Featured No Buyers For Rafale Jets: Why Almost Every Country Dumped French Rafales Except India?

[LeGenD]

Rafale is certainly not the very best of Western hardware in existence but this article does not offer much of an analysis either.

 

[Lincoln]

What kind of analysis is this ?

There are several factors playing in the choice of a fighter jet.... Each air force has specific needs and different requirements,some need heavy fighters,others light or medium ones,some need air superiority fighters,others multirole ones etc. There are also several factors playing such as economy and of course politics.

Economically the Rafale didn't benefit from economy of scale as during several years only the French air force acquired it and in quite "small quantities". (180 ordered yet) Many countries rejected it because they considered it to be quite an expensive fighter,to buy and to maintain taking into account their disposable budget. The Rafale outperformed the Gripen and Eurofighter in Switzerland,yet the Swiss went with the Gripen.

Politics can also play a big part in the choice of a fighter and not purely based on the fighter,its price and performances. Morocco chose the Rafale before going with F16s due to US pressures for exemple. One among many others.

There's also another reason which isn't mentioned is we were very bad at marketing,French politicians also torpedoed every breakthrough in negociations Dassault made,something that was fatal in many countries.

While people boast about the Chinese jets on this forum,how many,outside China bought the J10 for exemple ? Does that mean it's a bad jet ?

Despite what people say,the Rafale is the best choice India could have made. Not only for its performances but also politically,France will always back India no matter what..... Very small chances of French sanctions on India,or halting supplies to support the Rafale fleet,no matter what...
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Let's explain the third million time to people who think "muh India bought a $300 million jet".

According to the French government,the flyaway cost of a Rafale as of economic conditions of 2014 was as follow ;

€78M for a Rafale M (Naval version)
€73M for a Rafale B (Two seater)
€68M for a Rafale C (Single seat)

The €8 billion package India paid includes offsets (half of that cost,invested back in India),training,new infrastructures to induct a new type of aircrafts into the Indian air force,maintenance packages..... undisclosed number of air to ground bombs and air to air missiles,key Indian demands regarding the integration of specific weapons and systems etc.

The package you mentioned comes with every fleet when it is a new jet for the air force.

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

Indians Love Rafales

 

[Figaro]

Indians Love Rafales

The way the Indians are worshipping the Rafael makes the plane more fit to belong in a shrine or a museum than an airbase.

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

The way the Indians are worshipping the Rafael makes the plane more fit to belong in a shrine or a museum than an airbase.

It will reach that status very soon.

 

[nahtanbob]

China never offered the J-10 for export. It's a key difference.

As per several PDFers J-10 was supposedly an option for the PAF

 

[ziaulislam]

No other nation will let you configure the jet to carry nuclear weapons. And the initial buyer of Eurofighter is shelving their jets because of high maintenance, that speaks a lot about about it's availability during times of crisis.

Incredible jets but 2-3 the price of western options and 10x the price of chinese jets (simply because they mass produce them)

 

[Figaro]

Even in engine thrust, the Chinese J-16s aka Russian Su-35s are far superior to the French combat aircraft

The J-16 is not a copy of the Su-35 ... it was already there way before the Su-35 contract was ever signed, not to mention delivery.

 

[waz]

Despite what people say,the Rafale is the best choice India could have made. Not only for its performances but also politically,France will always back India no matter what..... Very small chances of French sanctions on India,or halting supplies to support the Rafale fleet,no matter what...

I agree with much of what you said, but what happens in the event of war between Pakistan and India. International sanctions would be applied to both to stop the conflict, it's happened in the past.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

The selection of Rafale was more strategic and political than the military. What India has achieved from the deal? Technically block all the defense deals btw Pakistan & France including avionics for integration, absolutely safe and secure from sanctions, in future France will always sides with India against Pakistan, soon get more leverage and incentives in the different sectors of business (in both import/export), safe from the U.S blackmailing tho they’re already getting a massive amount of 2nd line defense equipment from the U.S, India now has access to best French defense equipment including nuclear tech.... said this before, Indian defense establishment is not an idiot... that's fine you can humiliate your enemy but at this Rafale deal, India has achieved many objectives. For India’s perspective despite Ladakh Chinese issue, India sees Pakistan as its core enemy so technically Pakistan now limit to China for its defense needs. India applied the same Russian formula here if you see from Pakistan’s POV. Getting 4 mi Hind helis won’t do much, Russian core priority is Indian when it comes to $$$/defense equation. So, the same for French now.

A good analysis. Only that Turkey is also there for Pak....

 

[Pandora]

The way the Indians are worshipping the Rafael makes the plane more fit to belong in a shrine or a museum than an airbase.

