MBT Modernization Program – A Step In The Right Direction

[Tipu7]

To put Dazzler post in perspective and make it more clear for others to understand who criticize the armour protection of AK unnecessarily, I am attaching pics of AK Turret and Hull

Further I would request to those members to bookmark Dazzler post .....


Front of AK Turret:
The hollow space is +650-670 mm and it is the place where special composite armour is inserted which offer better armour protection then RHA but lighter in weight
View attachment 626762

And below is the turret of AK from inside which shows the so called 'weakest spot' of AK Turret, plz observe the dept of opening for gun port of 7.62mm Machine Gun it is difficult to calculate the thickness but If observe carefully and compare it with the above attached pic then it appear that it is approximately 100-150mm less in thickness which mean its thickness at minimum is anywhere between 500-550 mm

View attachment 626769

below is the front of Turret after attachment of composite armour
View attachment 626766
Here kindly note these are the figures which are without any additional armour protection of ERA or slant space armour which add further protection to the tank turret ....



1- Back Armour Plate
2- Special Armour Cavity
3- Frontal Armour Plate
4- Driver Sitting Place

View attachment 626784

and If we go by the below attached pic then the value of front armour thickness of AK hull is almost +900mm without any additional armour or ERA
View attachment 626787

The cavity is visible here also. (Turret of T96) This design is inheritance of Western input in Chinese defense industry as Turret designs of Chinese origin tanks are very different from that of Soviet /Russian ones.

And here is the inner cross section of composite armor modules which are inserted in those cavities. The exact configuration may vary from tank to tank, but overall pattern is very much common.

Have not seen the upgraded tank, but engine exhaust suggests it uses the same engine as Alzarrar. Its a chinese engine and not Ukrainian as i understand.

Imagine a comprehensive upgrade of T85 in same line as T59 upgrade to AZ.

 

[Dazzler]

View attachment 626802
The cavity is visible here also. (Turret of T96) This design is inheritance of Western input in Chinese defense industry as Turret designs of Chinese origin tanks are very different from that of Soviet /Russian ones.

And here is the inner cross section of composite armor modules which are inserted in those cavities. The exact configuration may vary from tank to tank, but overall pattern is very much common.
View attachment 626800


Imagine a comprehensive upgrade of T85 in same line as T59 upgrade to AZ.

I will not discount the upgrade as it has Alkhalid's FCS, new engine and possibly transmission. The sights are clearly those from Alkhalid and a 2nd gen TI, possibly Catherine FC.

 

[ziaulislam]

kinda surprised to know how Indian t90 is underpowered as compared to alkhalid..or am i missing something..

why hasnt india countered this yet?

 

[Gentelman]

My brother is also part of PCB designs in a private company in Islamabad I-9 industrial area working for HIT

You probably should even spell out c a r e here.....
Cool down, somethings aren't to be said publicly!

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

kinda surprised to know how Indian t90 is underpowered as compared to alkhalid..or am i missing something..

why hasnt india countered this yet?

Their Doctrine is based upon their numerical advantage 4200 vs 2400 may be they dont see much advantage in increasing capability of Individual Tanks apart from the T-90MS as far as i remember none of their Tanks have Hunter Killer capability MS have still not arrived in Indian.

Other than this most Indians Tanks lack ACs this might not effect crew performance elsewhere but in The scorching heat of Thar Cholistan and Rajasthan in summer Crews will be toast from Heat. Half a decade ago their T72s used to lack Night time fighting capability. Even Right now all their efforts are related to getting as much T-90s as Possible.

 

[Dazzler]

Indigenous development of t-80UD FCS/ GCS components.

kinda surprised to know how Indian t90 is underpowered as compared to alkhalid..or am i missing something..

why hasnt india countered this yet?

Its true. T-90S has V92s2 engine that generates 1000hp
https://ofb.gov.in/unit/pages/EFA/v92s2-engine

6td-2 of AK series does 1200hp

http://www.malyshevplant.com/en/content/6td

Their Doctrine is based upon their numerical advantage 4200 vs 2400 may be they dont see much advantage in increasing capability of Individual Tanks apart from the T-90MS as far as i remember none of their Tanks have Hunter Killer capability MS have still not arrived in Indian.

Other than this most Indians Tanks lack ACs this might not effect crew performance else ware but in The scorching heat of Thar Cholistan and Rajasthan in summer Crews will be toast from Heat. Half a decade ago their T72s used to lack Night time fighting capability. Even Right now all their efforts are related to getting as much T-90s as Possible.

Not just ACs, they also lacked a dedicated APU unit for silent watch. Tanks in the battlefield need to keep a silent watch by turning the engine off, wheere the APU provides power to FCS and sensors. Even Al Zarrar has an APU from the get go.

Alkhalid's APU

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

Their Doctrine is based upon their numerical advantage 4200 vs 2400 may be they dont see much advantage in increasing capability of Individual Tanks apart from the T-90MS as far as i remember none of their Tanks have Hunter Killer capability MS have still not arrived in Indian.

Other than this most Indians Tanks lack ACs this might not effect crew performance else ware but in The scorching heat of Thar Cholistan and Rajasthan in summer Crews will be toast from Heat. Half a decade ago their T72s used to lack Night time fighting capability. Even Right now all their efforts are related to getting as much T-90s as Possible.

What they have BMP 2s too. It provides great advantage. Except AK, I don't think our remaining tanks are better than T90s, T72Ms or Arjun

 

[Goenitz]

nd here is the inner cross section of composite armor modules

never thought that turret has armor too.. thought just the two angled ERA plates are just protecting crew.. so happy to see that.

 

[HRK]

thought just the two angled ERA plates are just protecting crew.. so happy to see that.

I may be wrong but I think the plates which you are referring are not ERA but composite glacier armour plates

 

[Dazzler]

I may be wrong but I think the plates which you are referring are not ERA but composite glacier armour plates

What if i say that Alkhalid turret has adequate side armor too but t-90S has zilch?

 

[bananarepublic]

Indigenous development of t-80UD FCS/ GCS components.


View attachment 626841



Its true. T-90S has V92s2 engine that generates 1000hp
https://ofb.gov.in/unit/pages/EFA/v92s2-engine

6td-2 of AK series does 1200hp

http://www.malyshevplant.com/en/content/6td



Not just ACs, they also lacked a dedicated APU unit for silent watch. Tanks in the battlefield need to keep a silent watch by turning the engine off, wheere the APU provides power to FCS and sensors. Even Al Zarrar has an APU from the get go.

Alkhalid's APU

View attachment 626865

Might I ask where Al-Khalid APU lies, i know that the russian T-80s have it at the back right side . which is very exposed , while i have not seen it clearly.

 

[Dazzler]

Might I ask where Al-Khalid APU lies, i know that the russian T-80s have it at the back right side . which is very exposed , while i have not seen it clearly.

Its at the back inside protective housing.

You probably should even spell out c a r e here.....
Cool down, somethings aren't to be said publicly!

CARE is not the only one mate

 

[HRK]

What if i say that Alkhalid turret has adequate side armor too but t-90S has zilch?

obviously will agree ....

 

[Dazzler]

obviously will agree ....

Notice the sides

AK1 turret

T-90S/A turret

The side armor in 90 is non-existent

 

[Dazzler]

T-80UD maintenance, rebuild..