Pak, Israel on way to establish diplomatic ties

[Imran Khan]

thank god some one atleast understand whats right for us.

 

[missiledefence]

also, today we agree for relations with israel and place our thumbs up for USA, and the next generation will not even know if there was ever any thing wrong with it. the present idealogy that is coming up is that AQ khan was a terrorist. american and israelis are not THAT bad.

i think it sucks big time.

 

[HitNRun]

also, today we agree for relations with israel and place our thumbs up for USA, and the next generation will not even know if there was ever any thing wrong with it. the present idealogy that is coming up is that AQ khan was a terrorist. american and israelis are not THAT bad.

i think it sucks big time.

I think wwe Pakistanies should stay away from Israel .......
its a war b/w right and wrong so having ties with wrong will make us wrong too and thats what we are getting after 9/11 .....

wrong is always wrong one day it will be no more so we as Paksitanies should not be a part of wrong....

someone said once if you can not fix anything then leave it in same state may be future generations can fix it. i hope you people got my point.....

 

[SEAL]

Israeli deputy prime minister interviewed by Pakistani news paper its old but it clears some points.

The Post: What is Israel’s stance on the Kashmir issue in terms of UN resolutions and other international commitments?

Shalom: Israel has supported the Simla Agreement between Pakistan and India since 1972 and the resolution of all issues between them by peaceful means. We welcome the rapprochement between Pakistan and India over the past several years and hope that they will reach an agreement in the near future.


The Post: How do the people of Israel perceive Pakistan? Do they recognize it as a threat or a state supporting terrorism?

Shalom: The people of Israel do not view Pakistan as a terrorist state, but unfortunately, public perception about Pakistan is vague, as our peoples do not share consistent contact. I am confident that the similarities between our nations could serve to pave the way for mutual respect and understanding and eventually cooperation and collaboration in myriad fields. Pakistan and Israel have much in common. For example, both nations lived under British occupation and were established by the vision of national religious identity.



The Post: Can you tell us exactly when the direct or indirect contacts between Pakistan and Israel started and at what level?

Shalom: I can confirm and acknowledge that the direct contacts between Pakistan and Israel started a long time ago. For long we have been trying to make some progress for a public meeting of our officials but it took us a very long time. However, I am happy that it has come at this good time.For Israel, Pakistan is a very important country. It is the second largest country in the Muslim world. I hope that in the near future relations between Pakistan and Israel will grow. In terms of past contacts, I can confirm that the contacts were direct and also indirect, but most of the time it was direct but in a low profile. In my position, I can confirm that the contact existed some 10-15 years ago. During my tenure as the foreign minister, which has been a little more than a year, there were many direct contacts between Israel and Pakistan but these were in low profile too.

The Post: How do you foresee the future of Pakistan-Israel relations?

Shalom: Pakistan for long has not been a friendly country to Israel, but now that is changing. We have many things in common. Both of us are religious states. We are a Jewish state and Pakistan is a Muslim state. With good relations towards each other we can be a model for other states of the world as to how religious states can be friends and this will be good for the peace of the world. This will help the people of the world to understand that there is no conflict between Muslims and Jews. In this way we can contribute positively to world peace.

The Post: What message would you like to give to the people of Pakistan?

Shalom: I want to tell the people of Pakistan that Pakistan and Israel have no conflict. We have neither territorial disputes nor any economic dispute. Israel wants good relations with the Muslim world. Israel has always been comfortable with the Muslims. Even I was born in an Islamic country, Tunisia. My family and I were very comfortable with the Muslim families we lived with. Pakistan and Israel can work together for the benefit of their people and better lives for the people of both countries. In regard to Palestine, Pakistani people must keep in mind that countries like Egypt, Jordan, and Turkey are more helpful for Palestinians as they have good relations with Israel. Pakistan can play a positive role in the settlement of Palestine issue if it has good relations with both Israel and Palestine.

Full Interview
FM Shalom interviewed by Pakistan Post 7-Sep-2005

 

[Peregrine]

Developing diplomatic relations with Israel is more beneficial to Pakistan than it is to Israel. Once we take an initiative to develop relations with Israel, i think, that Israel will also respond positively to hedge pakistani insecurities regarding their military collaboration with India. Its high time that Pakistani's decided to step up their diplomatic efforts especially in those circles which are of great significance to our enemy. If you ask me, if Pakistan & Israel develop cordial relations, that is going to be a great source of annoyance for some.

