Saradiel
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So you guys believe tamils are not historical inhabitants of Sri lanka..?
How do u say u guys, cant u see many Lankans here dont approve what he says?
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So you guys believe tamils are not historical inhabitants of Sri lanka..?
So you guys believe tamils are not historical inhabitants of Sri lanka..?
How do u say u guys, cant u see many Lankans here dont approve what he says?
Yes. They are not. Majority of Tamils are immigrants.
Yeah.... people who have minority complex believe that they too are the historical inhabitants of this country. They do not want to believe they are immigrants.
Can you show any data supporting your point,?
According to Portuguese record's, after the conquest of Jaffna, the Nayakar King's of Madurai with Colonization in mind had sent ship's with nearly 2000 Tamil's to settle in Jaffna. Thank fully, these invader's were dealth with and in a few case's survived and returned back to India. These event's it is said were kept hidden from the ear's of the Madurai ruler's but assuming success and planing a second lot, it was then that the failure of their first mission was recited. Later during the Dutch period, to be precise around 1652-3. The Nayakar's got their chance.
After a devastating drought & in fighting amongst Nayakar Kings, we are told by many Dutch sources, that a slave could be bought for as low as a loaf of bread. If this is literally true or just terminology, is not the issue but certainly it shows the situation.
We are told by VOC record's and by Philip Bealdous, that with assitance of the Nayakar KIng's the first lot of 15,000 Tamil's were brought from Nagapattinam and settled into Jaffna. Throughout the next few year's a total of another 10,000. This is small, in comparrision to the Britisher's action's but it was the begining of the Tamil's in Jaffna.
And also,where do you think sinhalese came from..?Did they evolve separately in the island or they also immigrated from some place..If so,where from?Europe/China/India..?
Best is to go for a referendum.. While devolving power key issues of Land and Police must be kept with the central govt.. SL is too small of a land mass to differentiate the two.. Both the Muslim and Tamils of Indian origin are averse to devolving police and Land powers.. Only the Separatist Tamil diaspora, it's polity TNA and it's constituents in the North are demanding such.. @Mech..Don't get things mixed up on things you seem to have a very simplistic knowledge of the subject..
1517-Treaty between King Dharma Parakrama Bahu and the Portuguese Lawrence d'Almeida, confirms the all area's incl Jaffnapatnam, as apart of the Kotte Kingdom;
'Rightful Lord of the World, fortunate descendent of the Kings of Anu-Raja-Pura, the greatest of all on earth, scion of the Gods in this Island of Ceylon, Rightful Lord of the empire of Cota and of the Realms of Jafanapatao and Candea, God of War in conquering Rebels who are more like women than men, Rightful heir of the Kings of Dambaden and of the greak peak of Adam; preserver of the law of Budduas, vanquisher of the Kings styled Ariavansa, for they are traitors; descendant of the son of the Sun with star on he head; true Master of all sciences, Legitimate descendant of Vigia-Bau, I., the Emperor Paracrame-Bau, in the hear of my Empire 40 years called Segara, am content and it pleases me mightily to give to the Kings of Portugal each year as tribute 400 bahars of Cimmamon, and 20 rings set with rubies that are found in this Island of Ceylao, and 10 tusked elephants on Condition that the present Governor and the Viceroys and Governors who shall succeed Lopo Soarez de Albergaria in the State of India, shall be obliged to favour me and assist me against mt enemies as the Vassal that I am of the Crown of Portugal.'
1580-Dharmapala's Donation Treaty to the King of Portugal;
The states over which the King of Kotte claimed suzerainty were the Kingdoms of Sitawaka, of the {Seven) Korales, of Candea or the hill-country, and of Jaffna, and also the principality of the Four Korales There also were various Vanniyarships, who were bound bo by tribute to the king of Kotte. These were the two Panamas; Yala; Wellewaya Kosgama; Wellassa; Palugama; Batticaloa; Kottiyar; Trincomalee: and Puttalam. This last and Yala were held by several Vanniyars, Palugama by two, the others by one each. In the kingdom of Kotte itself were three Disawas, one over Matara, one over the Adikariya of Denawaka with the Agras or gem-pits of Sabaragamuwa. and one over the Adikariya of Nuwarakalawiya, the country forming the western half of the present North Central Province and stretching according to our document from Puttalam to Mannar. Apart from this last Adikariya or jurisdiction, the immediate possessions of Kotte are given as 221 korales, which included the south-west corner of the North-Western Province, with a small exception the whole of the Western and Southern Provinces as far as the Walawe River, and that part of the Ratnapura District to the south of the Kalu-ganga with the great villages Gilimale and Bambarabotuwa. The small exception referred to is the half of Hewagam Korale, which belonged to Sitawaka.
