MIG-21 "Bison" VS JF-17 "Thunder"

[batmannow]

FLYING COFINS(MIG21) VS jf-THUNDER!
dear guys, lets disscus this!
i think , there are lots of threads, delibrtly rasid to undermine, the ability of THUNDER, so here is our chance, have a compact disscussion!
plz stay away of trolling!
have a good day!
thanks

 

[duhastmish]

change that - flying coffin - tag - it will ruin your thread - you strated it wrong - you your self strartign a troll.

edit -it you are senior member - and lets have a good discussion.

and - i think may be we should

compare mig-21 bison to jf-17.

 

[Zarbe Momin]

no need to start such meaningless topic!!!!!

 

[Kamakazi 69]

I second duhastmish.
Please change it to MiG 21 Bison vs. JF-17.

 

[Comet]

What do you want to compare between a jet born in 60's and the other recently?

 

[IceCold]

JF-17 does not stand a chance against the superior Mig-21 of the IAF.

 

[Kamakazi 69]

JF-17 does not stand a chance against the superior Mig-21 of the IAF.

Sir I hope you meant that sarcastically. Sure the Bison is the ultimate MiG 21 but come on. Or if you could please elaborate.

 

[duhastmish]

guys lets - be intelligent - and stop talking nonsense - althought i agree this is not really a good quality thread.

but still . . . . lets not make it a joke or one liner section.

--------------------------------------------------

Mig-21 BISON :

NATO Codename: Fishbed.

Indian Name: Trishul, Vikram, Bison.

Type: Single-seat, multi-role fighter.

Current versions in IAF service:

FL (Type 77); ?

M/MF (Type 96); Multi-role version with one R-11-300 turbojet with 13,688 lbs. of thrust. Has 4 pylons which can carry external fuel tanks, air-to-air missiles or twin barrel guns. Has a zero speed, zero altitude ejection seat. The MF variant has a R-11F2S-300 turbojet, otherwise similar to the 'M' variant.

Bis (Type 75); Advanced variant with further improved avionics indicated by the ILS antennae under the nose and on the fin tip. The airframe has a lifespan of 2,685 hours.

Bison; Most advanced variant with further improved avionics incl MFDs, HOTAS, RWRs and BVR Capability.

U/UM/US-Mongol(Type 66); Two seat trainer version with cockpits arranged in tandem, larger main wheels, one piece forward air brake and pilot boom repositioned above intake. Has no cannon armament. Has a broader-chord vertical tail surfaces and a under brake parachute housing, with a deeper dorsal spine and no dorsal fin fillet. One R-13 turbojet and 4 under-wing store pylons.

Accommodation: Bis; Pilot on zero/zero ejection seat with spring loaded arm at top which ensures that seat cannot be operated unless hood is closed. The canopy has a small rear view mirror, a flat bullet proof windscreen and and air-conditioned cabin. Armour plating forward and aft of cockpit. The Bison is equipped with a frameless windshield and a 'Bubble' Canopy.

Avionics: Bis;Standard avionics include automatic radio compass, IFF and a Sirena-3 RWR system. The gyro gun-sight maintains precision up to 2.75 g. Automatic ranging can be fed into gun-sight. Full blind flying instrumentation with attitude and heading indicators given by radio controlled gyro platform. The aircraft also has a search & track radar.

Engine: Depends on aircraft variant.

Maximum Speed: Mach 2.05

Service Ceiling: 15,250 meters (50,000 feet)

G Limit: ?

Combat Radius: Internal fuel - 1100 km; 683 miles.
.....................With internal fuel & four 250 kg. bombs - 370 km; 230 miles.
.....................With two 250kg bombs and drop tanks - 740 km; 460 miles.
.....................A ferry range with three fuel tanks - 1800 km; 1118 miles.

Armament: One twin-barrel 23mm GSh-23 gun with 200 rounds, in the belly pack. Has four under wing pylons for weapons or drop tanks. Can carry air-to-air missiles, rocket pods, bombs, drop tanks and other types of ordnance. In the case of the Bison, the aircraft can carry TV Guided bombs like the KAB 500.

Maximum External Stores Load: FL; 500 kg; 1102 lbs.
..........................................M/MF; 2000 kg; 4409 lbs.
..........................................bis version; 2000 kg; 4409 lbs.
..........................................U/UM/US version; 1000 kg; 2204 lbs.

Self Defence: Depends on the version of the aircraft.

