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To be honest, Turks generally likes Pakistanis. But lately we are seeing much admiration from Pakistanis against Turks in social media. I'm very strongly against that, Pakistan is a strong independent country, first Muslim population to develop a nuke, have population over 200 millions. They should just admire themselves. If this Admiration continues the way it is today...over years it will eventually make Turks look down on Pakistanis, this is inevitable. Turks will stop seeing Pakistanis as equal brothers if this continues.


This. A thousand times this. Thank you for saying this. The Arabs took advantage of this same "admiration" we showed them. I appreciate you that you notice it and atleast warn us against it.

You guys have the concept of Turkish nationalism EMBEDDED in you. My sister lives in Istanbul and my niece and nephew naturally attend a Turkish school. The sense of nationalism you imbibe in your school kids and the reverence for Ataturk and the Turkish nationhood in your school curriculum is what makes you guys confident in yourself. We do not have that as Pakistanis. Our leaders never bothered to develop that. And we fell prey to the concept of Ummah as our national identity. Which is why we keep bending over backwards for other Muslim nations.
 
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Your not convincing me mate

I live in BIRMINGHAM

I can tell a Turkish Iranian & Pakistani from a mile

YOUR COMPLETELY DIFFERENT MATE

Who you kidding

Even you are mir puri .. i know what you are YOUR NOTHING like the AFGHANS or PASTHUNS or most of you

Your marry within your own familys

AS FOR TRADE od GEO POLTICS with Turkey or China does not make you brothers.

ISRAEL has or back so does France so does Russia .......are they our brothers ............err no
we are different people to them , but different people can get closer to each other by finding some common grounds , I mean you just dont start talking to a stranger out of nowhere

china is our neighbour so that is one connection
Turkey and pakistan are known for diversity and land bridges between various regions , so that is one connection

we also share many things with indians.

Also all pakistani groups have vibrant cultures and diversity , they dont need to form a link to others , just to feel better about themselves.
 
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Why can we not be South Asians? Is there anything offensive about being South Asians? Why must we keep Arabs, Iranians and Turks as reference points to compare ourselves with.

I am being honest. This will bite. But to any non Pakistani, we look complete South Asians. Northwestern South Asians. We don't look like Arabs, we don't look like Persians. Our nose bridges, our jawlines, our skin tones all belie the fact that we come from the subcontinent. The only Pakistanis who have the "honor" of looking like Middle Easterners are the Pathans and Gilgitis. Unless we can't accept this basic fact, we can't even proceed to have a sense of basic nationhood. Forever in limbo we will remain.
 
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Why can we not be South Asians? Is there anything offensive about being South Asians? Why must we keep Arabs, Iranians and Turks as reference points to compare ourselves with.

I am being honest. This will bite. But to any non Pakistani, we look complete South Asians. Northwestern South Asians. We don't look like Arabs, we don't look like Persians. Our nose bridges, our jawlines, our skin tones all belie the fact that we come from the subcontinent. The only Pakistanis who have the "honor" of looking like Middle Easterners are the Pathans and Gilgitis. Unless we can't accept this basic fact, we can't even proceed to have a sense of basic nationhood. Forever in limbo we will remain.
All Pakistani groups share a lot with each other than with middle easterners , even lighter pakistanis have very differerent features to middle easterners , people of gilgit look north pakistani they dont look arab/turk/iranians. Also there are many beautiful and unique looking people among all pakistani groups , so I never understood the desire of some pakistanis to associate with middle easterners , its mostly for religious reasons

Pakistan is form of

Gilgit Baltistan
Pakhtunkhwa
Sindh
balochistan
Kashmir

Niether these regions are found in middle east , niether in vast majority of india , we dont need to middle east to draw our distinction from India.
 
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Punjabis make up only 5% of india but 60% of Pakistan. Only a small proportion of that 5% have any sort of genetic or racial connection to Pakistanis. So at least 95% of inidans have NO racial or genetic connections to Pakistan or Pakistanis whatsoever. Also due to Pakistani Punjabis intermarrying with the tribes West of us and indian Punjabis intermarrying with other indian groups, Pakistani and indian Punjabis are now very much a different racial and ethnic group to one another. 40% of Pakistanis are racially and genetically identical to 80% of Afghans and 25% oF Iranians. That does not make Pakistani people Afghan, Iranian, Persian, or Middle Eastern just as it does not make us indian.

The many differences between Pakistanis and indians is already unbridgeable. Especially as Pakistan's future becomes more intertwinned with that of China and Turkey as our contact and relationships with them increases. That difference is only going to increase.

Exactly brother. Pakistanis have been intermarrying with each other and with Afghans since time immemorial.

Just because Pakistan has taken in Indian refugees (Urdu speakers,) it doesn't make us Indian. Many have a hard time with this.

The most numerous ethnic groups of Pakistan are all natives, such as Punjabis, Pukhtoons, Sindhis, Kashmiris, Baloch, etc.
 