1766-The Dutch-Sinhalese Treaty in 1766(Clauses 3, 5, 6 & 16) and the English-Sinhalese Treaty in 1815 (when total sovereignty was ceded to the British) easily illustrate that the East and the inland parts of Jaffna, were completely under Sinhalese sovereignty.
Clauses;
3. And of all the shores not then occupied by it, to wit on the West from Kaimelle (Maha Oya) to Jaffna district, and on the East from the border of that district to the Waluwe River, to a width of one Singhalese mile more or less, as may be most convenient from the position of hills and rivers;
5. The Coy to recognise the King as Sovereign of the rest of the island;
6. The Coy for love of peace to restore all the lands recently captured, except the shores;
16. Such timber to be delivered at Trincomale and Battikaloa as the Coy may need;
History of Jaffna
If their were independent Tamil nation on North and East why these 2 European nations forgot to mention them?
Why SL Tamils do not have a Brahmin cast in their cast system?
This facts indicate that Tamils were not independent nation in SL but mere immigrants during Dutch era to cultivate tobacco.
Jaffna Tamil
All of us are immigrants from Africa. If the majority of the Tamils are immigrants what about those minority (according to ur statement)? Mahavamsa itself says there were Tamil settlements from 12 AD. That is long before, English came to England, and Swedish came to Sweden, right? U cant simply say a people living here from 12 AD as immigrants.Yes. They are not. Majority of Tamils are immigrants.
Yeah.... people who have minority complex believe that they too are the historical inhabitants of this country. They do not want to believe they are immigrants.
I think the gov and the defence establishment worry giving them police powers. Ultimately they will. But it requires confidence building in defence establishment from the side of the tamil politicians.REGional Control of police is the best way to maintain security and stability. In India we have a 2 tier system- Primary police functions are with state and centre has CRPF, BSF and Army that can intervene if needed (they rarely do). The same is the case with smaller countries like the UK.
1517-Treaty between King Dharma Parakrama Bahu and the Portuguese Lawrence d'Almeida, confirms the all area's incl Jaffnapatnam, as apart of the Kotte Kingdom;
'Rightful Lord of the World, fortunate descendent of the Kings of Anu-Raja-Pura, the greatest of all on earth, scion of the Gods in this Island of Ceylon, Rightful Lord of the empire of Cota and of the Realms of Jafanapatao and Candea, God of War in conquering Rebels who are more like women than men, Rightful heir of the Kings of Dambaden and of the greak peak of Adam; preserver of the law of Budduas, vanquisher of the Kings styled Ariavansa, for they are traitors; descendant of the son of the Sun with star on he head; true Master of all sciences, Legitimate descendant of Vigia-Bau, I., the Emperor Paracrame-Bau, in the hear of my Empire 40 years called Segara, am content and it pleases me mightily to give to the Kings of Portugal each year as tribute 400 bahars of Cimmamon, and 20 rings set with rubies that are found in this Island of Ceylao, and 10 tusked elephants on Condition that the present Governor and the Viceroys and Governors who shall succeed Lopo Soarez de Albergaria in the State of India, shall be obliged to favour me and assist me against mt enemies as the Vassal that I am of the Crown of Portugal.'
1580-Dharmapala's Donation Treaty to the King of Portugal;
The states over which the King of Kotte claimed suzerainty were the Kingdoms of Sitawaka, of the {Seven) Korales, of Candea or the hill-country, and of Jaffna, and also the principality of the Four Korales There also were various Vanniyarships, who were bound bo by tribute to the king of Kotte. These were the two Panamas; Yala; Wellewaya Kosgama; Wellassa; Palugama; Batticaloa; Kottiyar; Trincomalee: and Puttalam. This last and Yala were held by several Vanniyars, Palugama by two, the others by one each. In the kingdom of Kotte itself were three Disawas, one over Matara, one over the Adikariya of Denawaka with the Agras or gem-pits of Sabaragamuwa. and one over the Adikariya of Nuwarakalawiya, the country forming the western half of the present North Central Province and stretching according to our document from Puttalam to Mannar. Apart from this last Adikariya or jurisdiction, the immediate possessions of Kotte are given as 221 korales, which included the south-west corner of the North-Western Province, with a small exception the whole of the Western and Southern Provinces as far as the Walawe River, and that part of the Ratnapura District to the south of the Kalu-ganga with the great villages Gilimale and Bambarabotuwa. The small exception referred to is the half of Hewagam Korale, which belonged to Sitawaka.
1766-The Dutch-Sinhalese Treaty in 1766(Clauses 3, 5, 6 & 16) and the English-Sinhalese Treaty in 1815 (when total sovereignty was ceded to the British) easily illustrate that the East and the inland parts of Jaffna, were completely under Sinhalese sovereignty.
