Pak ACM states India has 3500 BVR missles

[anathema]

Fair enough. But what you are forgetting is that you are comparing PAF's future 500 BVRs to IAFs 3500 current BVRs. This number is bound to increase as more and more MKIs are inducted and once the MRCA deal is done with. India is even license producing the Russian BVRs and developing indigenous ASTRA BVRs. So it is never going to be 500vs3500 at any given point of time.

SS,

there is no point in comparing who's longer...mine or your's?? ...PAF has issued a contract for 500 BVR's and i believe this number was calculated keeping in mind all the threat that India offers and also based on its offensive/defensive doctorine...So if they feel 500 BVR's can do the job currently, then there is no point they will go for more numbers....so it might be 500 vs 5000 in future...who knows.....

 

[mean_bird]

So if they feel 500 BVR's can do the job currently, then there is no point they will go for more numbers....so it might be 500 vs 5000 in future...who knows.....

500 are AIM -120-C5 which will be used on F-16s only. If you compute out the ratio i.e 500 AMRAAM for 60 F-16 fighters, well you can figure out an estimate on how many AMRAAMs will be sought for 250 JF-17s.

 

[anathema]

The Telegraph - Calcutta (Kolkata) | Nation | Sukhoi set for Assam landing

Sukhoi set for Assam landing
SUJAN DUTTA

New Delhi, June 1: Four Sukhoi 30 Mki will land in Tezpur on June 15 to turn the tea-town base in Assam the third in the country to host a squadron of the frontline combat aircraft.

The basing of a squadron of the Sukhoi in Tezpur means that the Indian Air Force is moving some of its most powerful assets closer to the border with China in India’s Northeast.

The basing of Sukhoi aircraft in Tezpur — a second Sukhoi squadron is to be based in Chhabua, also in Assam — is in keeping with a policy in which India’s military has been beefing up assets near its borders with China. It began in Ladakh, where the western air command, revived two airfields, Daulat Beg Oldi and Chushul, and has continued in the Northeast.

“Our assessment is not threat-centric but capability-based,” said Air Chief Marshal Fali Homi Major, who retired yesterday, in his last meeting with the media. (Air Chief Marshal P.V. Naik has taken over).

Referring to China, he said: “There is no escalation in threat perception. We know very little about the capabilities of that country.”

An IAF source said modernisation projects had been taken up in five airfields in the eastern and north-eastern regions: Tezpur, Chhabua and Jorhat in Assam, Purnea in Bihar and Panagarh in Bengal.

Runways were being extended from 9,000 to 11,000ft. The Sukhoi base in Tezpur will be raised over two months. The chief of the eastern air command, Air Marshal S.K. Bhan, will preside over a simple ceremony to welcome the four Sukhois that will fly out from their original home in Lohegaon, Pune.

Pune currently has three squadrons of the Sukhoi, one of which is moving to Tezpur. Two squadrons are based in Bareilly in Uttar Pradesh.

A squadron in the IAF usually has between 18 to 20 aircraft.

An air force source said there were currently five squadrons of Sukhoi 30 Mki aircraft, one of which was yet to be fully raised. In five years, the air force is expected to have more than 200 Sukhoi Mki in its fleet.

Two more IAF bases in Halwara, near Ludhiana, in Punjab and Jodhpur in Rajasthan are to be converted for the Sukhoi in two years.

Tezpur was the home of the MiG operational flying training unit that shut down. The units were moved to Bagdogra in north Bengal and Chhabua. With the MiG 21s — currently the mainstay of the IAF’s fighting fleet — due to be phased out in another two to three years, the training units will be shut down.
Top

Well it shows there are atleast 4 full squadrons and fifth one being raised , so it is safe to assume that there are atleast 80 su 30 mki planes if not more.....

 

[FulcrumD]

Not to mention the new ones already rolled out and waiting in the hangar to be inducted.We can safely assume that there are 100 of them at the moment,give or take a few.

 

[blain2]

Fair enough. But what you are forgetting is that you are comparing PAF's future 500 BVRs to IAFs 3500 current BVRs. This number is bound to increase as more and more MKIs are inducted and once the MRCA deal is done with. India is even license producing the Russian BVRs and developing indigenous ASTRA BVRs. So it is never going to be 500vs3500 at any given point of time.

What difference does the numbers game make? Even if 40% of the 500 find their mark, IAF's combat edge would be severely depleted. Think of it in these terms. Think about attrition and not absolute numbers here, think about quality and not quantity here. Sure the more you have, the greater the luxury to let lose more against a target, however even then 500 BVRAAMs and those too in the class of AIM-120C5 are a pretty potent inventory.

PAF would go to war with whatever they have, we took to the air in Dec. of 08 (with or without BVR) and would do the same even if currently you have 3500 or less or more vs. us not having any. Since there is no chance of a war right now and given that Pakistan will be receiving the C5s next year while SD-10s may already be on hand, I think we are wasting time over when and how many.

I have many other issues with the Russian hardware in IAF inventory as well as the 3500 number but that is better left to a another discussion.

 

[Screaming Skull]

What difference does the numbers game make? Even if 40% of the 500 find their mark, IAF's combat edge would be severely depleted. Think of it in these terms. Think about attrition and not absolute numbers here, think about quality and not quantity here. Sure the more you have, the greater the luxury to let lose more against a target, however even then 500 BVRAAMs and those too in the class of AIM-120C5 are a pretty potent inventory.

PAF would go to war with whatever they have, we took to the air in Dec. of 08 (with or without BVR) and would do the same even if currently you have 3500 or less or more vs. us not having any. Since there is no chance of a war right now and given that Pakistan will be receiving the C5s next year while SD-10s may already be on hand, I think we are wasting time over when and how many.

