Morocco Interested In Russian Su-34 Bombers, Amur-class Submarines

[Zarvan]

A scale model of Amur 1650 diesel-electric submarine
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Morocco is likely to buy Sukhoi Su-34 tactical bomber and Amur-1650 diesel-electric submarine from Russia.

Rabat and Moscow are discussing the feasibility of the Moroccan Navy’s Amur-1650 submarine acquisition in the format of consultations so far. The ship Morocco has taken interest in is an export version of the Russian-built Project 677 Lada-class (Petersburg-class) diesel-electric submarine. She is to feature the air-independent propulsion (AIP) plant designed to make it unnecessary for her to surface in order to recharge her batteries, Tass reported Thursday.

If the Moroccan Navy buys an Amur-1650, the move will boost its capabilities, because the submarine will carry Club cruise missiles - an export variant of the Kalibr.

Morocco, according to the local media, also is keen on Russian warplanes, particularly the export version of the Su-34 bomber that has also grabbed the attention of Oman and Jordan after it had taken part in the operation in Syria. Ostensibly, Rabat needs advanced weaponry to fight terrorists, but experts presume a confrontation with its neighbor Algeria is a more likely reason. Algeria has been buying Russia’s submarines and Sukhoi jets for a long time.

“Morocco and Algeria have been at odds over Western Sahara for decades. The two countries also claim to be regional powerhouses. They are not about to fight each other, but they try to maintain the balance of forces,” Nikolai Sukhov, researcher with the Institute for African Studies, Russian Academy of Sciences, and vice-president, International Middle East Studies Club was quoted as saying by the news agency.

Buying the submarine is a matter of prestige to Rabat, because Algeria has a submarine fleet and Morocco has not yet, and Su-34s may come in handy to Morocco to handle quite specific missions, e.g. to counter the Saharan insurgents.

Algeria is switching over to French, US and Chinese armament in hopes to gain an advantage, while Morocco has turned its attention to products of Russia’s defense industry. The king and his inner circle have no prejudice against Russia, all the more so that the latter offers attractive financial terms.

According to the military industry, the export of AIP submarines is worth a long hard look at, because Amur submarines are, first and foremost, sophisticated in terms of operation, and it is not clear if the buyers are capable of operating them effectively or not. Russia has only two ships like that so far - one in trial operation and the other in construction, i.e. none has entered service with the Russian Navy yet, and offering a technology like that for export would not be quite right.

Naval expert Vladimir Shcherbakov has explained to the Izvestia daily that to form a submarine force is expensive. A submarine’s cost includes those of an on-shore simulator, a support system and personnel training. Usually, her cost also includes that of the first weapons suite - torpedoes and missiles that are worth far more than several dozen million dollars.

In Shcherbakov’s opinion, Morocco would better buy Project 636 (Improved Kilo-class) subs - proven, upgraded, Club-carrying and capable of dealing with any targets.

Their only drawback is the lack of the AIP capability but the latter is important to operations conducted far in the ocean. It will take some time to complete the development of the Project 677 submarine, which first example is still in trial operation.

However, Russian engineers are hopeful that the problem will be resolved within several years. A Project 677 ship will be the first to receive the advanced power plant. The Rubin Central Design Bureau is looking into the integration of the AIP compartment with the submarine, according to the Izvestia daily.

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/16...4_Bombers__Amur_class_Submarines#.V63mRCNRXqA

 

[Super Falcon]

Good choices by Morocco learn PAF Morocco less budget buying SU 34 yet having F 16

 

[Ceylal]

Its an old article, that was republished. For one the Amur submarine was dead in the water several years ago, and for the fullback, Morocco has as much chances in getting them than getting an F22.

 

[Zarvan]

Good choices by Morocco learn PAF Morocco less budget buying SU 34 yet having F 16

Sir its Saudi Arabia who are paying for these weapons not Morocco

 

[Super Falcon]

Sir its Saudi Arabia who are paying for these weapons not Morocco

Sir saudia buying weapons for Egypt Morocco Jordan it's rubbish saudia already buying worth of trillion dollar weapons for itself she can't afford to pay for everyone and top of it saudia has to pour more funds on her nationals after Yemen war zaarvan fact is ksa might have paid few millions not all of it

 

[Zarvan]

Sir saudia buying weapons for Egypt Morocco Jordan it's rubbish saudia already buying worth of trillion dollar weapons for itself she can't afford to pay for everyone and top of it saudia has to pour more funds on her nationals after Yemen war zaarvan fact is ksa might have paid few millions not all of it

Saudia has billions of dollars in its banks and they can afford to pay a lot. KSA is the one who is paying for these weapons for Egypt and Morocco and also for Lebanon but Jordan hasn't accepted the offer. Saudia can afford to pay for lot more countries not just these three.

 

[Penguin]

Any submarine acquisition would minimally have to be 2 boats, preferably 3, in order for the required investment in infrastructure and training specialized manpower to be worthwhile.