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All Pakistani groups share a lot with each other than with middle easterners , even lighter pakistanis have very differerent features to middle easterners , people of gilgit look north pakistani they dont look arab/turk/iranians. Also there are many beautiful and unique looking people among all pakistani groups , so I never understood the desire of some pakistanis to associate with middle easterners , its mostly for religious reasons

Pakistan is form of

Gilgit Baltistan
Pakhtunkhwa
Sindh
balochistan
Kashmir

Niether these regions are found in middle east , niether in vast majority of india , we dont need to middle east to draw our distinction from India.


Yes what you're saying is how it should be. But how many times do you hear people on this forum going to extreme ends to prove they are more Afghan or Iranian or yadda yadda. Do you ever see Turkish people proving that they are not Azeris? Do you see Egyptians proving they are not Algerians?

What I am saying is all this reeks of MASSIVE inferiority complex. Just be fricking Pakistanis. No need to get caught up in all these identities ke mein Uzbekistan se aya hua Chughtai hoon tou mein Persia se aya hua Zaidi hoon. The Turks, Iranians, Indonesians and Arabs all have indigenous names. Our names aren't even indigenous. See how this adds up.
 
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Your not convincing me mate

I live in BIRMINGHAM

I can tell a Turkish Iranian & Pakistani from a mile

YOUR COMPLETELY DIFFERENT MATE

Who you kidding

Even you are mir puri .. i know what you are YOUR NOTHING like the AFGHANS or PASTHUNS or most of you

Your marry within your own familys

AS FOR TRADE od GEO POLTICS with Turkey or China does not make you brothers.

ISRAEL has or back so does France so does Russia .......are they our brothers ............err no



Random pictures and a measured Pakistani community in Birmingham do not in any way reflect the entirety of over 200 million Pakistanis in Pakistan. I have been to Pakistan over 35 times in my life. I was there as recently as December 2019. I know the ground reality. Here are some Pakistanis:

https://images.app.goo.gl/DXCpbDpsc5jfnt589

https://images.app.goo.gl/6zEA7kHQY5QwcQTv7

https://images.app.goo.gl/FGabCF9nYoNXW3TMA

https://images.app.goo.gl/UiWzQiANxuHHwieG7

https://images.app.goo.gl/JWB5xPUiVhTJJNXs5


PS As an indian, do you only feel close to indians or perhaps bangladeshi and Sri Lankan people too?
 
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Random pictures and a measured Pakistani community in Birmingham do not in any way reflect the entirety of over 200 million Pakistanis in Pakistan. I have been to Pakistan over 35 times in my life. I was there as recently as December 2019. I know the ground reality. Here are some Pakistanis:

https://images.app.goo.gl/DXCpbDpsc5jfnt589

https://images.app.goo.gl/6zEA7kHQY5QwcQTv7

https://images.app.goo.gl/FGabCF9nYoNXW3TMA

https://images.app.goo.gl/UiWzQiANxuHHwieG7

https://images.app.goo.gl/JWB5xPUiVhTJJNXs5



Can I really be honest with you? These are cherry picked photos. 90-95% of Pakistanis have dark brown eyes and black hair. And you know why it is necessary to call this out? Because not only is it dishonest, it is a disservice to the dark Pakistanis, who make up the majority and who look nothing like this. It wipes out their presence in the collective discourse.
 
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Random pictures and a measured Pakistani community in Birmingham do not in any way reflect the entirety of over 200 million Pakistanis in Pakistan. I have been to Pakistan over 35 times in my life. I was there as recently as December 2019. I know the ground reality. Here are some Pakistanis:

https://images.app.goo.gl/DXCpbDpsc5jfnt589

https://images.app.goo.gl/6zEA7kHQY5QwcQTv7

https://images.app.goo.gl/FGabCF9nYoNXW3TMA

https://images.app.goo.gl/UiWzQiANxuHHwieG7

https://images.app.goo.gl/JWB5xPUiVhTJJNXs5

Ofcourse Indians will continue harping on a supposed Indian-ness for Pakistanis, while Pakistanis themselves want nothing to do with Indians.

There is a reason why Pakistani beauty standards are different. We are completely different races.

These are Pakistani Punjabis, whom some Indians and confused Desis claim resemble Indian. Lol.

Altaf-Mahmood-Foundation-Slide3-2340x1320.jpg


5d2553bccf9fa.jpg


ladies-busy-in-shopping-at-anarkali-in-lahore-9905.jpg


APP04-10Rawalpindi.jpg
 
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Can I really be honest with you? These are cherry picked photos. 90-95% of Pakistanis have dark brown eyes and black hair. And you know why it is necessary to call this out? Because not only is it dishonest, it is a disservice to the dark Pakistanis, who make up the majority and who look nothing like this. It wipes out their presence in the collective discourse.
well these are more representative of what average pakistani look , we look pakistani as a group

https://www.google.com/search?q=pak...lXqWFBtGikgXeyKmgBg&bih=657&biw=1366&safe=off

Yes what you're saying is how it should be. But how many times do you hear people on this forum going to extreme ends to prove they are more Afghan or Iranian or yadda yadda. Do you ever see Turkish people proving that they are not Azeris? Do you see Egyptians proving they are not Algerians?