I have many other issues with the Russian hardware in IAF inventory as well as the 3500 number but that is better left to a another discussion.

My bad. I shouldn't have made that post in the first place. It has a potential to derail an already derailed thread.

 

[Gucci Juice]

IAF to post Sukhoi war planes near China border

New Delhi: After stationing the Sukhoi Su-30MIK war jets in Tezpur in Assam, the Indian Air Force will post another squadron of its frontline jets at the Chabua air base under its military policy to boost security along the border with China in the northeast.

On June 15, four Su-30MKIs will land in Tezpur for a symbolic induction, making the airbase the third in the country to house the combat jets.

"It will be a symbolic induction as of now. Currently it's not clear which of the Sukhoi bases - Pune or Bareilly - the aircraft belong to," a senior IAF official said.

"The four aircraft will formalise the Sukhoi flying routes. After that plans are afoot to station the Sukhois at Chabua air station in the northeast (Assam) and at Halwara (Punjab) and Jodhpur (Rajasthan) in the west," the official added, speaking on condition of anonymity.

The basing of the squadron in Assam is in line with the IAF's policy of capacity-building near the India-China border.

Former IAF chief Air Chief Marshal Fali Homi Major, before handing over his charge last weekend, had said: "There is no escalation in threat perception (vis-a-vis China). We know very little about the capabilities of that country."

Currently India is operating five squadrons of the Russian-built fighter aircraft. out of them three are stationed at Lohegaon in Pune (Maharashtra) and two in Bareilly (Uttar Pradesh). Each squadron operates 18-20 aircraft.

In the next five years, the IAF plans increase the strength of Sukhois in its fleet to nearly 200.

After taking over as defence minister, A.K. Antony had underscored infrastructure development in the northeast as the priority of the defence ministry. Under the same programme, the upgradation of various airfields is in the offing.

"Five bases, including Tezpur, Chabua, Jorhat (Assam), Panagarh (West Bengal) and Purnea (Bihar), will be upgraded. The upgradation will comprise of expanding the length of the runway from 9,000 feet to 11,000 feet," the official added.



and this is from ibn a news channel

 

[Screaming Skull]

"The four aircraft will formalise the Sukhoi flying routes. After that plans are afoot to station the Sukhois at Chabua air station in the northeast (Assam) and at Halwara (Punjab) and Jodhpur (Rajasthan) in the west," the official added, speaking on condition of anonymity.

Very interesting! Jodhpur and Halwara? So close to Indo-Pak border!!! Both Tezpur and Chabua too are very close to China border!!!

 

[Gucci Juice]

What difference does the numbers game make? Even if 40% of the 500 find their mark, IAF's combat edge would be severely depleted. Think of it in these terms. Think about attrition and not absolute numbers here, think about quality and not quantity here. Sure the more you have, the greater the luxury to let lose more against a target, however even then 500 BVRAAMs and those too in the class of AIM-120C5 are a pretty potent inventory.

PAF would go to war with whatever they have, we took to the air in Dec. of 08 (with or without BVR) and would do the same even if currently you have 3500 or less or more vs. us not having any. Since there is no chance of a war right now and given that Pakistan will be receiving the C5s next year while SD-10s may already be on hand, I think we are wasting time over when and how many.

I have many other issues with the Russian hardware in IAF inventory as well as the 3500 number but that is better left to a another discussion.

ya if 5% of those 3500 find their mark same will happen to u.

and C5 is good but it is still a missile with a limited amount of propellant and its against the law of conservation of energy for a missile with the same amount of propellant to go farther than another missile.

and yes their hardware isn't as reliable as the aim-120 that's why there's large quantities of it and that's why its being made under license.

 

[Munir]

No matter how many BVR's one has, I do not expect them used all by once or at one place. India is big and China promised to defend Pakistan.

 

[anathema]

No matter how many BVR's one has, I do not expect them used all by once or at one place. India is big and China promised to defend Pakistan.

I believe you are actually saying china will help you with equipment and not overtly. ...If so you are correct by all means.

Chinese as for now will not incline towards any side in combat (overtly) since they have too much at stake.

 

[Munir]

I believe you are actually saying china will help you with equipment and not overtly. ...If so you are correct by all means.

Chinese as for now will not incline towards any side in combat (overtly) since they have too much at stake.

I like to agree with you but it is surely not that. There are numour occasions where clearly was said and written that China would defend integrity of Pakistan... You can make what you want but to me it is pretty simple. They will send weapons if needed but I think that Pakistan no longer needs fast delivery cause it has a better umbrella (nuclear). So it delivers inhouse development with JF17 and good future with J10B. It delivered F22p, AWACS etc etc... I think most of us know that without China there would be no Pakistan.

 

[blain2]

ya if 5% of those 3500 find their mark same will happen to u.

Yes so what is the point in debating the 500 vs. 3500 then?

 

[blain2]

I like to agree with you but it is surely not that. There are numour occasions where clearly was said and written that China would defend integrity of Pakistan... You can make what you want but to me it is pretty simple. They will send weapons if needed but I think that Pakistan no longer needs fast delivery cause it has a better umbrella (nuclear). So it delivers inhouse development with JF17 and good future with J10B. It delivered F22p, AWACS etc etc... I think most of us know that without China there would be no Pakistan.

Munir my friend,

In my humble opinion, its not good to think China will do anything such as militarily entering a melee between Pak and India. Chinese have told Pakistani leadership in the past and will do so again, fight it out on your own. This is something that we as Pakistanis must be very clear about. There is no support, there is no backing and there is no assistance in case of war besides some limited material type. As a famous (in my book) Pakistani said to his officers "Gentlemen, we go to war with what we have in the show window, there are no replacements!", such should be the outlook on all things concerning Pakistan and war.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

IAF operates 3 squadrons of MKI