-------------------------------------------

JF-17

Specifications (JF-17/FC-1)

Data from Pakistan Aeronautical Complex

General characteristics

* Crew: 1
* Length: 14.0 m [74] (45.9 ft)
* Wingspan: 9.45 m (including 2 wingtip missiles) [74] (31 ft)
* Height: 4.77 m (15 ft 8 in)
* Wing area: 24.4 m² [74] (263 ft&#178
* Empty weight: 6,411 kg (14,134 lb)
* Loaded weight: 9,100 kg including 2× wing-tip mounted air-to-air missiles [6][75] (20,062 lb)
* Max takeoff weight: 12,700 kg [75] (28,000 lb)
* Powerplant: 1× Klimov RD-93 turbofan
o Dry thrust: 49.4 kN [2][8] (11,106 lbf)
o Thrust with afterburner: 84.4 kN [2][76] (18,973 lbf)
* G-limit: +8.5 g [2]
* Internal Fuel Capacity: 2300 kg (5,130 lb) [6]

Performance

* Maximum speed: Mach 1.8 [6][35] (1,191 knots, 2,205 kph)
* Combat radius: 1,352 km [2] (840 mi)
* Ferry range: 3,000 km [8] (2,175 mi)
* Service ceiling: 16,700 m [8] (54,790 ft)
* Thrust/weight: 0.99 [2][6]

Armament

* Guns: 1× 23 mm GSh-23-2 twin-barrel cannon (can be replaced with 30 mm GSh-30-2)
* Hardpoints: 7 in total (4× under-wing, 2× wing-tip, 1× under-fuselage) with a capacity of 3,629 kg (8,000 lb) external fuel and ordnance,
* Rockets: 57 mm, 90 mm unguided rocket pods [78]
* Missiles:
o Air-to-air missiles:
+ Short range: AIM-9L/M, PL-5E, PL-9C
+ Beyond visual range: PL-12 / SD-10
o Air-to-surface missiles:
+ Anti-radiation missiles
+ Anti-ship missiles: AM-39 Exocet
+ Cruise missiles: Ra'ad ALCM
* Bombs:
o Unguided bombs:
+ Mk-82, Mk-84 general purpose bombs
+ Matra Durandal anti-runway bomb
+ CBU-100/Mk-20 Rockeye anti-armour cluster bomb
o Precision guided munitions (PGM):
+ GBU-10, GBU-12, LT-2 laser-guided bombs
+ H-2, H-4 electro-optically guided,[7] LS-6 satellite-guided glide bombs [77]
+ Satellite-guided bombs [7]
* Others:
o Up to 3 external fuel drop-tanks (1× under-fuselage 800 litres, 2× under-wing 800/1100 litres each) for extended range/loitering time

Avionics

* NRIET KLJ-7 multi-mode fire-control radar [49]
* NVG compatible glass cockpit [6]
* Helmet Mounted Sights/Display (HMS/D)
* Infra-Red Search and Track (IRST)
* Externally mounted avionics pods:
o Self-protection radar jammer pod
o Day/night laser designator targeting pod
o Forward Looking Infra-Red (FLIR) pod

 

[IceCold]

guys lets - be intelligent - and stop talking nonsense - althought i agree this is not really a good quality thread.

but still . . . . lets not make it a joke or one liner section.

--------------------------------------------------

Mig-21 BISON :

NATO Codename: Fishbed.

Indian Name: Trishul, Vikram, Bison.

Type: Single-seat, multi-role fighter.

Current versions in IAF service:

FL (Type 77); ?

M/MF (Type 96); Multi-role version with one R-11-300 turbojet with 13,688 lbs. of thrust. Has 4 pylons which can carry external fuel tanks, air-to-air missiles or twin barrel guns. Has a zero speed, zero altitude ejection seat. The MF variant has a R-11F2S-300 turbojet, otherwise similar to the 'M' variant.

Bis (Type 75); Advanced variant with further improved avionics indicated by the ILS antennae under the nose and on the fin tip. The airframe has a lifespan of 2,685 hours.

Bison; Most advanced variant with further improved avionics incl MFDs, HOTAS, RWRs and BVR Capability.

U/UM/US-Mongol(Type 66); Two seat trainer version with cockpits arranged in tandem, larger main wheels, one piece forward air brake and pilot boom repositioned above intake. Has no cannon armament. Has a broader-chord vertical tail surfaces and a under brake parachute housing, with a deeper dorsal spine and no dorsal fin fillet. One R-13 turbojet and 4 under-wing store pylons.

