Lal Masjid cleric’s interview in burqa still a mystery

[Chak Bamu]

A declared Mullah supporter is accusing others for distorting historical PHACTS.

You cannot answer the treachery of Mawdoodi, and Madni and Mullah h@r@mi Azad and now you are asking others to provide proof to your phony questions.

I am just asking you to justify your sweeping assertions that have no factual basis. That is all. Why the name calling though? Just shows your mentality.

Calling me a 'declared Mullah supporter' is a Strawman that you apply to every one who questions you. I have a problem with how Musharraf used Lal Masjid situation and the associated blowback. But I doubt if you can bring yourself to see this. That is why I asked who made you a TT?

Pathetic argument. Sorry to say this on your face.

No problem. I am just gald that you exhibit your manners for all to see; only because someone dared question your wild allegations.

Obviously you are now a declared Talib-bozo supporter (even though you will run like heck by not accepting it).

Another STRAWMAN. Why should I accept your name calling. With manners like these one would think that a (Jr.) TT would be someone with a little forebearance and tact. But you are just shameless. That is why I keep wondering who made you a TT.

This is why I say Run Joe Run, Run Joe Run.

No you just say it to everyone around. That just shows your popularity on and off internet. Even Indian trolls laugh at you.

You do support Talib-bozos and their fanaticism. Don't you.

No, I have never supported TTP or any other terrorist groups working against our country. But unlike you, I do try to make an effort as to what they say and how they justify what they do. This just makes it easier to unravel their twisted narrative. But of course you would never understand this. You are to busy trolling people who question your audacity at twisting facts and take offence at your brazen name calling and blind accusations.

Making Strawman arguments and ascribing false positions is not going to make any difference. You can not hide your inadequacy by being nasty. Is it any wonder why I openly question howcome anybody saw you fit to label you a TT?

For the nth Time,

Lal Masjid's responsibility falls on those Black faced butchers who turned a holy place into weapon dump.

But as a fanatic supporter, you will not accept this clear fact.

Another strawman. From where do you get so much straw? Oh your head is full of it. Instead being a TT you should be called Strawman Tank. Better description.

By repeating this argument, you are implicitly saying that it is OK for ONE person to cause bloodshed in the name of the STATE just so he can last longer on the top. Frankly, if there were a democratic government, Lal Masjid would never have happened. Politicians did their best, but they were over-ruled. Just wait for the conclusion of the Commission and issue its report. It might get to the truth.

and continue your aayeeeen baaayeeen shaaayeen.

Anyone can see who is being evasive, nasty, rude, and resorting to useless strawman arguments instead of accepting that he habitually makes wild baseless claims. Indians took care of you in the beginning of this thread and you made excuses without apologizing. Now your ego is not allowing you to accept that you made a fool of yourself.

This what HuT guys do when British Police knocks at their doors. These HuT goons quickly turn into "Sir Ji" "Sir Ji" we are innocent we are innocent. Please please let us go,.

You might know better what goes on in Britain and what goes on with HuT. I would not know. Nor do I particularly care. I have seen a buch of HuT people in Lahore, and based on their blind angry and noisy rhetoric, I think they rather resemble you in demeanor and tactics. They are just as uncouth as you.

You say this black faced Mullah Aziz should not have been put in Burqa.

Did you even read the column I posted?

Instead Musharraf should have hanged him naked in front of Lal Masjid to show Talib-bozos that state of Pakistan can do to you what you Kuffar have been doing to the innocent citizens of Pakistan.

Yeah this Haram ka tukham should have been hanged upside down naked.
With head chopped off like they do in Islami jannat Saudi or the way they hang traitors in Iran.

Yawn..... again the emotional and grossly inadequate approach decorated with crass launguage. Some TT you are. Kuffar like me? Have you ever met me? Or do you belong to one of those cults that declare ordinary law-abiding, tax-paying, Muslims like me as Kafir? HuT use such Takfiri methods I presume and you are a carbon copy of just such people. You need to make up your mind dude. What are you going to call me for sure? HuT, Taliban, Beardo, Mullah-supporter, or Kafir

What a shame that in this day and age, someone is supporting terrorists so openly.

no wonder Pakistani NW area and Quetta has fallen to the Mullah dogs. All because of 5th columnist supporters in Pakistan and outside.