 

[arslan_treen]

also, the ban on pak-israel relation has got to thelogically nothign about palestine. its about identifiying our commitment against zionism. yes, the zionism does exist and they are more religious then many of us. religious about their greater land.

thanks for the shocking info ..our illiterate uninformed eyes opened now thanks to you .

 

[roach]

Good to hear that diplomatic relations are being established between Israel and Pakistan- I wonder how the Mullahs will take this news. Should be interesting....

 

[foxhound]

Pakistan should not entertain any form of overt contacts with the Israeli/Zionist state. They do need to keep covert contacts just to warn them of any negative ideas they have with Pakistan. alot of comments here seem to be apologists for Israel and they somehow believe that being with Israel would make Pakistan's life alot better.

Israel is occupying stolen land from the Palestinians - it is simple as that. a number of reasons:
1) stolen land (they have basically kicked palestinians out of their houses and thrown them into the gardens. They are now trying to get them out of the gardens and make them someone elses problems. Please note under the Muslims rule in this area the Jews were living a peaceful and secure life.
2) Israel has violated many many many UN resolutions (and at one stage wanted a GREATER ISRAEL). It is an arrogant nation (as it has been to the many messengers that God Allmighty sent to them - they treated most of them in contempt and jest, some they have even killed).
3) Pakistan should never entertain helping oppressors against the palestinians - even if all the Arab leaders do (most of Egyptian leadership is composed of Coptic christians - hence no real concern for fellow muslims)
4) Isreali desire to attack Kahuta and other related incidents.
5) The speech made by an Israeli prime minister who stated that an obstacle to the state of Israel in the future is Pakistan - hence indicated a need to sort this country out.
6) Why or why do you people fail to understand that the Christians/Jewish people and to that extent the pagans will NEVER EVER TRULY BE YOUR FRIENDS UNLESS YOU DO THEIR BIDDING. They want to extinguish the truth (Islam) not matter what. These people you can never trust - History has shown this on many occassions. You want to make peace with these BACKSTABING SNAKES??? Trust me you do not want to be bitten from the same whole twice - foolish indeed?
7) the Israelis will never want PEACE, everytime their is an opportunity for peace - they come out with a million or so excuses. They have no desire for Peace and HENCE they Will be obliterated in the future. Don't quote me (see the Hadith or ye people of faith?).

The Muslim world has been plagued by bad corrupt rulers (Zardari as one example), they only care about themselves and they are in cohoots with the zionists and their allies. What the muslim world needs for them is to follow their Islamic Deen as taught by the Prophet Muhammad (saw). If they did this, they will no more be in the pity state they are in, they will be rich in spiritual and physical needs. an Islamic banking system will help them get out of the poverty trap which the current world order has endorsed on this world (Usuary/Interest).

" A muslim is a brother of another Muslim, if he feels a pain the other one feels the same" We should feel the pain for our brothers all over the world - especially those who have been living under oppression for many years.

I'm not giving a religious speech but as muslims and Pakistan being a muslim country - we should not entertain the thoughts of conniving with these zionists and their allies.

It is not being with the Israelis or the Americans or any other that will give us security and wealth - It is by living as Muslims should do, following the Quran and sunnah. Then will the muslim world benefit themselves and the whole world.

" If the Allmighty Allah (swt) is with you - you do not need anyone else. He is with those who follow the teaching and guidance that he has imparted to mankind through the Prophet Muhammad (saw). Follow the Quran and Sunnah and you will not go astray, you will not be under any others feet. The Islamic history has shown this - its a tried and tested method.

 

[EjazR]

Not sure if this is true as no other source is reporting it. ButunderMusharraf there was much talked about improvement of ties. Here is a 2005 BBCarticle

BBC NEWS | South Asia | Pakistan and Israel - new friends?

In January this year, one of Pakistan's leading newspapers, The News, interviewed Israel's deputy Prime Minister Shimon Peres.

