Pak ACM states India has 3500 BVR missles

[maverick2009]

Vayu Sena is a 3rd IAF website this also confirms

5 sqds we also have the MKI sqd names Below

Unit Location No. 24 Sqn AF
Hawks @ Bareilly AFS

No. 20 Sqn AF
Lightnings ? AFS
@ Jodhpur

Rhinos
AFS
Jamnagar

No. 8 Sqn AF
Pursoots
Lohegaon AFS

No. 31 Sqn AF
Lions
AFS UNKNOWN

 

[Keysersoze]

Yes indeed but numbers are as stated 55 till you can provide proof of others. your fanboy dom is getting abit embarassing now. I know it is hard for you but we have shown proof and you have shown us your hopes and aspirations now do yourself a favour and stop posting as you are looking like a idiot now.

 

[Keysersoze]

^

ya u are right 140 will be finished by 2013.

and 50 have already arrived.

but 40 more were ordered in 2007 THEY WILL COME FROM RUSSIA by 2010.

the rest of the 140 will be made at hal.

and 2 new squadrons are to be raised soon at Tezpur.

Actually the aircraft (from the 2007 order) are mean to replace older aircraft in inventory. 24 squadron in fact. So it is not a increase in numbers merely replacements.

 

[sancho]

HAL has targetted FY 2014-15 for delivering the last Su-30MKI. Rate of production is reported to be 13 aircraft per annum [2], which would mean that atleast 20-25 aircraft have already been produced by HAL by the current financial year. However only SB101/2/3 have been sighted so far.


Unless someone has some more serial numbers to add then the number stands at 55

I'm sorry Keysersoze, but isn't there a mistake in your calculation?

As you mentionend 0 to 50 were made by Russia and the early 18 Su 30 Mk were replaced with the same number of Mki by Irkut in 2007:

Though the contract for 18 of these aircraft has only been signed now, Irkut has apparently already constructed of 12 of these aircraft, working on bank advances it took out on its own. The remaining 6 planes are likely to be delivered by the end of the year.

domain-b.com : 18 new Su-30MKI fighters for India as part of a swap deal

And the site you refer to says, that 20 to 25 Mkis must be produced by HAL, so the current number of Mki must be at least 70 to 75 right?

 

[maverick2009]

take your pik boys...

PDF MODS SAY 55-60

Maverick says 5 sqds and 100 approx

vayu sena says 75

Bharat Raksha 80 with 5 sqds march 2009

Wipikedia says 115

Godknows the thread was actually about bvr missles as per PAF ACM

 

[mean_bird]

take your pik boys...

PDF MODS SAY 55-60

Maverick says 5 sqds and 100 approx

vayu sena says 75

Bharat Raksha 80 with 5 sqds march 2009

Wipikedia says 115

Godknows the thread was actually about bvr missles as per PAF ACM

Let me make it easier to pick

- PDF mods show reliable sources that say 55-60
- Indian media reports says 55-60

- Indian fanboys and Indian forums say 100+ and they are quoting wikipedia.

 

[Keysersoze]

I'm sorry Keysersoze, but isn't there a mistake in your calculation?

As you mentionend 0 to 50 were made by Russia and the early 18 Su 30 Mk were replaced with the same number of Mki by Irkut in 2007:



domain-b.com : 18 new Su-30MKI fighters for India as part of a swap deal

And the site you refer to says, that 20 to 25 Mkis must be produced by HAL, so the current number of Mki must be at least 70 to 75 right?

What you say is entirely possible. However HAL has rep of not keeping to schedules. They only produced 6 aircraft in 2006/7 and that won't be close to the schedule of 14 per year to meet the deadline of 2013

Chief manager (indigenisation) of HAL, D.N. Aher, said by 2006-07, HAL plans to roll out six Su-30 MkI aircraft, with raw materials manufactured locally. The figure will subsequently rise to 10 aircraft a year. "Even radars, stabilisers and wings of the aircraft will be outsourced for manufacturing by local vendors," he added.


India plans to build some 140 Su-30 MkI fighters over the next 17 years at HAL.

While HAL is already in the process of upgrading the MiG series (21 and 27), with indigenised components and spares at its facility, Aher said this is the first time the vendors will be provided with design, drawings, technology, processes and material for the Su-30 MkIs.

HAL senior manager (outsourcing), A.B. Gharad, corroborated the development, saying that for the first time, manufacturing of components will be entirely offloaded to vendors. While HAL officials didn't specify the reason for this large-scale outsourcing to Indian vendors, sources in the Indian Air Force said these measures have been taken well in advance in view of the large-scale problems with the MiG series.

"Getting spares from the breakaway countries of erstwhile USSR has become a complicated issue," a senior official said.

The HAL officials, however, said the outsourcing will primarily be restricted to tooling and non-standard equipment. Avionics is a specialised area, and is currently undergoing system integration at the Bangalorebased Defence Avionics Research Establishment, a DRDO outfit.

As you can see there are a number of problems with parts (earlier this year senior members knew of MKI being grounded due to lack of parts before it was made public) things like this would disrupt schedules of manufacture.

 

[SSGPA1]

Godknows the thread was actually about bvr missles as per PAF ACM

I think Pakistani media misquoted PAF Chief.

