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Majority of Pakistanis for 'Islamisation' of society: Poll

don't take me wrong, i just wanted to say to give reference from where you have taken the text.

As i said- the doors are closed for the matters relating to faith/iba'daats etc, regarding the muam'laat - it's always open!

I can't put my son in law's uncle on the Forum.

He is a Muslim and a religious teacher.

There is no button where a human being an be affixed.

Ijtihad is not open.

There is enough of links on the net, especially from the US Muslims to open Ijtihad again!
 
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Iqbal and reconstruction of religious thought In Islam

Nineteenth century was very critical for Islam and Islamic theology. Islamic theology had remained static for centuries. It evolved up to first three century and then became static, particularly after sack of Baghdad in 1258 A.D. Sack of Baghdad was a critical moment for the Islamic world. It delivered severe blow not only to the Abbasid Caliphate but also to Islamic thought. In fact the decline had begun from 11th century itself. The Muslim power was weakening and sense of security was lost. For flowering of a civilisation and culture, peace and stability is very essential. ......

The stagnation in theological thinking continued until the beginning of the colonial period in various Islamic countries including India. India, though not an Islamic country, was under the Muslim (Moghul) rule until 1857. The colonial rule gave a great jolt to Muslim thinkers in most of the colonised world. Jamaluddin Afghani, Muhammad Abduh, Sir Syed Ahmad Khan and several others were product of this crisis situation in the Muslim world. The mainstream theology, however, continued unchanged. But some major thinkers emerged in all these countries who realised the significance of re-thinking theological issues. .......

Sir Syed Ahmad Khan, Maulavi Chiragh Ali and Maulavi Mumtaz Ali Khan were brilliant thinkers and Islamic scholars. They chose to respond to the crisis in Muslim society created by the colonial rule and wrote on related topics. Their contributions to Islamic thought in India were quite seminal. Sir Syed Ahmad Khan also began to write a new commentary on the holy Qur’an but could not complete due to storm of opposition from the orthodox theologians. His priority was to spread modern education among Muslims. But Maulavi Chiragh Ali and others continued their campaign for re-thinking issues and responding to new challenges. This was their priority.
Dr. Iqbal came later on the scene. He too had an opportunity for both traditional and modern education. Iqbal was product of intense crisis period in modern Indian history, particularly the crisis Muslims in India were facing. The Indian Muslim elite had lost political power and now had to compete with the Hindu elite for government jobs and elected offices. In addition to loss of power they were nursing minority complex as well. Thus they were suffering from double challenge – loss of power and minority status.

Iqbal was acutely aware of this situation and was quite sensitive. On top of all this the Muslims in India felt great shock at the fall of Turkish Khilafat after the First World War. The Khilafat movement became a big issue in Indian freedom movement as well. It was after fall of Turkish Empire that Iqbal wrote his moving poem Khizr-e-Rah. And it was during this period of intense crisis that Iqbal developed the concept of khudi i.e. self. This concept of self was meant to overcome the sense of deprivation among the Muslim elite and give them sense of self esteem and generate power-consciousness among them. Iqbal admires power precisely because the Muslim elite was suffering from the feeling of powerlessness.

Iqbal was also aware of the fact that conservative theological thought cannot be adequate to meet new challenges emerging on the scene. There was great need for re-thinking and reconstructing religious thought in Islam. He had expressed some of his ideas in his epic poems like Asrar-e-Khudi, Rumuz-e-Bekhudi, Pas Chi Bayad kard Aqwam-e-Sharq etc. However, he had not expressed himself on these issues systematically in prose. When he got an invitation in 1932 to deliver six lectures from Madras he penned down his thoughts which were published in book form under the title The Reconstruction of Religious Thought in Islam published from Lahore where he lived.