In that interview, Mr Peres called upon the two countries to have "direct, personal contact, publicly, without being ashamed about it".

The very next day, an angry mob stormed the newspaper office in Karachi - smashing several window panes and other fixtures.

The mob, it is said, was not just reacting to the contents of the interview but to the very fact that a Pakistani publication had dared provide a voice to the Israeli government.

Eight months later, the two countries have formally kicked off a policy of diplomatic "engagement" in the first ever publicly acknowledged meeting between senior government figures from both sides.

The sensitivity that surrounds any move towards establishing diplomatic ties with Israel is evident from the choice of the word "engagement" rather than "relations".

President Musharraf was himself quick to tell reporters shortly after the Istanbul meeting that it did not mean a step towards the formal recognition of Israel.

Public relations

But some analysts in Pakistan seem convinced that the road from Istanbul can only lead to formal recognition backed by full diplomatic relations.

"This is the first step towards eventual recognition of Israel," says senior defence analyst Dr Hasan Askari Rizvi.

Dr Rizvi points to two immediate benefits that Pakistan may be seeking from its change of policy.

"The first has to do with image," he says.

"What better way can there be for Pakistan to prove its moderate credentials by moving towards establishing some kind of ties with Israel?" he asks.

The second and far more important reason, he says, relates to the country's defence policy and weapons requirements.

Pakistan has historically relied on US weaponry for its security needs, ignoring calls from independent experts, to diversify its weapons base.

Dr Rizvi says at the moment any Pakistani requests for fresh weapons systems from the US are fiercely resisted by Indian and Israeli lobbyists.

By moving towards a formal recognition of Israel, Pakistan can thus gain entry into an elite club - currently comprising US, India and Israel - with common security perceptions vis-a-vis the Middle East and South Asia.

'Illusion of change'

Hussain Haqqani, Pakistan scholar at the Washington-based Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, inserts an important proviso into this argument.

"What remains to be seen is whether the move is aimed only at garnering further US support or is it actually based on a desire for genuine change," says Mr Haqqani.

He says President Musharraf is known for "creating an illusion of change" without actually working towards it.

Hijacked plane crashing into North Tower of World Trade Center
Some in Pakistan say September 11 attacks were a Jewish conspiracy
Mr Haqqani feels that anti-Semitism is so deeply rooted in Pakistani society that it would take more than a meeting between the foreign ministers of the two countries to neutralise it.

In an interview with the LA Times published on 18 August, Pakistan's education minister called Jews "the worst terrorists in the world" while summing up the history of the Israel-Palestine conflict.

Pakistani passport holders still cannot travel to Israel.

And there is no shortage in Pakistan of those who believe that the 11 September attacks on the US were a Jewish conspiracy, as were the London bombings, to discredit Muslims.

Pakistan's top religious leader Qazi Hussain Ahmed has already described the Istanbul initiative as a move "against everything that Pakistan has so far stood for".

Unofficial contacts

It is perhaps this deep rooted suspicion between orthodox Jews and Muslims - a suspicion fuelled by events dating back to the times of the Muslim prophet Mohammed - that has led the Musharraf government to go one step at a time.

Defence analyst AR Siddiqui - who once headed the Pakistani army's public relations department - says that within the military top brass, a recognition of the need to improve ties with Israel has been gaining momentum over the last few years.

Indirect relations between Pakistan's military establishment and Israel dating back to the 1980s are already a documented fact.

But over the last couple of years, President Musharraf has repeatedly attempted to bring these contacts into the public sphere.

In 2003, he stressed the need for better relations with Israel during his visit to Camp David. But his comments were quickly brushed under the carpet when they drew an adverse reaction at home.

Earlier this year, Pakistan's prime minister reportedly met Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon in Davos.

The meeting was confirmed by Israeli officials and described by the Jerusalem Post as an event that went beyond "just a passing conversation in a hotel corridor".

But the Pakistan foreign office vehemently denied that any such meeting had taken place.

That scenario seems to have changed somewhat with the Istanbul meeting.

Some Pakistani observers argue that President Musharraf has been resolutely trying to move Pakistan's foreign policy away from its current ideological basis to one rooted in economic self interest.

They describe the Istanbul meeting as one more step in this direction.