Accommodation: Bis; Pilot on zero/zero ejection seat with spring loaded arm at top which ensures that seat cannot be operated unless hood is closed. The canopy has a small rear view mirror, a flat bullet proof windscreen and and air-conditioned cabin. Armour plating forward and aft of cockpit. The Bison is equipped with a frameless windshield and a 'Bubble' Canopy.

Avionics: Bis;Standard avionics include automatic radio compass, IFF and a Sirena-3 RWR system. The gyro gun-sight maintains precision up to 2.75 g. Automatic ranging can be fed into gun-sight. Full blind flying instrumentation with attitude and heading indicators given by radio controlled gyro platform. The aircraft also has a search & track radar.

Engine: Depends on aircraft variant.

Maximum Speed: Mach 2.05

Service Ceiling: 15,250 meters (50,000 feet)

G Limit: ?

Combat Radius: Internal fuel - 1100 km; 683 miles.
.....................With internal fuel & four 250 kg. bombs - 370 km; 230 miles.
.....................With two 250kg bombs and drop tanks - 740 km; 460 miles.
.....................A ferry range with three fuel tanks - 1800 km; 1118 miles.

Armament: One twin-barrel 23mm GSh-23 gun with 200 rounds, in the belly pack. Has four under wing pylons for weapons or drop tanks. Can carry air-to-air missiles, rocket pods, bombs, drop tanks and other types of ordnance. In the case of the Bison, the aircraft can carry TV Guided bombs like the KAB 500.

Maximum External Stores Load: FL; 500 kg; 1102 lbs.
..........................................M/MF; 2000 kg; 4409 lbs.
..........................................bis version; 2000 kg; 4409 lbs.
..........................................U/UM/US version; 1000 kg; 2204 lbs.

Self Defence: Depends on the version of the aircraft.

-------------------------------------------

JF-17

Specifications (JF-17/FC-1)

Data from Pakistan Aeronautical Complex

General characteristics

* Crew: 1
* Length: 14.0 m [74] (45.9 ft)
* Wingspan: 9.45 m (including 2 wingtip missiles) [74] (31 ft)
* Height: 4.77 m (15 ft 8 in)
* Wing area: 24.4 m² [74] (263 ft²)
* Empty weight: 6,411 kg (14,134 lb)
* Loaded weight: 9,100 kg including 2× wing-tip mounted air-to-air missiles [6][75] (20,062 lb)
* Max takeoff weight: 12,700 kg [75] (28,000 lb)
* Powerplant: 1× Klimov RD-93 turbofan
o Dry thrust: 49.4 kN [2][8] (11,106 lbf)
o Thrust with afterburner: 84.4 kN [2][76] (18,973 lbf)
* G-limit: +8.5 g [2]
* Internal Fuel Capacity: 2300 kg (5,130 lb) [6]

Performance

* Maximum speed: Mach 1.8 [6][35] (1,191 knots, 2,205 kph)
* Combat radius: 1,352 km [2] (840 mi)
* Ferry range: 3,000 km [8] (2,175 mi)
* Service ceiling: 16,700 m [8] (54,790 ft)
* Thrust/weight: 0.99 [2][6]

Armament

* Guns: 1× 23 mm GSh-23-2 twin-barrel cannon (can be replaced with 30 mm GSh-30-2)
* Hardpoints: 7 in total (4× under-wing, 2× wing-tip, 1× under-fuselage) with a capacity of 3,629 kg (8,000 lb) external fuel and ordnance,
* Rockets: 57 mm, 90 mm unguided rocket pods [78]
* Missiles:
o Air-to-air missiles:
+ Short range: AIM-9L/M, PL-5E, PL-9C
+ Beyond visual range: PL-12 / SD-10
o Air-to-surface missiles:
+ Anti-radiation missiles
+ Anti-ship missiles: AM-39 Exocet
+ Cruise missiles: Ra'ad ALCM
* Bombs:
o Unguided bombs:
+ Mk-82, Mk-84 general purpose bombs
+ Matra Durandal anti-runway bomb
+ CBU-100/Mk-20 Rockeye anti-armour cluster bomb
o Precision guided munitions (PGM):
+ GBU-10, GBU-12, LT-2 laser-guided bombs
+ H-2, H-4 electro-optically guided,[7] LS-6 satellite-guided glide bombs [77]
+ Satellite-guided bombs [7]
* Others:
o Up to 3 external fuel drop-tanks (1× under-fuselage 800 litres, 2× under-wing 800/1100 litres each) for extended range/loitering time

Avionics

* NRIET KLJ-7 multi-mode fire-control radar [49]
* NVG compatible glass cockpit [6]
* Helmet Mounted Sights/Display (HMS/D)
* Infra-Red Search and Track (IRST)
* Externally mounted avionics pods:
o Self-protection radar jammer pod
o Day/night laser designator targeting pod
o Forward Looking Infra-Red (FLIR) pod

We know what are the specs of both the jets. Why dont you offer us with what you think on the subject rather then copying pasting something we already know.