Iqbal then raises the question “What then is the principle of movement in the nature of Islam? This is ijtihad.”[2] Thus according to Iqbal ijtihad (creative interpretation or attempt to exert oneself for comprehending new situation and reformulation) is principle of movement in Islam. There may have been reasons for closing the gates of ijtihad but they must be wide opened today.
It is important to note that ijtihad meets the need both for permanence and change. Ijtihad is rooted in certain basic principles of faith. It is a serious attempt to capture the original spirit of the Qur’anic injunctions which has been overlayed by traditions and customs to fulfil the then social needs. The jurists while attempting formulations centuries ago could not have ignored the social needs of their time. Qur’anic injunctions were applied by them as best as they could in their own times.

It is our religious duty in our own times to exert ourselves as our forefathers did to apply the Quranic injunctions as best as we can. This is real ijtihad. The holy Prophet also is reported to have said that one who does ijtihad and errs will get one reward and one who does ijtihad and succeeds will get two rewards. This hadith also shows that it is our duty to do ijtihad. However, out of fear that we will not succeed and that our desire will mislead us our ‘ulama forbade Muslims from attempting ijtihad.....

The conservative ‘ulama of his time like Maulana Sulayman Nadvi were not happy even with these lectures and wished Iqbal had never written these lectures. Iqbal was too close to these ‘ulama to attempt any such concrete reconstruction. But even his emphasis on ijtihad is very significant one for the Islamic world today. Islamic world is faced with many serious social, economic and juridical challenges. There does not seem to be any great intellectual exercise for facing these challenges. The world of Islam is as stagnant as it was during the time of Iqbal. If Iqbal’s suggestion for meaningful ijtihad is seriously undertaken it would really usher in creative and meaningful change.
Iqbal and reconstruction of religious thought In Islam

That much for Ijtihad happening!!
 
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That much for Ijtihad happening!!

Ijtihad is still going on in the Muslim world and among sunnis we don't need such drama articles to tell us about great ALLAMA IQBAL we know very well
 
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OPINION: Ijtihad – The Need of the Hour

By Dr. M.I.H. Farooqi

Ijtihad means the modern interpretation/re-reading of Shariah in the light of Quran and Sunnah to suit the requirements of time and space. Ijtihad is an accepted concept in Islam and one cannot deny its legitimacy. In a fast changing world, recourse to ijtihad is a must. However, there is no need for Ijtihad as far as basic beliefs and Ibadats (Prayers) are concerned, but in other matters of changed life styles Ijtihad is a great necessity. It is particularly important in relation to the status of women, relations between different Muslim Sects, relations between Muslims and non-Muslims, the role of Muslims in non-Muslim societies, and Islamic economic theories. ....

Unfortunately in recent past, restrictions on the practice of Ijtihad were imposed both by religious establishments with vested interest and by repressive governments in Muslim countries opposed to democracy and freedom of inquiry. It has to be understood that freedom of expression is essential to the practice of Ijtihad through which reconciliation of Islam and modernity as well as reform of educational system can be successfully accomplished. We are in dire need of Ijtihad; if there were no Ijtihad, the number of Muslins who would behave according to their personal opinion or according to non religious norms would multiply in every generation. Many scholars from different disciplines have expressed the opinion that the loss of Ijtihad has been a central reason for the intellectual conservatism and stagnation in Muslim societies and, therefore, Ijtihad is a prerequisite for the survival of Islamic civilization in a modern world.

Shah Waliullah, an outstanding scholar-reformer and a thinker par excellence, of 18th century, emphasized the need for Ijtihad in order to provide economic and social justice to Muslims at large He highly decried closing its gates and criticized the contemporary Ulema for approving it.

King Hussein (Jordan) – “When Ijtihad (the possibility of reconciling faith and present-day life) stopped a long time ago, that was the beginning of a very sad deterioration that has continued over the years and has opened the way to all sorts of movements and splits. We need to do whatever we can to repair that mistake.”....