What remains to be seen now is how successfully Pakistan's foreign office and its affiliated think tanks can sell it to the public.

 

[Ras]

About time...Pakistan should look after her own interests.

 

[Materialistic]

In all fairness, the founding father of Israel David Ben Guiron called Jinnah personally to initiate relations in 1948. Jinnah reacted positively but died soon after and thus nothing happened. Sir Zafarullah Khan refused to acknowledge Israel because he wanted a Palestinian state too. It was only during Zia's time when relations were somewhat initiated. This was partly due to the work they were undertaking against the soviets.

Nawaz Sharif was once very close to initiating ties but his government was replaced. Bhutto too had meeting with many Israelis but nothing came of it. Please review this study from the Institute for Global Jewish Affairs to learn more.

So by the time we are moving towards something concrete, our Throne is turned.. Mostly upside down!!

It shows we are never going to have any relations with Israel!!!

@ Topic

Im personally not in support of any healthy relations with Israel, we should just be in touch, rather than being hostile towards each other. It will give us a bigger role to play in Middle East.

This way we can exert good pressure on Israel in regard with Palestinian issue. Also, this will lessen the zionist lobby's activities against Pakistan.

We can look for things of our own interests like trade ties as well as Defense!!

Since we are no brothers of Israel, so we should keep low profile relations just to the extent of serving our national interests. And no compromise on Palestine.

 

[barcelona]

Its sensible & logical decision which will definately serve pakistan well .......................common point between the two nations for the starters is pakistan & israel are the only two nation found on the basis of religion let people find more common ground between pakistan & israel so that both can have constructive relation in future...................................

 

[somebozo]

About time we take this step. Arab neighbours next to Israel has no problem then why should we bother? We cannot assist in a conflict without recocnizing both parties. We all live in a same globe, Israel has not come from space and is not going anywhere soon. Secondly, Israel like Pakistan is an idealogical state and strong time between both are unaviodable. Our ignorance of Israel has given India a strong leverage. Time and time I have said that defence collaboration with Israel will provide us high tech defence goods at 1/3 the prices without involement of uncle sam. We need to get away with this ummah type politics and excessive siding with Palestinanean cause. The arabs lot the way by choice and its upto to take the cosequeces. Israel is not all that mighty as it is hyped to be. Egyptians won a war over Israel and the world powers recocnized their victory.

The conflict of Palestine is between Arabs and Jews. Not between Jews and Muslims. The Arabs and Jews have history of hostility towards each other due to shared heritage. We dont need to become part in that.

The whole of NATO, Israel, Pakistan, Turkey are countries which will play vital role in middle east. The Arabs and Indian will come and go. The Iranian slot is still open if they are willin to scale down their rehotric. Their conflict is with America and they are fighting with Israel. Not sparing that their leaders try to behave more arab than arabs about the palestinenan cause.

Turkey has not been sidlines by Muslim world by recocnizing Israel. And being sidelines by arabs means we wont be getting their charity. About time to hold some self respect for ourselves.

 

[GUNNER]

Not true folks. Just had an official rebuttal of the story.
I wonder why people even read The Nation these days !

 

[Meengla]

I doubt this news is correct. Pakistan is not going to recognize Israel until KSA does so.
By the way, there is a former Pakistani diplomat/journalist (some Ishtiaq xx?) who went through a meticulous analysis of gain/loss if Pakistan were to recognize Israel. His conclusion was pretty clear: Pakistan will be a loser if it recognizes Israel before KSA and some other Arab countries do. So, for purely 'secular' reasons, if not for 'justice' and 'humanity, Pakistan should not recognize Israel so long as Israel continues to occupy Palestinian land.
About Israel-India relations, well, India supplies hard cash for hardware. Cash is low in Pakistan. May be, just may be, Israelis would look with less suspicions on Pakistan if Pakistan recognizes Israel but Israel will not forego the billions of $ of trade with India.

But, again, this article is most probably not correct. At a time when Israel is facing growing--yes, even in Britain--international condemnation and isolation. At a time when even Turkey has moved away from Israel, I see no logic for Pakistan to come closer to Israel.

But may be PPP haters are desperate to find one more stick to beat Zardari with?!