Most common second languages by each London borough

[waz]

Firstly, the map only relates to second languages so the size of these communities are likely to be modest relative to the overall population. Brent and Newham are the only London boroughs with majority non white populations as far as I am aware.

As for Nepalese in Greenwich, Woolwich barracks has a huge Gorkha contingent and a big Nepalese community has become established in that area in recent years after ex soldiers were granted settlement rights( I know 'cause I used to work in Shooters Hill at the time).

The map also shows big Tamil populations in Croydon, Carshalton etc which is not surprising but I am baffled, just as you are, by the Polish invasion of London that the map suggests..

Hi Temujin, yes it does relate to second languages. Tower Hamlets is also majority non-White, as is Barking and Dagenham, Harrow and Redbridge.

You're right about the Nepalese, but I'm sure the Somalis outnumber by a large margin. There are 70,000 in London, roughly split between the North West (Ealing, Wembley) and South London (Woolwich, Greenwich, Plumstead). Anyway the Nepali community are lovely, friendly and their kids work so hard in school. Having taught many, their parents always struck me as some of the most politest people I have ever met.

Croydon does have a sizeable Tamil community, as does Tooting.

Yes, the Polish mapped area is strange. They got the West London part right, where there is a huge Polish community, but the South?

i saw more afro-carribean than nepali there.. so its a surprise.

Nepali folk, adults home-work-home. Their kids home-school-home.

 

[Götterdämmerung]

If i had to stay, i'd rather stay in French majority areas.

It's not a French majority area, the majority who speak French as second language in West End London are the upper class Brits. That's very common in Europe.

 

[Azizam]

Being a life long Londoner (born and raised), i'd broadly agree with the map. Not quire sure about the accuracy of Polish being the second most widely spoken tongue from Brixton to Croydon. I would have thought it would be a dialect from Nigeria. The Nepalese part is plain bizarre. That's near Plumsted and Greenwich and that has a huge Somali community! I'm actually shocked Somali is not on here, considering they have a very large population from West to South London. Also Tamils in around Epsom?

Lol@at the far right of the map with the Punjabi section. That would be the Punjabi Sikh belt that stretches from Dartford to Gravesend.

South Asians are by far the most dominant minority.



Arabs and Turks are small in number. Those numbers are virtually all in London, henceforth they look large.

Somalis speak Arabic here, don't they? And when it comes to second generation they totally adopt into using English.

 

[Jungibaaz]

Seems right, no surprises apart from Spanish and Portuguese.

 

[notgoodenough]

Americans are multi religious. If you didnt know. And no I dont see much difference between turks and arabs. But if you prefer the term middle easterners. That works for me.

lolz its like saying french and americans same coz both are christian...

 

[livingdead]

Americans are multi religious. If you didnt know. And no I dont see much difference between turks and arabs. But if you prefer the term middle easterners. That works for me.

eh not my problem.. both look white and both christians mostly.. any extra info is injurious to my brain..

 

[waz]

Somalis speak Arabic here, don't they? And when it comes to second generation they totally adopt into using English.

No, a few of the elders do. The vast majority speak Somali, and the youth also speak it as well. Yes they will converse with others in English but it is still the common second language.

Seems right, no surprises apart from Spanish and Portuguese.

Portugese because of the large influx of Brazilian migrants on EU Portuguese passports. Spanish due to the large numbers of Latin American migrants, mainly from Columbia, Peru and Ecuador.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

I think one of these days Bhabi is going to have you tied between two Double Decker buses & having their drivers push their accelerators while going in the opposite direction !

Butt yaar .. Your jokes are so predictable,colorless,not even funny n lack the depth,witt,color n aesthetics which the punjabis are famous for ... Doub k mar jaa...

If i had to stay, i'd rather stay in French majority areas.

Coz you dig frog legs? N cheese?

 

[Jungibaaz]

Portugese because of the large influx of Brazilian migrants on EU Portuguese passports. Spanish due to the large numbers of Latin American migrants, mainly from Columbia, Peru and Ecuador.

I suppose you're right, I just haven't come across very many.

If i had to stay, i'd rather stay in French majority areas.

Those and that Arabic part are the fanciest places, that is the real London you see in the films and on tv.

Makes us living in West London look like pind dwellers and living cosy lives in our shacks.

It's not a French majority area, the majority who speak French as second language in West End London are the upper class Brits. That's very common in Europe.

The second language and French thing is actually quite false, everyone (almost everyone) learns French in High School anyway. But it's just casual convo stuff, and names/places, things like that. Hardly anyone is even semi-fluent.

 

[waz]

The second language and French thing is actually quite false, everyone (almost everyone) learns French in High School anyway. But it's just casual convo stuff, and names/places, things like that. Hardly anyone is even semi-fluent.

Yes, you're right. The reason why French is so big is because London has 400,000 French people! That's more French folks than some cities in towns in France lol.

BBC News - London, France's sixth biggest city

The " elite posh" areas in West London are full of French families. Where I live has even seen a huge influx of Middle Class French folk, fleeing the harsh taxes in France. They have literally bought homes for cash here. Many of my neighbours are French.[/quote][/quote]

 

[vostok]

Poles and Lithuanians finally achieved their happiness. Instead of "Soviet occupation" they have tolerant right for being slaves!