India did buy BVR Derby but that is only for 20 missiles. India tested Astra last yr in July and there is no way that they have 3500 indigenous BVRs.

 

[Gucci Juice]

ok this will clear EVERYTHING UP once in for all...

from the Irkut corporation (maker of the mki)

IRKUT Corporation :: Press Release Archives :: IRKUT CORPORATION AWARDED FOR SU-30MKI PROGRAM

IRKUT CORPORATION AWARDED FOR SU-30MKI PROGRAM

At the AERO INDIA 2009 international air show and exhibition «FORCE» magazine presented the award to «Irkut» Corporation, prime contractor and coordinator of the Su-30 program, acknowledged as the best program of India’s military-technical cooperation with foreign countries in combat aviation.

JSC «Sukhoi Company» CEO Mikhail Pogosyan received the award on behalf of «Sukhoi Design Bureau» for the Su-30MKI design and development.

«FORCE» also recognized the personal contribution of Alexey Fedorov, President of JSC«United Aircraft Corporation» to Indo-Russian military-technical cooperation within the scope of the Su-30MKI project.

At the ceremony the awards were presented by Prawin Sawhney, editor-in-chief of the «FORCE» magazine that specializes in covering national security and defense issues.

According to a massive study conducted by experts from this respected Indian publication the Su-30MKI program is the most successful in the history of India’s military-technical cooperation with foreign countries, with the aircraft considered one of the top multi-role fighters in the world. The research authors highlight that the Su-30MKI became the first serially produced combat aircraft in the world to feature super-maneuverability conferred by the ultimate aerodynamic layout and TVC engines. A particular appreciation was expressed towards the onboard avionics suite with ESA radar to be the first fitted onto the exported fighter aircraft.

The specialists emphasize the fact that the Su-30MKI is the first combat machine developed outside India in accordance with the strict IAF requirements and produced in cooperation with Indian industry.

«Irkut» Corporation delivered to India over 100 aircraft and technological kits for their license production by Hindustan Aeronautics ltd. Since 2007 the Su-30MKI phases I and II are being upgraded to final technical configuration. Moreover in 2007 the contracts were signed to supply the IAF with 18 Su-30MKI aircraft in lieu of earlier inducted Su-30K and to deliver additional batch of 40 Su-30MKI.


read the bold...

Keysersoze the 18 a/c were for the replacement and the 40 are totally brand new and will not replace anything. also 100 aircraft/kits have already been delivered.

so 100 already supplied... 130 to go

by 2012 the 58 replacement/new a/c will be delivered raising the number to 158 but in the same period at least 36 more should be delivered considering that 12 are produced per annum meaning 194 by 2012 and easily 230 by 2014.

and this is not made up its straight from the maker of the mki

go to the irkut website and click on press releases and you will see

 

[Keysersoze]

Jeez why do I feel like sisyphus here.........yes gucci I am sure there are 100 MKI's (In kit form)there however if they are not assembled what are you going to do, throw the parts at the enemy? So go back and try again. Now if you really wanna convince me go get the serials for the aircraft then convince every media source in India to stop saying that there are only three squadrons of approx 60 aircraft in service.

 

[Keysersoze]

Actually if all these aircraft are being rebuilt it begs the question how many are actually operational. After all the first batches need to be replaced/upgraded. The Phase 1 and 2 aircraft need to be upgraded so it's no surprise that additional orders are being made to Irkut they are probably behind schedule.

 

[Gucci Juice]

ok...

lets say that the original 50 were delivered by 2004

then production starts at the rate of 5 per year after 2 years its scaled up to 12 ok?

55 04
60 05
72 06
66 07 (18 gone but 12 made)
78 08
90 09

meaning there's AT LEAST 80.

 

[Keysersoze]

ok...

lets say that the original 50 were delivered by 2004

then production starts at the rate of 5 per year after 2 years its scaled up to 12 ok?

55 04
60 05
72 06
66 07 (18 gone but 12 made)
78 08
90 09

meaning there's AT LEAST 80.

Well good luck finding those serials because no one has seen them yet it seems. Also it is interesting that the new squadron being formed near china only received 8 aircraft why do you think that is? Why the additional order of 40 aircraft if the production was going so swimmingly?

As I have stated HAL was probably producing a lot less than stated or parts were not available for whatever reason.


Now instead of wasting our time with suppositions go and find the serials for the aircraft in question. Then let all the Indian media know too (you'll be doing them a favour)

 

[maverick2009]

The additional order of 40 SU30MKI was made to speed up the mki sqd nos very quickly as IAF is LOSING sqds at an alarming rate due to mig21/23 HAVING TO BE phsed out on safety issues.

IAF has only 32 Sqds at present this could fall to 29 by 2011.

HAL can at best produce 13-14 MKI a year.. Yet IAF needed new planes far quicker.

Those 40 mki will be delivered by 2010 it is stated.

 

[maverick2009]

If anyones interested a Hyper link by DIDS a neutral western source saying MKI delivery changed to be completed by 2014 latest and maybe even 2012.

Its not an indian. Source

Costs & Time Kill Full SU-30MKI Production in India (updated)

India needs to finish the MKI programme by 2014 to start license production of MRCA winner IN 2014.

Thats why we are seeing more and more news on here and in india media about new SU30 bases opening up in Northern india like Tezpur etc in the next few weeks..