 

[batmannow]

change that - flying coffin - tag - it will ruin your thread - you strated it wrong - you your self strartign a troll.

edit -it you are senior member - and lets have a good discussion.

and - i think may be we should

compare mig-21 bison to jf-17.

sorry dear,
plz dont try to dictate me!
its all over in the media yours , mines & everywhere!Else

IAF avoids grounding 'flying coffins' IANS
Published: September 19, 2009, 22:42

GULFNEWS.COM

New Delhi: They have a poor safety record. But the Indian Air Force (IAF) is reluctant to phase out its old Soviet era warhorse MiG-21s due to the delay in inducting new and modern fighter jets.

Dubbed 'flying coffins' for their frequent crashes, only 150-160 of the over 450 single-engine MiG-21s with the IAF are still in service. A large number have been lost in accidents during peacetime.

"The main problem with MiG-21s is that they are very old and the on-board systems have become obsolete," a highly-placed IAF official told IANS. The official himself has flown the combat aircraft.
But because it faces a shortage of fighter squadrons, the IAF cannot afford to phase out the ageing MiG-21s. If it does that, it would diminish its force level drastically.

The IAF, the world's fourth largest air force, currently has a fighter squadron strength of 33.5 against the sanctioned 39.
"We have a shortage of fighter squadrons. Also, the delay in the delivery of indigenous Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) and in the acquisition of MMRCA (Medium Multi Role Combat Aircraft) is pushing further the phasing out of MiG-21s. After all, we need to maintain a minimum force level," another IAF commander said.
The Indian government has issued tenders for acquisition of 126 medium multi-role combat aircraft but the acquisition has been delayed due to time consuming procedures which include submitting of bids, technical evaluation of proposals from global military suppliers and field trials.

The first aircraft would conservatively be inducted only by 2020, according to defence ministry sources.The assessment is that the retirement of the five squadrons of MiG-21s will diminish the IAF's conventional edge over its adversaries.
The current deadline for the retirement of MiG-21s is 2011. But this is likely to be pushed back further due to the slow pace of procurement and indigenisation process.

"The MiG-21s have a serviceability of 80 per cent. We have good maintenance facilities for Mig-21s. Otherwise we would have been forced to retire them," said the official.

Since 1993, the IAF has lost over 260 aircraft during peacetime. Of these 107 were its vintage warhorse MiG-21s. Fifteen of them crashed in the last five years, leaving seven pilots dead.
The latest crash took place on September 11 when a MiG-21 went down in Bathinda in Punjab, killing the pilot.

Loading Please wait...

i am not trolling, thats their, fair name these days!
if that hurts you, i am sorry but thats the reaility!

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

when jf-17 and mig21 bison will come in contect,our pilot in jf-17 would be counting migs,like our pilot counted falling Hunters in 1965.
there is no comparision b/w these two.
jf-17 is such a manuever aircraft which can never be caught even by Bison's father.

 

[batmannow]

when jf-17 and mig21 bison will come in contect,our pilot in jf-17 would be counting migs,like our pilot counted falling Hunters in 1965.
there is no comparision b/w these two.
jf-17 is such a manuever aircraft which can never be caught even by Bison's father.

DEAR,SIR!
TELL me , if the peoples in the fourm can put THUNDER VS damSU30MKI Thing, why cant , i put it on?
i mean "FLYING COFINS" VS THUNDER thing!

well, in real the largest numbers, in IAF is of "FLYING COFINS", So its the most happenable chance or not?
btw, off topic why you changed your pic, that was cool !

 

[Hayreddin]

no comparison with jf17 thunder

 

[Patriot]

Mig21 is more dangerous as when it crashes it can cause some damage on land.

 

[Owais]

Bogus Topic! comparing an upgraded 3rd generation plane with evolving 4th generation plane is useless. Mig21 have 30+years old airframe. it can be compared with F7 and ROSE Mirages. so the moral is: Mig21 doesn't need to be shoot down, It will crash itself!