Sadly!

With your exteme opinions, language, and rhetoric, you support extremists by providing them excuses. I have already noted similarities between you and HuT nutjobs. You people are two sides of the same coin.

It is no co-incidence that it took Musharraf's idiocy to spread terrorism. Before Musharraf, no suicide bombings, no big cases of terrorism - during Musharraf regime, suicide bombings, and out of control terrorism. Musharraf did not have the ability to think about the consequences of his actions. It took someone like him to make the sort of mistakes that would fan extremism an facilitate spreading of terror. In the words on my erstwhile neighbor, retired Chief Secretary of Balochistan provincial government: "This man in on a mission to break Pakistan". I thought the old man had gone cukoo. But he was right. He uttered these words in 2006, and this is 2013. I have seen the truth in his words. You are the minion and supporter of an intellectually challenged woodman who had zero ability to think about his plans and actions. Benazir was right to give him a shutup call when he suggested Kargil to her in early 90s as a commando Major General.

When you support Musharraf, you are agreeing with him and his policies. You are agreeing to all that went wrong under his watch and you defend his idiocy. You are an extremist and you are the other side of the coin that says 'Taliban'. Without the likes of your they would not exist.

 

[batmannow]

Since you would not answer my questions, I will post them again.

You can use derogatory language, you can use Nadia Comaneci for obfuscation, you can put up straw man arguments, all that, but just answer my questions logically.

None of that is my concern in this argument with you. I take exception to your deliberately distorting historical facts. I know why to do it and this reply of yours is an indication. But no matter what tempts you, lying is never acceptable behavior.

Let me reiterate the problems I find with your posts:

1. You said that 99.99999 % of Mullahs were against Paksitan. You can not prove it. It is a historical fact that Ulema were divided on this issue. Nothing like what you paint it to be. You lied and do not accept that you did so. Just to put the record straight, Niaz sb. wrote about my first post: "You are historically correct". I have known Mr. Niaz for the last 7 years when he was an active contributor at PakDef. He is worth a hundred 'think tanks' like you. He is actually somebody and his opinion means something.

2. You assert that my first post on this topic was "5th grade sarkari school Mutala-e-Pakistan's lie infested book". I asked you to substatiate your assertion and you never got around to doing so, because that was another lie. I quoted facts that one does not find in course books or syllabus. But you can not admit that you were wrong.

3. You made an obscene assertion: "JuI and JI types were supposed to suck Hindu nationalists (HNs) thumb (and I say it to be polite, otherwise you know what I mean)". When I rightly pointed out the difference between Anti-Pakistan group of Deobandis and Maududi (founder of JI) perspective. You choose not to defend your assertion with anything remotely reasonable and just ignore my objection. Again you have chosen not to defend your assertion because it is a lie cooked up in your head.

4. I wondered why you used terminology employed by Bush and his neocon gang of murderers, and the best you could do was to mention that Bush was being used as a whipping boy.

5. I asked you to substantiate your assertion that Mullah's made an assasination attempt upon our Quaid. You have nothing to say about this, because again you were caught lying.

Do you think that you can defend Pakistan by lying? Do you think that lying, inventing facts, distorting history somehow makes you a defender of decency?

I am not a supporter of Taliban, I am just allergic to BS. And you are full of it.

Thus again a highly pertinent question: Who made you a think tank? How did you qualify? Is lying a necessary qualification for being a think tank? You ought to get a sitara-e-Jurrat for your mulish stubborness when caught lying.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/social...view-burqa-still-mystery-4.html#ixzz2L8QdbXR2



So what do you want to discuss by bringing this to this topic?
Number of people killed? More died in Lal Masjid.
Identity of who did it? LeJ, they accepted responsibility. Musharraf should accept responsibility for Lal Masjid.
Are you sad that Musharraf is not ruling? I am not, there would be even greater bloodshed. He put Balochistan and FATA on fire. He would have made more blunders.

Any more worthless tangents on this situation?

even without knowledge, you try to impress peoples on PDF?
just check who was the frist one to call militry in baluchistan?
LeJ been called punjabi talibans, dont you know? i think you dont know!
this forum is not about, anti-musharaf or pro -musharaf bt, its not a heaven for extermists either?
learn & grow up, on PDF?
cause its not ezy!