What I am saying is all this reeks of MASSIVE inferiority complex. Just be fricking Pakistanis. No need to get caught up in all these identities ke mein Uzbekistan se aya hua Chughtai hoon tou mein Persia se aya hua Zaidi hoon. The Turks, Iranians, Indonesians and Arabs all have indigenous names. Our names aren't even indigenous. See how this adds up.
well Afghans are our neighbours with whom we share ethnic links , but only pashtuns of afghanistan, rest of people are foreign to us in middle east , but this doesnt mean that we cant get close to them on socioeconomic level.
 
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Peace out

Indeed, its not worth it friend. You can have the most perfect neutral mods/powers/admins in some setup/inception.... but in the end lot of stuff simply has to be left to be fleshed out with the perspective of reality and truth...with whatever equilibrium system sets up then.

We live in a larger imperfect world. We have made, make and will make imperfect choices as result day in and day out...so it would be no different for any of its microcosms anywhere.

Thus far more is gleamed in the end letting things shape up as they do, and simply pointing better eyes to it to make better conclusions about certain things.... than worry too much about the management of process/filter/settling of info/discourse (i.e achieving something better/perfect versus what someone else sees as better/perfect in his opinion) and all that.

In the end you simply have to leave things shake up and settle as they do past some point (and choose and offer battle wisely on that)....rather than extreme worry about where every single particle settles and arranges.

You must put strong trust in those you hold in high regard (as trusting yourself to make that determination to begin with is extremely important to have basic society). In many cases their ships have been out in both stormy and calmer waters far far longer than yours....they can read the weather and signs much better. There are thus things that become more apparent to them if you let them just observe and reflect with results/reality on ground...because they learned it of own accord/volition rather than you directing them there somewhat more forcefully etc. i.e Basic friendship and respect stuff.

They can readily see (and if interested...understand more on, especially with time) those that dream and project whatever gibberish after themselves being inflicted by such by their own doing, continued failing to come to gripes with that...and then all their continued coping mechanisms for the clear underlying reason. Things like historical revisionism, extreme "bro-ing" complex and even doubling or tripling up on all of that or more and all the mental gymnastics from that on display. Then coming to the awkward reality and consequent reaction that (some or even many) purported bro's can think differently on it all esp outside some safe bro-space....because of larger reality.

Dissonance is cruel...delusion is often the panacea. Just leave it be for those that crave it and are hooked on it.

Someone can blab here all about selective extreme-cherrypicked "genetics" with 1000s of posts and chip on shoulder about it...... all the while one of his purported "iron-bros" can tell me they all look the same to him in just cpl seconds elsewhere lol...and show me pictures from his real life to prove it. Its super funny in the end.

It's why they are shown the door quickly at any actual convention or professional science or history gathering about anything regarding this (if they even manage to somehow jump through the earlier hoops needed)...and then they concoct and assert conspiracy theories to explain that all away too. Hot air needs to chase more hot air. You can find plenty of it in a safe space to hearts desire....actual neutral credible setting is far far different. Its part of why such types often find this a nice refuge (and its a larger phenomenon on the internet too for all types I must say)....and hate even slightest opposition to their cacophony. Make and try solidify in here, what you cant do out there. Old silly game, just the settings/names have changed with time.
 
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No, their obsession is only with Pakistan. They want to be us, but they can never be.

Never mind that they (North Indians) look exactly like South Indians, Bengalis, and Sri Lankans.


To me, all indians are the same. I can't tell the difference between them nor do I feel any sort of connection to them.
 
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To me, all indians are the same. I can't tell the difference between them nor do I feel any sort of connection to them.

They look the same to me also.

Indians are a different race, that feeling is natural.

I feel Afghans and Iranians are much closer in looks to Pakistanis than them. Even then Pakistani looks are unique.

We are the most beautiful and lovely people. I greatly admire the features, attitude, spirituality, and customs of our people. For me, there are simply no better people in the world.

It is a blessing of Allah swt. I don't know why some Pakistanis marry foreigners...
 
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They look the same to me also.

Indians are a different race, that feeling is natural.

I feel Afghans and Iranians are much closer in looks to Pakistanis than them. Even then Pakistani looks are unique.

We are the most beautiful and lovely people. I greatly admire the features, attitude, spirituality, and customs of our people. For me, there are simply no better people in the world.

It is a blessing of Allah swt. I don't know why some Pakistanis marry foreigners...

Foreigners often mistake me on the streets as Raza Shah Pehlavi. They stop me and tell me I look sooooooo Persian. I tell them no, so they say surely you must be Nadir Shah Durrani, you just look sooooooo Afghan. Dear Lord why was I blessed with such similar features to Iranians and Afghans? If you see me in fluorescent light I also look Turkish.

:D:D:D:D:D
 
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