Radwan Masmoudi (Center for the Study of Islam and Democracy-Washington) – Science known as Ijtihad (or reasoning and interpretation) was developed by Muslim scholars in order to understand and apply the message of the Qur’an to varying societal needs and conditions… this the process of Ijtihad has enabled Muslims to be flexible and to learn from other cultures and civilizations. Islam teaches that no one owns the truth and that the true believer is always in search of the truth and wisdom; wherever he finds them, he follows. This ongoing search for truth and for the overarching Islamic principle of justice has led Muslims and Muslim scholars to respect one another’s opinions. Until about 1500 CE, this process allowed Muslims and Muslim societies to continually adapt in the face of changing societal conditions and new advances in knowledge...... (Note until 1500 CE)

In view of the above-mentioned opinions and facts, the Members of Sir Syed Scientific Society, Lucknow, feel that the door of Ijtihad (re-interpretation) should be kept open as permitted by the Qur’an and Sunnah.

IndianMuslimObserver.com: OPINION: Ijtihad – The Need of the Hour

Therefore, the stating that ijtihad is in vogue, would be merely a figment of desire, but not a reality!!

It closed long ago because it was felt that none had the qualifications or wisdom to reinterpret the Islamic tenets.

I may not be Zakir Naik, but I do know a wee bit!

I am not an Islamophobia nut, but then I am also not so gullible as to accept explanations that are figments of imagination and desire prompted by either embarrassment to be modern or obfuscation, hoping that the other chap is clueless on Islam and so feed him disinformation and end the issue.

I do attempt to study, gather knowledge and then when required, give my two penny worth.

If you feel I have missed something, I sure would like to be educated since it will only help me to understand better.

Personally, I think it is really time for Ijtihad, but I am also aware it will be treading dangerous ground for the one to try to do so!

And these are real dangerous times!!
 
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Ijtihad is still going on in the Muslim world and among sunnis we don't need such drama articles to tell us about great ALLAMA IQBAL we know very well


You are an unabashed apologist who can go to any length to obfuscate to include fevered imagination and even falsehood.

If it is drama articles, disprove it. I will be obliged.

I presume that you are overreaching yourself and being presumptuous to project that you know more than genuine scholars of Islam of the ancient and modern times!

Your one liners are the most disingenuous garbage that one finds in the world wide web!!

Forgive me, even though it is not a trespass, you really know Nothing, let alone about Iqbal.
 
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Therefore, the stating that ijtihad is in vogue, would be merely a figment of desire, but not a reality!!

It closed long ago because it was felt that none had the qualifications or wisdom to reinterpret the Islamic tenets.

I may not be Zakir Naik, but I do know a wee bit!

I am not an Islamophobia nut, but then I am also not so gullible as to accept explanations that are figments of imagination and desire prompted by either embarrassment to be modern or obfuscation, hoping that the other chap is clueless on Islam and so feed him disinformation and end the issue.

I do attempt to study, gather knowledge and then when required, give my two penny worth.

If you feel I have missed something, I sure would like to be educated since it will only help me to understand better.

Ijtehad for the sake of Ijtehad is discouraged.. why reinvent the wheel, such as the punishment for blasphemy if proven.
However, it is also encouraged at the same time.. for new issues.. and looking at older issues with context to the current times where it is applicable.. such as the use of DNA in a Hudood case.
If it was up to the Clergy spawned by Maududi.. they would discourage it by all except their own cabal.
 
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such as the use of DNA in a Hudood case.

Thank you.

Can you give a link?

Has it been accepted in the Islamic tenets?

If Ijtihad was encouraged and in vogue, then why are there so many Islamic scholars claiming it is not?

Are they wrong in their assumptions?

Then why has the concept of mujtahid mutlaq not been declared obsolete and redundant?
 
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Ijtehad for the sake of Ijtehad is discouraged.. why reinvent the wheel, such as the punishment for blasphemy if proven.
However, it is also encouraged at the same time.. for new issues.. and looking at older issues with context to the current times where it is applicable.. such as the use of DNA in a Hudood case.
If it was up to the Clergy spawned by Maududi.. they would discourage it by all except their own cabal.