 

[batmannow]

Shot schoolgirl Malala inspires Pakistani students
AFP | 26th October, 2012 0

Pakistani girls display a poster regarding Malala Yousafzai. — AP File Photo

PESHAWAR: The courage of schoolgirl Malala Yousafzai has renewed Pakistani students’ determination to learn despite the poor state of the country’s education system, undermined by poverty and under attack from militants.

The 15-year-old is recovering in a British hospital after the gunmen of the outlawed Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) shot her in the head in a cold-blooded murder attempt for daring to promote the right of girls to go to school.

The October 9 attack came in Malala’s hometown Mingora in Swat, part of Pakistan’s restive northwestern province Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, where insurgents bitterly opposed to a secular curriculum, and girls’ education in particular, have destroyed hundreds of schools in recent years.

Militants have destroyed four schools in the last week alone, according to officials, two on Wednesday in Mohmand tribal district and two more in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa.

The provincial government says more than 700,000 students have been affected, though casualties are low as most school attacks happen at night when students are at home.

“The insurgents mostly target girl’s schools and order both teachers and students to stay inside their homes as per their version of Islamic teachings or face the dire consequences,” said provincial information minister Iftikhar Hussain.

Naseem Baigam, a teacher at the government-run Islamia Collegiate girls’ high school in Peshawar, the main city of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, told AFP the destruction of schools and the attack on Malala had frightened parents.

But students at the school said they were inspired by Malala, who rose to prominence with a blog for the BBC chronicling life under the local Taliban, the hardline Islamists who terrorised the picturesque Swat valley from 2007 until an army offensive in 2009.

“It is disappointing that Taliban are destroying schools,” Saba Riaz, a final year student, told AFP.

“Such attacks are disturbing but Malala has given us courage to fight for the cause of education.” Her friend Razia Khan agreed: “Girls will never be scared by such attacks. In any case we will continue our studies, even if they are destroying schools or attacking girls like Malala.”

But it is not only militancy that schools in Pakistan have to contend with. The nuclear-armed nation’s spending on education is tiny, less than 2.5 per cent of GDP, according to the UN children’s agency Unicef. Only nine countries in the world spend less on education.

Pakistan’s official literacy rate is 58 per cent, with less than half of women able to read and write, yet in 2011-12 the government’s spending on defense was more than 10 times greater than education.

The country of 180 million people languishes near the bottom of the world literacy list, 159th out of 184 countries categorised by the UN Development Programme.

A recent Unesco report said at least 5.1 million Pakistani children are out of school, 63 per cent of whom are girls.

Pakistan Social and Living Standards Measurement (PSLM), a government survey, found gender disparity in education across the country, but most severe in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa and Balochistan provinces.

In Kohistan district of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa just six per cent of students are girls, and in Balochistan’s Dera Bugti the figure falls to one per cent.

Poverty is also a factor. More than a fifth of the population is classed as poor by the government, though activists believe the figure could be closer to 30 per cent.

“People are getting poorer, that is making us more illiterate and more hungry. The girl child becomes the first casualty of poverty and illiteracy,”said Tauseef Ahmed Khan, of Karachi’s Urdu University.

Free and compulsory education is a right of Pakistani children enshrined in the constitution, but for many parents a child at school is a child not earning money, an estimated 3.3 million under-14s in Pakistan work.

“A poor family prefers to send a boy to school. Most families think educating girls is wasting money, which can be saved and spent on their marriages,” Zohra Yousuf, who heads the independent Human Rights Commission of Pakistan, said.

Girls often leave school young to join their parents in cottage industries and most poor girls are married off as teenagers.

But some parents are determined that their own children should have a different future, and see Malala as a hero.

Mother-of-four Azra Shabbir, now 32, was just 14 when her father married her off, forcing her to leave school and work with her husband in a shoe factory.

“I have two girls, both are in colleges like their brothers. I want to see them literate, see them prosperous no matter how much hard work I have to do for this,” she said with a glint of hope in her eyes.

“Our poverty haunts us like Taliban, but we can fight against it, like Malala did against Taliban,” she smiled.
http://dawn.com/2012/10/26/shot-schoolgirl-malala-inspires-pakistani-students/

 

[FaujHistorian]

even without knowledge, you try to impress peoples on PDF?
just check who was the frist one to call militry in baluchistan?
LeJ been called punjabi talibans, dont you know? i think you dont know!
this forum is not about, anti-musharaf or pro -musharaf bt, its not a heaven for extermists either?
learn & grow up, on PDF?
cause its not ezy!

yaara batman,

This guy is stuck on a pathetic anti-Pakistan anti-state stance.