 

[temujin]

You're right about the Nepalese, but I'm sure the Somalis outnumber by a large margin. There are 70,000 in London, roughly split between the North West (Ealing, Wembley) and South London (Woolwich, Greenwich, Plumstead). Anyway the Nepali community are lovely, friendly and their kids work so hard in school. Having taught many, their parents always struck me as some of the most politest people I have ever met.
Croydon does have a sizeable Tamil community, as does Tooting.
Yes, the Polish mapped area is strange

Hi Temujin, yes it does relate to second languages. Tower Hamlets is also majority non-White, as is Barking and Dagenham, Harrow and Redbridge.

You're right about the Nepalese, but I'm sure the Somalis outnumber by a large margin. There are 70,000 in London, roughly split between the North West (Ealing, Wembley) and South London (Woolwich, Greenwich, Plumstead). Anyway the Nepali community are lovely, friendly and their kids work so hard in school. Having taught many, their parents always struck me as some of the most politest people I have ever met.

Croydon does have a sizeable Tamil community, as does Tooting.

Yes, the Polish mapped area is strange. They got the West London part right, where there is a huge Polish community, but the South?



Nepali folk, adults home-work-home. Their kids home-school-home.

Hi Waz, thanks for that. Based on a quick google of 2011 census figures though, 'whites' (including 'White others') still constitute small majorities both in Dagenham and TH, although Harrow and Redbridge appear to have 'vibrant' majorities-which is surprising since I would have expected recent gentrification to have turned the tide in favour of the 'indigenous' population in those areas, certainly in Harrow..

As far as Somalis are concerned do you think the 'visibility' of the community, as a result of their attire and tendency to loiter the streets due to rampant unemployment, may be resulting in their numbers being overestimated relative to other ethnic groups? 70k does sound like a big number but that's in a city of over 8 million. Also, some of that 70k live in places like Plaistow where they are easily outnumbered by other ethnic groups

WRT Poles in parts of SE London, I have noticed that most low skilled jobs in London Kent, for instance Bromley, have gone to Eastern European migrants in the last few years, which might partly explain these figures..

 

[rmi5]

I did not know that there are so many turks in London.

 

[waz]

Hi Waz, thanks for that. Based on a quick google of 2011 census figures though, 'whites' (including 'White others') still constitute small majorities both in Dagenham and TH, although Harrow and Redbridge appear to have 'vibrant' majorities-which is surprising since I would have expected recent gentrification to have turned the tide in favour of the 'indigenous' population in those areas, certainly in Harrow..

As far as Somalis are concerned do you think the 'visibility' of the community, as a result of their attire and tendency to loiter the streets due to rampant unemployment, may be resulting in their numbers being overestimated relative to other ethnic groups? 70k does sound like a big number but that's in a city of over 8 million. Also, some of that 70k live in places like Plaistow where they are easily outnumbered by other ethnic groups

WRT Poles in parts of SE London, I have noticed that most low skilled jobs in London Kent, for instance Bromley, have gone to Eastern European migrants in the last few years, which might partly explain these figures..

Hi Temujin, you're right that there is a slight majority, as per the census information from 2011, the minority population is 42%, compared to White British at 49.46 and of course adding White Irish, who are a part of the furniture, its 50.39%.

http://www.lbbd.gov.uk/CouncilandDe...D 2011 Census Key Statistics FINAL_update.pdf


Of course you are right when you say that the "White other" makes the White ethnicity a majority, but that is comprised of Eastern Europeans, who are not British, like you said. The thing to take into account is that this information is three years old and Barking and Dagenham was one of the top ten areas for "White flight" ,the PDF reads a fall of 30.64%, so the majority would have been narrowed considerably, and dare I say even completely diminished.

Let's talk about the exodus of 600,000 whites from London - Telegraph

Harrow and Redbridge (think Ilford) have changed a great deal my friend. I visited Harrow town centre the other day and found it very hard to spot an "indigenous" White Brit. They both lost their majorities a while back and they to are areas suffering from "White flight".

The Somali numbers are spot on, even probably understated . Having worked closely with Somali families, I was at times taken back by the sheer size of family units. Polygamy is common amongst the community as well. Like you said they are more "visible" on the street, due to lack of employment etc, but I don't think that has influenced the number account. You do get Somalis in Bethnal Green, Bow, Palistow etc, but the vast bulk of the population resides in the areas I mentioned previously.

You're right about the low end jobs, and the fact that many Poles work the areas you talked of in your post. But I'm sure the map is talking about residency, which then makes no sense.

By the way Temujin, what is your background, if you don't mind me asking.

I did not know that there are so many turks in London.

Cypriot Turks, and in good numbers, based in North London e.g. Stoke Newignton, Palmers Green, haringey in general.

 

[Trev]

Seems right, no surprises apart from Spanish and Portuguese.

Most of the Portoguese speakers come from former colonies like Brazil, Angola and Mozambique. They are mainly of African origin so most people just assume they Jamaican or Nigerian lol

Somalis speak Arabic here, don't they? And when it comes to second generation they totally adopt into using English.

Somalis come in two groups, the Arab wannabes and the Afro-Carribean wannabes. The first group is extremely religious and speak in Arabic most of the time and reject their own language. The second group try to act like gangsters and copy Jamaican slang.
When I moved to Canada which also has a large Somali community I noticed the same thing.