Mecca under threat: Outrage over plan to destroy the 'birthplace' of Prophet Mohamed

[al-Hasani]

All land marks which relate to Prophet and his family should be preserved for coming generation . Well, a class of people believe in One god, then why need holy Kaaba, demolish this land mark too. Destroy rest of land marks in middle east too.
All muslim need to preserve the birth place of Islam. Seeing is believing .

What are you talking about?

Are you really comparing the Al-Masjid Al-Haram and the Ka'aba which is the House of Allah (swt) with a building (not even the original building) that now exists on a place where Prophet Muhammad (saws) MIGHT have lived? Really.

Which land marks? Oh, I know. You as a Shia are obviously obsessed about graves and shrines. Those respected Islamic figures are still resting where they were originally buried. The only difference is that there is now not any difference in the appearance of the graves of people lying in the most famous cemeteries in the Islamic world (those found in Makkah and Madinah). This was done decades ago due to the ulama back then fearing that people would pray to those people instead of Allah (swt) which is understandable as misguided pilgrims (some Africans, Farsis and South Asians) still attempt to do so to this very day. There are video evidence of those unfortunate practices on the internet.

Instead of crying about some IRRELEVANT shrines/mausoleums built 300 years ago you are not approaching the most important thing here which is to give more pilgrims the chance to make hajj and umrah. Now for that to be the case you need to EXPAND as the hajj and umrah have changed DRAMATICALLY compared to just 100 years ago. Now you got millions upon millions of pilgrims and those numbers will only increase rapidly in the future.

Now you still have people crying about the low hajj quotes etc. but when the government is doing something about it (expansion work) some people are crying.

When there were few modern hotels in Makkah some pilgrims were crying about lack of hotels.

Now people are crying about there being too many hotels.

Conclusion; You can't make everyone happy.

 

[T-Faz]

Dream on. This is Hijazi land. Always was and always will be.

I wholeheartedly agree with you. I'll go even further, and state that Islam is your religion.

Most of us are Muslims because our ancestors willingly converted or were converted by force. It doesn't matter If some of us have Arabic ancestry, because that was a long time ago.

The various groups who adopted Islam have contributed a great deal to it. You might claim algebra, or Islamic developments in astronomy as Arabic merely because they were written in Arabic by Muslims. In reality, algebra was created by a Persian named Muḥammad ibn Mūsā al-Khwārizmī, while astronomy was introduced to the Islamic world by a Sindhi named Sind ibn Ali. I write this so its clear that it was a two way street.

This whole Islam thing worked for while, but its not working anymore. To be honest, it stopped working hundreds of years ago. So lets get real over the situation now, all these changes in Mecca make good business sense. Religion is a great attraction, and many are willing to pay top dollar to get to Mecca. You are merely milking a great opportunity that has been provided to you. On your land sits the holiest sites of Islam. I hope you get full benefit from this when you get your land back properly. The Hashemites tried, but the Sauds of Najd took control. Before this it was the Turks, the Mamluks, and whoever else who had the best army or resources.

My only dream is that people from my region realise that they are following a foreign religion, and come back to their senses. Your religion has cost us a lot of harm. I am not blaming you as its our own fault, but I would like for you to be more vocal about Islam being yours. Always was and always will be!

 

[al-Hasani]

I wholeheartedly agree with you. I'll go even further, and state that Islam is your religion.

Most of us are Muslims because our ancestors willingly converted or were converted by force. It doesn't matter If some of us have Arabic ancestry, because that was a long time ago.

The various groups who adopted Islam have contributed a great deal to it. You might claim algebra, or Islamic developments in astronomy as Arabic merely because they were written in Arabic by Muslims. In reality, algebra was created by a Persian named Muḥammad ibn Mūsā al-Khwārizmī, while astronomy was introduced to the Islamic world by a Sindhi named Sind ibn Ali. I write this so its clear that it was a two way street.