His Islamism is kind similar to the way my old and poor relatives in Bihar.

I wish him well even though he is hell bent on the destruction of Pakistan.

His support for Islamism, terrorism is just sickening.

Sadly!

 

[Chak Bamu]

even without knowledge, you try to impress peoples on PDF?
just check who was the frist one to call militry in baluchistan?
LeJ been called punjabi talibans, dont you know? i think you dont know!
this forum is not about, anti-musharaf or pro -musharaf bt, its not a heaven for extermists either?
learn & grow up, on PDF?
cause its not ezy!

OK, I have no knowledge. Why do you not correct my lack of knowledge by answering questions?

You are a pro-Musharraf extremist and defend him and his actions at all costs. So I suppose this forum in not for 'extremists' like me. It is for extemists like you.

You believe in conspiracies and can not support your claims. I make claims only when I can support them. Big difference. Shows who needs growing up more.

 

[batmannow]

yaara batman,

This guy is stuck on a pathetic anti-Pakistan anti-state stance.

His Islamism is kind similar to the way my old and poor relatives in Bihar.

I wish him well even though he is hell bent on the destruction of Pakistan.

His support for Islamism, terrorism is just sickening.

Sadly!

new born cadet, need hard kick butt training, keep him in training, brigadier!
thats your job, isnt it?
i know , i faced a lot of them, & you see still, doing it!

 

[Chak Bamu]

yaara batman,

This guy is stuck on a pathetic anti-Pakistan anti-state stance.

His Islamism is kind similar to the way my old and poor relatives in Bihar.

I wish him well even though he is hell bent on the destruction of Pakistan.

His support for Islamism, terrorism is just sickening.

Sadly!

Looking down on relatives openly just shows you are ashamed of your family. Smart choice of words and noble thoughts.

Again, you can not keep yourself from acting as a rude and base name caller. Do not wish me well, educate yourself instead. Think a little before making wild claims. That might fix your foot-in-mouth disease.

 

[FaujHistorian]

.......

It is no co-incidence that it took Musharraf's idiocy to spread terrorism. Before Musharraf, no suicide bombings, no big cases of terrorism - during Musharraf regime, suicide bombings, and out of control terrorism....

typical statement! typical propaganda standard line from the supporters of Talib-bozos.

Typical!



Oh dear dear dear poster,

Learn a bit. Will ya? learn a bit.

Terrorism started in 1952 thanks to the maadar pidaar Aazad black faced Mullah Mawdoodi. when his goons mercilessly attacked our fellow Pakistani-Ahmadis, their property and their businesses. And us the majority in pak stood around watching their houses burn, their businesses looted. All thanks to black faced Mawdoodi.

Obviously now we the majority are under threat too. Why not! We are complicit in Mawdoodi's terror by not speaking up against his cruel acts.

Obviously you know nothing about terrorism in Pakistan by your favorite Islamo-fascists.

Go and read a bit please. Chalta maal Islamist history you learned from darkened hojras of mad house madrassahs is not going to cut it. Thank you.



FYI! Musharraf is no saint, and he is not getting my vote in the elections.


But your equating Musharraf to Talib-bozos, clearly shows utter lack of intellectual honesty shown by so many supporters of JI, JuI and worse for the Talib-bozos and black faced black faced mardood Mullah Aziz braathran may they rot in hell.


I have seen with my own eyes how these Mulalh bozos and their b@stard father-figure Sufi -bud-muash (of infamous TNSM) from swat-malakand.

They all wanted to spread the tentacles of Wahabi inspired state within a state using whatever methods they could use. First they used simple terror with dandas, then they used AK-47s (see the damn pictures posted in this thread. Again Again Again). Suicide bombing was just an extension of their nefarious terrorist deeds.

But you keep on parroting anti-state propaganda and shaking your head sideways "main na maaanoon, main na maanoon".

Going in circles.

With no fing concept of a Pakistani state. No fing concept.



Sadly!

