuine democratic rule and the right to govern themselves. A large number of influential leaders of the Northern Areas have buried their political differences and joined hands to form the Balawaristan National Front (BNF), with its head office at Majini Mohalla, Gilgit.

Though some sops are now being offered to them, the people of the Northern Areas are completely disenchanted. Their alienation from the Pakistan mainstream is too deep to be ever reconciled and Balawaristan is quite obviously an idea they will pursue vigorously.

Continuing turmoil in Gilgit-Baltistan
When 772 Pakistani soldiers died the number bust be around 3,000 for the Mujahideen as the ratio of Soldier:Mujahid of Pakistan in Kargil was 1:4

 

[Dark Warrior]

Continuing turmoil in Gilgit-Baltistan

Gurmeet Kanwal

The people are demanding genuine democratic rule and the right to govern themselves.

Reports of a major Chinese presence in the Gilgit-Baltistan area have been pouring in. While Selig Harrison of the New York Times put the figure at 11,000, the Indian Army chief said recently that about 4,000 Chinese workers, many of them PLA soldiers, are engaged in construction and mining activities in the Northern Areas. This unprecedented Chinese presence is being deeply resented by the local people.

The Gilgit Agency and Baltistan in Pakistan Occupied Kashmir (***), that now comprise the Northern Areas, were part of Jammu and Kashmir (J&K) at the time of partition. The woes of the people of the Northern Areas began on November 4, 1947, soon after J&K acceded to India in terms of the Independence of India Act. A young British major who was commanding the Gilgit Scouts overstepped his authority and illegally declared the accession of the Northern Areas to Pakistan. It shall remain one of the quirks of history that a Major of the British Raj could violate good order and military discipline and seal the fate of the people of an area almost as large as England.

Civil administration
Since then, the people of the Northern Areas have been denied all fundamental and political rights by Pakistan just like the Kashmiris in the rest of ***. They had for long been governed with an iron hand by a federal minister for Kashmir affairs and Northern Areas nominated from Islamabad and supported by the Pakistan army. Now, while the governor is still appointed by the president of Pakistan, there is a Legislative Assembly with 24 members.

The Assembly elects a chief minister. The judiciary still exists only in name and civil administration is virtually non-existent. The result has been that almost no development has taken place and the people live poverty stricken lives without even a semblance of health care and with only primitive educational facilities based primarily on madrasas run by Islamist fundamentalists.

These simple and hardy people have never reconciled themselves to their second-class status and have for long resented the tyrannical attitude of the Pakistan government. Consequently, there have been frequent riots and uprisings. The most violent political outbursts took place in 1971, 1988 and 1997.

In fact, it was General Pervez Musharraf, then a brigadier commanding the Special Service Group (SSG) commandos, who had been handpicked to put down a Shia uprising in Gilgit in 1988. He let loose Wahabi Pakhtoon tribesmen from the North-West Frontier Province (NWFP) on the hapless protestors. These tribesmen invaded Gilgit and went on a deliberately unchecked rampage. They lynched and burnt people to death, indulged in loot, rape and arson, ransacked houses and destroyed standing crops and left the area smoldering for years.

The Pakistan army used the people of the Northern Areas as cannon fodder during the 1999 conflict with India. It refused to acknowledge the contribution of the Northern Light Infantry (NLI) battalions to Operation Badr. Of the 772 Pakistani soldiers, including 69 officers and 76 SSG personnel, who laid down their lives for a militarily futile venture, almost 80 per cent belonged to NLI battalions. Of these, over 200 were buried with military honours by the Indian army in graves at heights ranging from 15,000 to 17,000 ft because the Pakistan army had refused to take their bodies back. The people of the Northern Areas were extremely agitated by these developments.

The simmering discontent of the last 60 years and deep resentment against being treated as second-class citizens has led to a widespread demand for the state of Balawaristan. The people are demanding genuine democratic rule and the right to govern themselves. A large number of influential leaders of the Northern Areas have buried their political differences and joined hands to form the Balawaristan National Front (BNF), with its head office at Majini Mohalla, Gilgit.

Though some sops are now being offered to them, the people of the Northern Areas are completely disenchanted. Their alienation from the Pakistan mainstream is too deep to be ever reconciled and Balawaristan is quite obviously an idea they will pursue vigorously.

Continuing turmoil in Gilgit-Baltistan
When 772 Pakistani soldiers died the number must be around 3,000 for the Mujahideen as the ratio of Soldier:Mujahid of Pakistan in Kargil was 1:4.

So a total of approximately 4,000 Pakistanis died in Kargil.

 

[Windjammer]

what Tiger hill is point 5353.

Near Tiger Hill, Point 5353 still Pak-occupied - Indian Express

 

[RazPaK]

I am getting sick and tired of ignorant idiots citing the first memorable phrase that comes to their minds, without knowing anything about the situation that is being discussed, the reasons for people like General Pal saying what they are saying, the personalities involved and their roles in the Kargil Incident, and the reasons for that flurry of newspaper reports and interviews.

Could you please come back after you have checked the facts? Or do you prefer to rely on laddish language and the vocBuoRy and intelligence of football fans?

So too for the coffins affair. Try and get what transpired, and why it made news, and do not depend on your half-baked ill-digested impressions.

The episode of NS going to the US at Musharraf's urgent pleading and his single-handed bail-out of the hapless Pakistani forces takes the cake. Have you even bothered to go through the accounts of senior Pakistani military men themselves? Or is the truth too unpalatable for your sensitive souls?

So Musharraf begged NS to go to the United States to save his army, and in return carries out a coup d'etat against him?

That doesn't even make sense.

NS was looked at as traitor to the generals and within the army ranks. Not every general can curry the favor of his ranks to overthrow the government.