#MarasiMedia undermines DGISPR: A Threat to Pak State

[Ahmet Pasha]

All our saplings had wild weeds attacking from all sides bro.

Since our inception we are asking ourselves are we a normal country ??.Havent we tried all the known systems from Parliamentary democracy to Dictatorial democracy,from Marshall laws to Islami Nizams,from Military Presidencies to Civilian Presidencies.Lest not forget we were under the Crown and Governor General rule as well.
For me the remedy to our woes lies in not the constant changing of the Systems but the stable continuity of the system(Any).Well we cannot expect a sapling to become a tree and bear fruit if it is constantly uprooted.

 

[Mrc]

Modi will win indian elections.. I would give it 2 years before their is another showdown once rafael are operating...


Time to deal with PTM and traitors is now

 

[VCheng]

a lot of statements are presented in supreme court as well. I am saying Do u have access to such stats ? Th reason why i am asking you is because, as you are well aware of desi culture. It will be very hard to get figures in a country where everything is sensationalism secondly, even if we have that data the veracity of such number will not be genuine since we lack credbility and international norms

Let me just say that the environment in Pakistan is simply not conducive to the rule of law, by design.

As long as that serves the interest country in long run why not, after all military is just an extended arm of state that is being governed by the elected govt

It depends on who gets to define the national interest, and whether the military is under civilian control, or the other way around in reality, despite all the claims.

I don't think that happens in any country....suspected of anti state activities is also a label used to pick up anyone in America. ..do they need court approvals in America?

Jurisdictions of all LEAs are defined at every level, and any suspect cannot be "picked up" without due process, including evidence to justify surveillance or detention, an indictment in a court of law, the right to legal representation and to challenge the accusations in the proper court of jurisdiction. Nobody goes missing without serious consequences, that is for sure.

Lol. Good doctor Is biased when it comes to USA. But its okay you can never take a pakistan out of Overseas pakistani and we all can see that.

Such baseless accusations of bias and personal attacks and violations of privacy (encouraged by the PDF management) do nothing to counter the veracity of the arguments that I present.

 

[ShaikhKamal]

We are a democratic country and free press has the right to report news and make their comments. Pakistan gained it's independence through the democratic process and not like Turkey where Turkish army defeated invading armies and created modern Turkey. Pakistan Armed Force must respect democracy and press freedom. You have the right to ignore some news channels and their news if there is false accusations or fake news then you can file defamation case in the courts.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

So how do such suspicions and interrogations comply with provisions of the laws applicable to the citizenry?

I don't know. I suppose at least one specific case, where the involvement of the intelligence agencies and/or military is conclusively proven, would have to make its way through the justice system and eventually have a SC ruling on the issue.

 

[VCheng]

I don't know. I suppose at least one specific case, where the involvement of the intelligence agencies and/or military is conclusively proven, would have to make its way through the justice system and eventually have a SC ruling on the issue.

Much has to change for such a case to actually make a difference, and therefore highly unlikely, but we can hope, at least.

 

[salarsikander]

Let me just say that the environment in Pakistan is simply not conducive to the rule of law, by design.

That is true and not in Vaccum, we have tribal system, we have wadera system, its only in last 20 years or so people have moved urban, but are still dealing with these new method of universal law, our culkture is not accustomed to it, since bulk of population still resides in dehats villages, living under Civiolised rule of law is something we are not yet accustoimed to yet. Give it sometime

It depends on who gets to define the national interest, and whether the military is under civilian control, or the other way around in reality, despite all the claims

The military is an extended arm of the state and is playing its role. For normal local akistais tbh it doesnt matter as long as their way of life is secured to decent extent it is fie. Please do not compare this region with west. Our culture, thought process is fundamentally different from them. we are bit of that and this, more sort of hybrid

 

[VCheng]

That is true and not in Vaccum, we have tribal system, we have wadera system, its only in last 20 years or so people have moved urban, but are still dealing with these new method of universal law, our culkture is not accustomed to it, since bulk of population still resides in dehats villages, living under Civiolised rule of law is something we are not yet accustoimed to yet. Give it sometime

Of course. After nearly three-quarters of a century, what's the rush? The hope of the rule of law is good, but not to be realized, by design, for its upsets the existing system too much. That is the reality, like it or not.

But you are right, it may change at some time in the future. May be.

The military is an extended arm of the state and is playing its role. For normal local akistais tbh it doesnt matter as long as their way of life is secured to decent extent it is fie. Please do not compare this region with west. Our culture, thought process is fundamentally different from them. we are bit of that and this, more sort of hybrid

Defend and justify it all you want, I have no problems with it, since reality remains what it is for all to see. I have no reason to argue.

 

[salarsikander]

Much has to change for such a case to actually make a difference,

There is no doubnt about that Indeed, there is room for growth. Judging by the literacy rate and poverty rate and not to mention the prevailing mentality of the self-interest of every individual in this country.

So how or what do you propose in phase manner that should be done to improve it ?

 

[VCheng]

There is no doubnt about that Indeed, there is room for growth. Judging by the literacy rate and poverty rate and not to mention the prevailing mentality of the self-interest of every individual in this country.

So how or what do you propose in phase manner that should be done to improve it ?