This whole Islam thing worked for while, but its not working anymore. To be honest, it stopped working hundreds of years ago. So lets get real over the situation now, all these changes in Mecca make good business sense. Religion is a great attraction, and many are willing to pay top dollar to get to Mecca. You are merely milking a great opportunity that has been provided to you. On your land sits the holiest sites of Islam. I hope you get full benefit from this when you get your land back properly. The Hashemites tried, but the Sauds of Najd took control. Before this it was the Turks, the Mamluks, and whoever else who had the best army or resources.

My only dream is that people from my region realise that they are following a foreign religion, and come back to their senses. Your religion has cost us a lot of harm. I am not blaming you as its our own fault, but I would like for you to be more vocal about Islam being yours. Always was and always will be!

A really poor troll attempt from a moderator I must say. Did not expect that.

Hijaz, whoever controlled that region, was inhabited by us local Hijazis. Now we are part of KSA and are happy about that. Proposals of making our ancient and beautiful homeland into some international zone are obviously not going to be accepted. Thus this is our land just as much as Sindh is your land if you are a Sindhi. Regardless of which power controls it. Your long rant has nothing to do with what I wrote.

Just because Makkah and Madinah is part of our lands it does not change anything of what I wrote. Similarly if Makkah and Madinah were located in Sindh.

Secondly Arab scholars and scientists were the majority in the Islamic world. Be it in Arab controlled Al-Andalus or Arab-controlled Baghdad. Read up about the Islamic Golden Age. What that has to do with the topic that you are replying to I do not know.

Lastly nobody forces you or anyone else to follow Islam as you consider that a foreign religion. Does not stop 1.7 billion others from following it just like even more follow Christianity which is also a foreign religion for most people outside of us Semites in the ME.

Anyway what was the NATIVE religion of the native peoples of what is now modern-day Pakistan? Do you even know that? Also what has religion to do with regional attachment? Even if there was no Makkah or Madinah I would not want my region to be ruled by outsiders. Is that not natural? Today Hijaz is part of KSA and that will probably remain as such and most of us Hijazis are content with that despite some of us not liking everything about KSA (me included). I would be against any foreigner trying to change that.

 

[T-Faz]

A really poor troll attempt from a moderator I must say. Did not expect that.

Hijaz, whoever controlled that region, was inhabited by us local Hijazis. Now we are part of KSA and are happy about that. Proposals of making our ancient and beautiful homeland into some international zone are obviously not going to be accepted. Thus this is our land just as much as Sindh is your land if you are a Sindhi. Regardless of which power controls it. Your long rant has nothing to do with what I wrote.

Just because Makkah and Madinah is part of our lands it does not change anything of what I wrote. Similarly if Makkah and Madinah were located in Sindh.

Secondly Arab scholars and scientists were the majority in the Islamic world. Be it in Arab controlled Al-Andalus or Arab-controlled Baghdad. Read up about the Islamic Golden Age. What that has to do with the topic that you are replying to I do not know.

Lastly nobody forces you or anyone else to follow Islam as you consider that a foreign religion. Does not stop 1.7 billion others from following it just like even more follow Christianity which is also a foreign religion for most people outside of us Semites in the ME.

Hardly trolling when I am replying to your provocative post. If I am trolling then all that you write falls in the same category.

I didn't ask for it to be turned into an international zone. I am actually commending you and your countrymen for making most of the situation. Sindh can use its past as a Buddhist state or Iran can use its past as a Zoroastrianism state to benefit from religious tourism, but they choose not to. Although the Catholic church has made its holiest place a city state by itself, and that works too.

I never said that there weren't Arabic scholars or scientists. There were many, but the Persians were the most prominent amongst Muslim scientists. I mentioned this so that its clear that the golden age had contribution from many groups. This golden age is naturally brought up, and I didn't want to have to reply with my examples later.

In terms of forcing this religion on us. Your country does that a lot through its funding across the Muslim world. There should be no doubt about this.

 

[Serpentine]

Secondly Arab scholars and scientists were the majority in the Islamic world. Be it in Arab controlled Al-Andalus or Arab-controlled Baghdad.

Nah, you are wrong.