 

[Zarvan]

Any submarine acquisition would minimally have to be 2 boats, preferably 3, in order for the required investment in infrastructure and training specialized manpower to be worthwhile.

I think they would start from 2 Submarines but overall they may go for 6 to 8 Submarines.

 

[Penguin]

I think they would start from 2 Submarines but overall they may go for 6 to 8 Submarines.

And why do you think so?

(I wouldn't find those numbers very logical, considering e.g. that the Moroccan navy has just 4 modern major surface combattants and 2 older, less capable ones. You'ld also need 210-280 highly specialized new personnel, expanding from 437 in the modern surface combattants and 294 in the older surface combattants i.e. an increase of core personnel by 33-45%).

Morocco strengthen its military muscles
MEYS Emerging Markets Research
19 May 2015

"There are talks between Morocco and Russia for delivering one or more Russian submarines, but it is highly questionable if Morocco will purchase Russian arms now or in the near future. There are namely two main reasons to take the seriousness of these talks into doubt. The first reason is that Russia is the main supplier of military equipment to neighbouring rival Algeria, and Morocco will not take the risk that any military information shared between Russia and Morocco about the purchase of arms could end up in the hands of Algeria. The second reason for doubting the seriousness of Morocco’s possible purchase of Russian arms is that Morocco has long standing historic ties with the US and they will not jeopardize these ties with the purchase of arms from Russia."

MEYS Emerging Markets Research
Sandelhout 19
2994 HP Barendrecht
The Netherlands
www.meys.eu
info@meys.eu

Source: http://www.meys.eu/file.axd?file=2015/5/article+Morocco+Defence+Industry.pdf (page 3)

"January 2016 reports from Russia are that the AIP has not been developed hence the Lada's and export Amurs will no longer be built "

"it is likely Russia offered Morocco the improved Kilo instead. This is assuming Morocco would not accept a Russian offer of a future 'fifth generation'Kalina class SSK - with the Kalinas only likely to be operational (with AIP) in the RUssian navy in the mid 2020s"

Article source
http://gentleseas.blogspot.nl/2015/08/morocco-may-become-first-buyer-of.html

Background source
http://sputniknews.com/russia/20160...plans-additional-submarines-construction.html

 

[DOUBLESHOT]

No Amur-1650 for Moroccan Navy until they integrate Fuel Cell AIP
Maybe in 2022

The Russian Navy is yet to decide on the class of diesel-electric submarines to be equipped with the air-independent propulsion (AIP) plants first - the Project 677 Lada (NATO reporting name: Petersburg) or the fifth-generation submarine codenamed Kalina, Russian Navy Commander-in-Chief Vladimir Korolyov has told journalists.
"We will make a decision after the power plant has been developed. Developing the AIP plant is a creative process, hence, we will try to wrap it up quickly. Everything is hinged on not only the Navy, but the design bureau as well, and on our cooperation to boot. We shall provide this," he emphasized.

Previously, it was reported that the Russian Navy expected the AIP for its diesel-electric submarines to be ready for use in 2021-2022. In late 2015, Rubin Design Bureau Director General Igor Vilnit said the sea trials of the power plant were slated for 2016. He also stressed that the AIP plant could be easily integrated with the Project 677 submarines.

Russian Navy Deputy Commander-in-Chief Victor Bursuk had said previously that the Project 677 submarines might be the first to receive AIP power plants.

 

[Ceylal]

LMAO...the kif of this season must have been of superior quality and has reached Pakistan...and Zarvan is its first victim..

 

[Alithemoor1]

Well, they are less dangerous than the hallucinogenic drugs your country is exporting to its neighbours, which I am sure you must be taking because you think this is a thread about Algeria.

 

[Ceylal]

Well, they are less dangerous than the hallucinogenic drugs your country is exporting to its neighbours, which I am sure you must be taking because you think this is a thread about Algeria.

Well we build a wall , a real wall to keep those drugs ( cheap food, médecine and gasoline) that were feeding east Morocco, 3 kms of walls and The Rif goes in flame, same for Southwestern Tunisia..

 

[Nilgiri]

Well we build a wall , a real wall to keep those drugs ( cheap food, médecine and gasoline) that were feeding east Morocco, 3 kms of walls and The Rif goes in flame, same for Southwestern Tunisia..

How would you say relations are like currently between Morocco and Algeria? I know they were pretty bad before (when I last followed it somewhat).

 

[Ceylal]

How would you say relations are like currently between Morocco and Algeria? I know they were pretty bad before (when I last followed it somewhat).

Algeria doesn't have a problem with Morocco, or Morocco as a threat..But Morocco does for some reason we ignore.
The sad thing in all this, is the Moroccan's hate of the Algerians in their entirety is starting transcending into the common folks, which is dangerous precedent. Before it was just between governments and citizens from each side delight themselves in making fun of the squabbling between two incompetent and corrupt governments..