Well, on PDF, we were told to expect a great improvement with the advent of Naya Pakistan. Let's wait and see what actually is deleivered, if anything first. It is up to PMIK to propose the steps that would lead to such improvements. After all, as @Arsalan described it in the sticky thread, it is the "dawn of a new era". Not much light still, be we live in hope, of course.

 

[salarsikander]

Of course. After nearly three-quarters of a century, what's the rush? The hope of the rule of law is good, but not to be realized, by design, for its upsets the existing system too much. That is the reality, like it or not.

But you are right, it may change at some time in the future. May be.

, Mere 3 quaters of century is good enough for the a nation that was under slavery and then just jumped in bandwagon of west ( for whatever reasons) but has failed to address the fundamental right.

You must look around you, the social structure that is deeply embedded here, the no existent corporate culture or professionalism. That is not designed per say. That is how it turned out to be and everyone part of is growing in such a negative way. We can contribute, be tolerant of other views and counter them with logic. We can increase exposure of our youth. Be more sincere to nation. List goes long. But we should not exploring or learning. Sociteies takes ages to develop. The change has to come from withing it must be felth that it is required if masses are oblivious of it then you cannot do much other than to educate

Well, on PDF, we were told to expect a great improvement with the advent of Naya Pakistan

My Good doctor, I have learnt a great deal from you eversince I joined this PDF. but you saying stuff like this disapponts me. You really think PDF alone is the representative of pakistan as whole ? Though it can give yoiu an idea buut still. Also do u expect the change to be over-night ?

DO you not see that people hae become a bit of self aware of their voting rights, Do u not see that a minister has to resign because of his under performance ? is that not good for change that at least a culture is being created where youre resigning from post because yoiu cant deliver it ? If you expect PTI to make Pakistan another Tokyoa than youre just thinking like teenager, but will that improve a culture or menatality, Yes it will.. Consider this as building blocks, But it will tke time

 

[VCheng]

, Mere 3 quaters of century is good enough for the a nation that was under slavery and then just jumped in bandwagon of west ( for whatever reasons) but has failed to address the fundamental right.

You must look around you, the social structure that is deeply embedded here, the no existent corporate culture or professionalism. That is not designed per say. That is how it turned out to be and everyone part of is growing in such a negative way. We can contribute, be tolerant of other views and counter them with logic. We can increase exposure of our youth. Be more sincere to nation. List goes long. But we should not exploring or learning. Sociteies takes ages to develop. The change has to come from withing it must be felth that it is required if masses are oblivious of it then you cannot do much other than to educate

Khuda ney aaj tak uss qaum kee halat nahi badlee .........

If the masses are oblivious and the elite are happy, not much is going to change anytime soon. But you are correct, change may come little by little over a long period of time. Whether the state itself has that time is debatable, beginning with the economy, and ending with the social issues.

My Good doctor, I have learnt a great deal from you eversince I joined this PDF. but you saying stuff like this disapponts me. You really think PDF alone is the representative of pakistan as whole ? Though it can give yoiu an idea buut still. Also do u expect the change to be over-night ?

DO you not see that people hae become a bit of self aware of their voting rights, Do u not see that a minister has to resign because of his under performance ? is that not good for change that at least a culture is being created where youre resigning from post because yoiu cant deliver it ? If you expect PTI to make Pakistan another Tokyoa than youre just thinking like teenager, but will that improve a culture or menatality, Yes it will.. Consider this as building blocks, But it will tke time

Haven't I advocated numerous times to give PMIK the full term to deliver on the promises he made to the nation without any rush to judgement?

Let us first see what he decides about an IMF bailout and if so, the consequences and their management under his leadership. Tokyo can wait.

 

[salarsikander]

"dawn of a new era". Not much light still, be we live in hope, of course.

Indeed, French revolution which was the bloodiest of all, didnt bring reforms or changes overnight did it? Hell after revolutionaries took power they went on a purge and people were demanding monarchy system back It was messed up. But As soon as Bonparte came in power ignoring that he was full of him,self and self centered he did lay foundations of liberal institutions ( though initially it was depsotic regime) which then went on to grow with society did it not. So yeah consider Era of PTI as that, Trust me will go further down than where we are now and people will doubt it. But if youre selfless and sincere you work pays off eventually and Overseas technical pakistanis are more then welcome to come and let us improve. By sharing their insights , exposure to help us uplift ourselves

Bilkol

Khuda ney aaj tak uss qaum kee halat nahi badle

 

[VCheng]

So yeah consider Era of PTI as that, Trust me will go further down than where we are now and people will doubt it. But if youre selfless and sincere you work pays off eventually and Overseas technical pakistanis are more then welcome to come and let us improve. By sharing their insights , exposure to help us uplift ourselves

Let us what evolves during the rest of this term and how that improves things for the future.

 

[salarsikander]

If the masses are oblivious and the elite are happy, not much is going to change anytime soon.

Tghis is the dilemna here that we have, there is improvement in this regards but a lot needs to be done . We have become beghariat. We hear azaan 5 times daily yet find no shame in asking for bribe as it is our right, We will hate Pork which equally haram as Bribe, but will gladly take brib, Cuz why not pesa hi toh hai, koi suwar gosht thodi kha rha ho. This needs to change and to some little extent., by very modest margin it has.