Clauses;
3. And of all the shores not then occupied by it, to wit on the West from Kaimelle (Maha Oya) to Jaffna district, and on the East from the border of that district to the Waluwe River, to a width of one Singhalese mile more or less, as may be most convenient from the position of hills and rivers;
5. The Coy to recognise the King as Sovereign of the rest of the island;
6. The Coy for love of peace to restore all the lands recently captured, except the shores;
16. Such timber to be delivered at Trincomale and Battikaloa as the Coy may need;
History of Jaffna
If their were independent Tamil nation on North and East why these 2 European nations forgot to mention them?
Why SL Tamils do not have a Brahmin cast in their cast system?
This facts indicate that Tamils were not independent nation in SL but mere immigrants during Dutch era to cultivate tobacco.
Jaffna Tamil
Indeed Sinhalese DNA are made up of immigrants from India. It's just like Americans where you have a mix of lot of ethancities.
@humanfirst Tamils aren't native to Sri Lanka. Even people use the word "Tamil" we don't have official Tamil group called "Tamils" in SL. Official Tamil groups in SL are "Sri Lankan Tamils" and "Indian Tamils". Indian Tamils brought here by British in British era and now they are around 4% of SL population.
Official Tamil group "Sri Lankan Tamils" contain the Tamils who came from various periods in the history which is around 11% of SL population today. so all the south Indian Tamils in this category (before British era), there may be some percentage of oldest Tamils too. also who got mixed with local population.
the same thing can be said about the sinhala population, where british brought many people from South India who were later sinhalized.
And what abt these 'oldest Tamils' u mention? dont they have a right?
After all how does all these talk abt immigrants and who came first HELP SL at all? The way is to accept ALL the people living here irrespective of their language and religion. And Tamil has held an important place as a language in ancient SL even by sinhalese.
These problems has to be solved based on the current context cos that is what matters. SL is the homeland of all the people living here.
@HeinzG,
I guess u have nothing left to say on our debate on 13th...
All of us are immigrants from Africa. If the majority of the Tamils are immigrants what about those minority (according to ur statement)? Mahavamsa itself says there were Tamil settlements from 12 AD. That is long before, English came to England, and Swedish came to Sweden, right? U cant simply say a people living here from 12 AD as immigrants.
Minority complex? They are a minority so they can have a minority complex. And don’t use words u don’t understand.
I think the gov and the defence establishment worry giving them police powers. Ultimately they will. But it requires confidence building in defence establishment from the side of the tamil politicians.
The document of sinhalese king promising to pay tribute to portuguese in return for being recognised as portuguese vassal in sinhalese and assistance against enemies,does not disprove the presence of tamils in Sri Lanka.
Most probably the tamils were his enemies against whom he was requesting portuguese assistance
considering the fact that it was portuguese who ousted tamil king Cankili II of Jafna kingdom in 17th century..
Although Sankili was a Tamil on his mother's side, he did not make Tamil the official language of Jaffna. For all purposes, Sinhala was considered to be the official language throughout the island, including the Jaffna Peninsula. When Sankili's conduct became intolerable, the people of Jaffna (mostly Sinhalese) petitioned the Portuguese Viceroy in Goa, asking him to replace Sankili with a Sinhalese Prince 'because Jaffna belonged to the Kingdom of Kotte'. This led to the genocide of the Sinhalese inhabitants of Jaffna by Sankili. "After the massacre of the Christians, Sankili's, insane fury longed for more victims and he fell upon the Buddhists of Jaffna who were all Sinhalese. He expelled them beyond the limits of the country and destroyed their numerous places of worship," says Rasanayagam, quoting Yalpana Vaipava Malai."
And in this document he not only claims sri lanka but to be "rightful lord of the world"..!!wTF!!!
Apart from all that there are a lot of undeniable historical documents indicating the tamil presence in lanka which includes Tamil Chola reign over the islands,The Aryacakravarti dynasty,Portuguese documents stating the ousting of Cankilli II,his execution in goa,and many many more..
අනේ ගොන් මෝඩයෝ මම සිංහලෙන් දැම්මේ අර යක්කුන්ට තේරෙන්නේ නැතිවෙන්න. දැන් තෝ දීපු උත්තරෙන් පැහැදිලි මම මොනාද කිව්වේ කියලා.