If we are talking about the Hudood Ordinance, it was an Ordinance and hence man made.

ISLAMABAD: Pakistan government has decided to retain all Islamic punishments in the ‘Hudood’ Ordinance including stoning to death and lashing for various offences, but proposed procedural amendments in their applicability to women accused.

The Ministry of Law, Justice and Human Rights has finalised the draft of a bill to bring in amendments to the Hudood Ordinance of 1979 brought in by former military ruler Ziaul Haq with the objective of removing all “legal and procedural lacunae” in it, the Daily Times reported on Monday....

During a series of recent debates held on television between moderates and conservatives, it was argued that the Hudood ordinance was not completely Islamic and some of its structures were “man-made”. The Islamist alliance, Muthahida Majlis Amal (MMA) has threatened to launch an agitation if the government amended the Hudood Ordinance.

Pak govt to modify ‘Hudood’ - World - DNA

The human being can change human laws because it is possible that a given law be beneficial in one age but not in another. Religious systems always offer the best laws and because they cannot be improved upon, they are unchangeable.

If we turn our backs on Divine Laws and have recourse to manmade regulations, we have, in fact, abandoned the broad and open plain of the universal law of religion for the narrow and uneven alley that is the limited mind of the human being.
http://www.rafed.net/en/index.php?o...is-message&catid=182&Itemid=966&limitstart=32
 
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didn't i said that this moaning of 'whose Islam is now out of fashion- now bring something new as all this now sounds like a broken record.

The Ulemas of all sects agreed on 22 points as follow:

This is the Objectives Resolution, it was approved by the the Constituent Assembly of Pakistan on 12 March 1949. You keep bringing this in as if its some sort of future prospect that can be implemented, the fact is that this has been in place for decades and if we go by your logic, we can come to a conclusion that Pakistan is what you want. That it is an Islamic state where the Quran and the Sunnah are supreme, similarly Allah is the supreme being and the official authority of sovereignty.

However it has been stated during the Munir Report that this resolution "though grandiloquent in words, phrases, and clauses, is nothing but a hoax, and that not only does it not contain even a semblance of the embryo of an Islamic State but its provisions, particularly those relating to fundamental rights, are directly opposed to the principles of an Islamic State."

0101islamicstate

Now my argument to you is that you consider the objectives resolution as the source of Islamization but the fact is that this document is nothing but a hoax and contradictory to the tenants of Islam. What is your take on this matter and how will you underline the core aspects of it as being a part of an Islamic state?

How old are you btw?
 
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I am not getting into this any more since it will lead us off course.

And, the interpretation is of the believer!
 
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Read this part very closely too and look at the constant confusion and lack of clarity on the part of Ulema regarding the foundation of an Islamic state.

a.) What is then the Islamic State of which everybody talks but nobody thinks? Before we seek to discover an answer to this question, we must have a clear conception of the scope and function of the State.

b.) The ulama were divided in their opinions when they were asked to cite some precedent of an Islamic State in Muslim history. Thus, though Hafiz Kifayat Husain, the Shia divine, held out as his ideal the form of Government during the Holy Prophet's time, Maulana Daud Ghaznavi aho included in his precedent the days of the Islamic Republic, of Umar bin Abdul Aziz, Salah ud-Din Ayyubi of Damascus, Sultan Mahmud of Ghazni, Muhammad Tughlaq and Aurangzeb, and the present regime in Saudi Arabia.