Run joe run, run joe run.

p.s. This is terrible to see how Pakistani forums are being used to spread anti-Pakistan and anti-army propaganda. Terrible indeed. We should be mourning the brave Haroon Islam's murder at the hand of Talib-bozos, we should be siding with his two little kids, his young wife who has no husband left.

Instead people come here to post things in favor of the killers, the murderers of our martyr Haroon Islam.

 

[batmannow]

dead terrorists of lal masjid!

who is this? is there is a toy gun hanging on his shoulder?
hummm, must be given by musharaf?

 

[batmannow]

 

[batmannow]

 

[FaujHistorian]

Batman bro!

Thanks for posting all this.

Unfortunately all this will promptly be ignored by the supporters of Talib-bozos, and the HuT goons.

They will continue to paint this mardood Aziz as some new prophet of theirs. Unfortunately.


peace

 

[Chak Bamu]

So more red herrings. The newest one being the Anti-Ahmadi agitation. I am not getting into Khatm-e-Naboowat debate with you. You can not answer simple questions about your blanket statements. That is clear.

Reference to Masjid Zarrar is hardly appropriate. You are now using Quran to prop Murderer Musharraf's case?

I am not supporting Lal Masjid insiders. I just have a question about the way this incident was USED by Musharraf. You and @FaujHistorian have been running in circles making unfounded claims and blanket statement just so you can support Musharraf and shift the blame from him.

 

[batmannow]

So more red herrings. The newest one being the Anti-Ahmadi agitation. I am not getting into Khatm-e-Naboowat debate with you. You can not answer simple questions about your blanket statements. That is clear.



Reference to Masjid Zarrar is hardly appropriate. You are now using Quran to prop Murderer Musharraf's case?

I am not supporting Lal Masjid insiders. I just have a question about the way this incident was USED by Musharraf. You and @FaujHistorian have been running in circles making unfounded claims and blanket statement just so you can support Musharraf and shift the blame from him.

you arent supporting Lal Masjid insiders?
yes you couldnt support those terrorists cause you know they were wrong , & cause they were terrorists, who didnt wanted to lay down thier weapons?
its not only MUSHARAF who went to lal masjid alone & killed those terrorists, it was whole govt?
it was QAZI HUSSIAN, it was mulana FAZLU, & IMAM -e-KABA each & everyone tried thier best, but terrorists were hell bent to action?
so in the end they got wht they deserved!
your blame is a stupid prapoganda projected by some key terrorist sociao-political, groups who , were affraid of musharaf rule then & now of his return!thus they are trying hard to use lal masjid issue to at least block his way?
me & my hounrable mate FaujHistorian, we are dead straight till now, but its you having no sense like terrorsits of lal masjid!
what i tried to put of reference of quran , is for those who have a thing called brains, its up to you to check , if you got one or not?

 

[KS]

Punjab and Kashmir were the main places that suffered ethnic cleansing by Hindus in the East and my Muslims in the West.

Lets not forget that the first incidences of rioting were reported in West Punjab on the Hindus and Sikhs and the retaliation was felt in East Punjab.

So In Punjab there were two secular parties run by Muslims. Unionist party and Agriculturist party.

Even though in 1945 elections ML won 80+ seats, Muslim vote was divided between ML, Congress, and secular parties like Unionist party and Agriculturist parties.

Again cherry picking and twisting facts.

The Hindus of undivided Punjab were mostly of the business class and very few were involved in agriculture. SO the Agriculturist party was dominated by Muslims and it was no surprise that Hindus did not vote for it as they had no connection it.

In the case of Unionists, a major turn-off to their appeal was their support to the British. Why would people who were struggling for independence from the British support a party that was openly supporting the Brits ? Also like the Agriculturist party, the Unionist party was mostly made up by the feudal landlords of Punjab who were doing good under the British and who feared a collapse of their feudal system once the British leave.

But Hindus did the vote block and went with only Congress.

Hindus were a minority in undivided Punjab and they voted for the party that they felt would look after their interests just like Muslims voted overwhelmingly for Muslim league in areas they were in minority.

The real comparison with hindus voting en-bloc to congress in Punjab would be to study the Muslim voting patters in areas in which they were in minority. And that study reveals they voted overwhelmingly for one party - Muslim League.

So my request- stop twisting facts and extending the truth to fit your version of sarkari history. People are aware enough to call out that.