ලංකාවේ යුද්ධය දිනීමට ප්රාධාන වශයෙන් ම බලපෑ සාධකය වන්නේ ඉන්දියාවයි. ඉන්දියාවට අවශ්යu නම් ලංකාව දෙකඩ කිරීමට හැකිය. අපි මෙතන මොන ටෝක් දැම්මත් ඇත්ත ඒකයි. 1987 වන තෙක් ඉන්දියාව කොටින්ට සපෝට්. 13 වන සංශෝධනය නිසා තමයි ඉ. සාම සාධක හමුදාව ගෙන්නුවේ. ඒක තමයි 13 හින්දා ලංකාවට ලැබුණු හොඳම දේ. ඊට පස්සේ කොටි හා ඉ අතර යුද්ධයක් ඇතිවීමත් ඉ සෙබළු මැරුණු නිසාත් අවසානයේ රජීව් ඝාතනයත් නිසාත් තමයි ඉ කොටින්ට එරෙහි වුණේ. අද කොටින්ට විරුද්ධව කතා කරන ඉ මාධ්යෙයව්දියෝ පවා ඉස්සර සෑහෙන කොටි හිතවාදීන්. නමුත් රජීව් ඝාතනය ඒ සියල්ල වෙනස් කළා. කවදාවත් ඉන්දියාවේ සහයෝගය කොටින්ට නොලැබෙන තරමට ඒක වෙනස් කළා. ඒක තමයි යුද්ධයේ ප්රෙතිඵලය වෙනස් කිරිමට මුලිකවම බලපෑවේ. 13 න් හම්බෙච්ච ප්ර්තිඵලයක් ඒක.
13න් ලංකාව දෙකඩ කිරීම වැළැක්වූ අතර එම සංශෝධනය ක්රි යාත්මක කරනවා නම් කොටින් ඊළම අත හැරිය යුතු උණා. නමුත් ප්රමභාකරන් ඊට එකඟ වූ නැති නිසා තමයි ඉ හා කොටි අතර යුද්දය පටන් ගත්තේ. ඒ දෙවෙනි වාසිය
13 ත් සමඟ ඉන්දියාව පළමු වතාවට ලංකාව බෙදීමට එරෙහි වුණා. ඒ 3 වෙනි වාසිය.
පසු කාලීන රජයන් මහින්ද පවා ලෝකයා ට කිව්වේ අපි මේ ගොල්ලන්ට විසඳුමක් දීලා (13) තියෙන්නේ නමුත් කොටින් ඒක පිලිගන්නේ නෑ කියලා . එතකොට ලංකා රජය විසඳුමක් දී තිබියදීත් යුද්ධය පවත්වා ගෙන යන ලෙස චෝදනා එල්ල වූයේ කොටින්ටයි. ඒක නිසා තමයි ඇමරිකාව ප්රමමුක ලෝකයා යුද්ධය නිම කරන්න ලංකාවට සහය දුන්නේ. ඒ 4 වෙනි වාසිය
අපි දැන් 13 ඉවත් කරලා ඉදිරියට යන්න ගියොත් අපි ලෝකයාට වෙච්ච පොරොන්දු මඟ හැර ගියා යයි ලෝකයා අපිට එරෙහි වේවි. සමහර විට ඊළමක් උදෙසා ජන මතය තල්ලු වෙන්නත් පුළුවන්. මතක තියා ගන්න ඉන්දියාව එරෙහි වුණේ කොටින් සිටින ඊළමකටයි. කොටින් නැති ඊළමකට නෙමේ. කොටින් නැති තැන, දෙමළ අය ලෝක අනුකම්පාව දිනා ගනිමින් සිටිනවා. ලංකාව බලය බෙදීමක් බැ කිව්වොත් ඒක ලංකාවට අවාසියි. අනික අපි ඉන්දියාවට පොරොන්දු වෙලාත් තියෙනවා. දැනටමත් ඒකට ජන මතය හැදෙමින් පවතිනවා.
13 නිසා තමයි ඩග්ලස් හා අනෙකුත් දෙමළ නායකයින් ඊළම අතහැරියේ. ඒ අය අපිට පසු කාලිනව, යුද්ධයටත් උපාය මාර්ගිකවත් වැදගත් වුණා. ඒ 5 වෙනි වාසිය. මේ තමයි සරල විදිහට කියනවා නම්. තමුන්ට තාමත් තේරෙන්නේ නැත්නම් දුක තමයි.
1. I am not a historian and I guess u too are not. So i really dont see a point in arguing over things we have very little knowledge of.
2. The bolded part says the kotte empire with realams, Jaffna and Kandy. I doubt whether king actually had power over these two kingdoms because Kotte was getting weak during these days with a resurgent Kandy.
3. The bolded part in what u posted suggest that both Jaffna and Kandy had some sort of autonomy within the kotte empire. The exact thing Tamils now a days ask from the present SL gov. If u want to make SL the way it was prior to colonial occupation, then u have to give some sort of autonomy and a power devolution to the people living there exactly the way sinhala kings did.
4. what is the point in talking about historical things when we have to bring abt a political system in the modern days? what we need is a system that answers grievences of the people living today. It is the PRESENT context that matters.
My God what is this absolutely beautiful script ?
Which language does it belong to ?