Most of them, however, relied on the form of Government during the Islamic Republic from 632 to 661 A.D., a period of less than thirty years, though some of them also added the very short period of Umar bin Abdul Aziz. Maulana Abdul Haamid Badayuni stated that the details of the ideal State would be worked out by the ulama, while Master Taj-ud-Din Ansari's confused notion of an Islamic State may be gathered from the following portion of his interrogation: --

"Q.-- Were you also in the Khilafat movement?
A.--Yes.
Q.-- When did the Khilafat movement stop in India?
A.-- In 1923. This was after the Turks had declared their country to be a secular State.
Q.-- If you are told that the Khilafat movement continued long after the Turks had abolished Khilafat, will that be correct?
A.-- As far as I remember, the Khilafat movement finished with the abolition of the Khilafat by the Turks.
Q.-- You are reported to have been a member of the Khilafat movement right up to 1928 and having made speeches. Is it correct?
A.-- It could not be correct.
Q.-- Was the Congress interested in Khilafat?
A.-- Yes.
Q.-- Was Khilafat with you a matter of religious conviction, or just a political movement?
A.-- It was purely a religious movement.
Q.-- Did the Khilafat movement have the support of Mr. Gandhi!
A.-- Yes.
Q.-- What was the object of the Khilafat movement?
A.-- The Britisher was injuring the Khilafat institution in Turkey, and the Musalman was aggrieved by this attitude of the Britisher.
Q.-- Was not the object of the movement to resuscitate the Khilafat among the Musalmans?
A.-- No.
Q.-- Is Khilafat with you a necessary part of a Muslim form of Government?
A.-- Yes.
Q.-- Are you, therefore, in favour of having a Khilafat in Pakistan?
A.-- Yes.
Q.-- Can there be more than one Khalifa of the Muslims?
A.-- No.
Q.-- Will the Khalifa of Pakistan be the Khalifa of all the Muslims of the world?
A.-- He should be but cannot be."


c.) Throughout the three thousand years over which political thought extends, and such thought in its early stages cannot be separated from religion, two questions have invariably presented themselves for consideration: -

(1) what are the precise functions of the State? and
(2) who shall control the State?

Just read how confused Taj-ud-Din Ansari is and he was a known figure, such confusions and lack of clarity in matters of an Islamic state meant that the source for it has not been comprehended by certain Ulema's who are for an Islamic state.

0202foundations
 
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Thank you.

Can you give a link?

Has it been accepted in the Islamic tenets?

If Ijtihad was encouraged and in vogue, then why are there so many Islamic scholars claiming it is not?

Are they wrong in their assumptions?

Then why has the concept of mujtahid mutlaq not been declared obsolete and redundant?

Most scholars discourage it for the very same reason why you would discourage an untrained fellow to handle a nuke. Both can have equally disastrous results in the hands of an untrained person. However, many of these "scholars" themselves are fairly untrained.. and are not scholar but rather Mufti's.
A mufti's standing in front of scholars (according to the system laid down (since has been abolished and forgotten) by the early adherents of Islam ) is akin to a technician to a scientist. A technician may have read all the manuals.. and knows how to work within their boundaries well. But unlike the scientist, cannot pass, append or abolish tenets,laws and interpretations. Where is Ijtehad encouraged then??
if a matter that falls within the scope of sharia.. and there are no scholars available to decide on it, then Ijtehad may be undertaken by the common man in consultation with the basic of the Quran and Sunnah. However, when there are scholars available to partake in ijtehad, then it is preferred to defer the case to them for a decision. Just as the technician should not try to modify the design of a nuclear reactor especially when there are physicists and engineers present.


If we are talking about the Hudood Ordinance, it was an Ordinance and hence man made.

The Hudood ordnance is man made.. the Hudood(limits) which have been set by the Quran are from god. It is their interpretation that is man-made.
However, if such an interpretation was done by the prophet or by his companions.. then it is generally accepted as beyond doubt.
i.e the basic conditions that are deemed a violation of the Hudood stay the same.
 
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That much for Ijtihad happening!!

your argument will hold weight only if Islam opposes techological development taking place in our era- Islam welcomes new development within a certain boundary and cannot accept each and every thing whole heartedly coming from the west.

Only if you can give examples as to how it's closed, it will be helpful!
 
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