Anyone would understand that by simply looking at these 2 lists:

List of Persian scientists and scholars - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

List of Arab scientists and scholars - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And this is only Persians (or with that ancestry), while there are also many non-Persian non Arab Muslims who have also contributed to the so called Golden Age.

It's not a shame though, but you shouldn't manipulate history. @T-Faz has a point there.

 

[al-Hasani]

Hardly trolling when I am replying to your provocative post. If I am trolling then all that you write falls in the same category.

I didn't ask for it to be turned into an international zone. I am actually commending you and your countrymen for making most of the situation. Sindh can use its past as a Buddhist state or Iran can use its past as a Zoroastrianism state to benefit from religious tourism, but they choose not to. Although the Catholic church has made its holiest place a city state by itself, and that works too.

I never said that there weren't Arabic scholars or scientists. There were many, but the Persians were the most prominent amongst Muslim scientists. I mentioned this so that its clear that the golden age had contribution from many groups. This golden age is naturally brought up, and I didn't want to have to reply with my examples later.

In terms of forcing this religion on us. Your country does that a lot through its funding across the Muslim world. There should be no doubt about this.

There is nothing wrong with the comment I wrote initially to which you afterwards wrote that long rant. Unless you are going to dispute the fact that we natives (Hijazis) do not want to have our lands divided or ruled by foreigners.

But Buddhism is not native to Sindh. Your ancestors were following a foreign religion too. Likewise Zoroastrianism probably originated among the steppe people of Central Asia.

People are free to do what they want. What have I got to do with it?

No, they were not. It were Arabs. Persians second and Jews third.

KSA is not forcing anything upon people. If Pakistan (read Pakistanis) decided to quit Islam tomorrow there is nothing KSA or anyone else can do.

Besides you assume that every Saudi Arabian is Muslim which is not the case.

Nah, you are wrong.

Anyone would understand that by simply looking at these 2 lists:

List of Persian scientists and scholars - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

List of Arab scientists and scholars - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And this is only Persians (or with that ancestry), while there are also many non-Persian non Arab Muslims who have also contributed to the so called Golden Age.

It's not a shame though, but you shouldn't manipulate history. @T-Faz has a point there.

WIkipedia as a source now, LOL? Arabs dominated. There were only Iranian scholars in the Abbasid Dynasty. Arabs dominated every other period. Arabic itself was the lingua franca of Islam and science. Arabs did most of the translation, dominated Islamic scholarships and had as many scientist and the most important ones as well and dozens of poets.

Sufism also originated in the Arab world. Arabs also ruled the Caliphate the longest.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

I wholeheartedly agree with you. I'll go even further, and state that Islam is your religion.

Most of us are Muslims because our ancestors willingly converted or were converted by force. It doesn't matter If some of us have Arabic ancestry, because that was a long time ago.

The various groups who adopted Islam have contributed a great deal to it. You might claim algebra, or Islamic developments in astronomy as Arabic merely because they were written in Arabic by Muslims. In reality, algebra was created by a Persian named Muḥammad ibn Mūsā al-Khwārizmī, while astronomy was introduced to the Islamic world by a Sindhi named Sind ibn Ali. I write this so its clear that it was a two way street.

This whole Islam thing worked for while, but its not working anymore. To be honest, it stopped working hundreds of years ago. So lets get real over the situation now, all these changes in Mecca make good business sense. Religion is a great attraction, and many are willing to pay top dollar to get to Mecca. You are merely milking a great opportunity that has been provided to you. On your land sits the holiest sites of Islam. I hope you get full benefit from this when you get your land back properly. The Hashemites tried, but the Sauds of Najd took control. Before this it was the Turks, the Mamluks, and whoever else who had the best army or resources.

My only dream is that people from my region realise that they are following a foreign religion, and come back to their senses. Your religion has cost us a lot of harm. I am not blaming you as its our own fault, but I would like for you to be more vocal about Islam being yours. Always was and always will be!

Saien it's good to see you back after such a long time...
In case you are wondering .. My old username was PAKISTANI NATIONALIST.. Anyways hope you'd stick around this time brother.