If you were to buy a jet for almost 230 Million dollars a pop then even you will worship it . Compare that price tag with SU 30 MKI which they built at of fraction of a cost almost 50-60 Million dollars a pop. China bought SU35 with 85 million dollars per jet. Rafale will be their poster boy for at least next two decades with no inductions of a 5th gen fighter jet in sight. In reality SU30 is much more capable than Rafale in every sense ranging from sensors, payload size, range and diverse weapons package. Indians are just trying to sell Horse Manure as Gold to their Public.

 

[Malik Usman]

Indian (Modi) govt. Got kick-backs from the deal of these fighters and now they are showing to their public they have won the war against China and Pakistan like they do in bollywood. Real world is not bollywood.....

 

[denel]

Indian (Modi) govt. Got kick-backs from the deal of these fighters and now they are showing to their public they have won the war against China and Pakistan like they do in bollywood. Real world is not bollywood.....

you stole my words... french kickback must have been huge...

 

[batmannow]

The selection of Rafale was more strategic and political than the military. What India has achieved from the deal? Technically block all the defense deals btw Pakistan & France including avionics for integration, absolutely safe and secure from sanctions, in future France will always sides with India against Pakistan, soon get more leverage and incentives in the different sectors of business (in both import/export), safe from the U.S blackmailing tho they’re already getting a massive amount of 2nd line defense equipment from the U.S, India now has access to best French defense equipment including nuclear tech.... said this before, Indian defense establishment is not an idiot... that's fine you can humiliate your enemy but at this Rafale deal, India has achieved many objectives. For India’s perspective despite Ladakh Chinese issue, India sees Pakistan as its core enemy so technically Pakistan now limit to China for its defense needs. India applied the same Russian formula here if you see from Pakistan’s POV. Getting 4 mi Hind helis won’t do much, Russian core priority is Indian when it comes to $$$/defense equation. So, the same for French now.

I'm. Astonished on Indian establishments RSS orinted thinking that pakistan is the major threat?
While China is breaking all the doors of thier home from Nepal to mezuram then to seven sister states sikham all are in deep waters and will remain in those deep waters for a long time to come.
while indian govt is just intersted of its political advantage by using pakistan as its punching bag for wining elections?
It's not matters what India has buyed, and will use against what threat, but this is a changing world, EU isn't willing much to be under American control anymore and when it comes to $$$ China stands before india with its huge full of money in the hands of middle class?
So what u think If France just has to decide on the basis of money then China won't be its better partner?
I gss, ur mind is bieng turned around by the 24 hours live coverege RAFAEL comming to India???
While mistakenly thinking india is the only financial power in this world????
For Russia, thanks india dumped it for its MMRCA deal, right now it's really angry on India as mentioned report for RAFAELs bieng comming from Russian experts!!!!
It opens a huge door for Russia to show up with its huge tech in the hands of Pakistan and let it beat India in the air?
As stratgicly, INDIA has gone into US laps Russia don't consider India as its trusted friend as it was back in cold War time?
Instaed both Russia and China see India as part of threat which been developed by USA in South China sea, so above all india stands with USA anchoring all its stakes on it, times are changing fast when india won't find any good friends among Asia anymore, cause no one is ready in reality to face China and Russia in any war right now?
It's a good time for pakistan to go ahead for SU35, MIG35 or SU57 jets from Russia and get new engines for its JFT 17 BLK 4 and some more gadgets from Russia this time and cement its relationship with Russia as both are comming near stratigcly at a lighting speed!

 

[crankthatskunk]

The selection of Rafale was more strategic and political than the military. What India has achieved from the deal? Technically block all the defense deals btw Pakistan & France including avionics for integration, absolutely safe and secure from sanctions, in future France will always sides with India against Pakistan, soon get more leverage and incentives in the different sectors of business (in both import/export), safe from the U.S blackmailing tho they’re already getting a massive amount of 2nd line defense equipment from the U.S, India now has access to best French defense equipment including nuclear tech.... said this before, Indian defense establishment is not an idiot... that's fine you can humiliate your enemy but at this Rafale deal, India has achieved many objectives. For India’s perspective despite Ladakh Chinese issue, India sees Pakistan as its core enemy so technically Pakistan now limit to China for its defense needs. India applied the same Russian formula here if you see from Pakistan’s POV. Getting 4 mi Hind helis won’t do much, Russian core priority is Indian when it comes to $$$/defense equation. So, the same for French now.

Well, you have to understand my friend, the equation had always been like this, if India bought Rafales or not.
India didn't buy from the UK. But you think UK is going to back Pakistan ever! Off course not.

For two reasons. India is a brain child of the UK. It has given it on the platter to the Nazi minded Hindus. Anyone is under any illusion, the BJP et al had been around , they existed before independence. Congress is no better, neither were Nahro or Gandhi.

Pakistan is a Muslim country. That characteristic itself is a disqualifications for most sophisticated weapons and technology.

As for Russia, when India would stand on the other side of a great war, everything would change in a jiffy.