Kazakhstan protests

[beijingwalker]

1842 Treaty of Nanking gave Hong Kong Island to UK forever.
1860 Treaty of Peking gave Kawloon to UK forever
1860 Treaty of Peking also gave Russia Outer Manchuria. (1 million square kilometres)

UK didn't have to give it back, and all of NATO would have supported them, but they gave it back.

Are you serious? all NATO would fight a war over Hong kong for UK aganist China? Did they just fight Korea in 1950? China didn't take over Hong kong was not because China can't, it's because China needed a trading base to the west, your textbooks must be so messed up and don't even teach your some common sense.

 

[thetutle]

Hong Kong had to be returned to China because it is a city full of 7 million Han Chinese, it is part of China's core. Same reason why China will never let Taiwan go.

The only reason it had 7 million Chinese there is because the British allowed them to live on sovereign British territory of Hong Kong and Kawloon. Had the British been like the Russians they would have kicked out the few Chinese that lived there and settled it with English people, like Russia did in Outer Manchuria.

Britain is not like that and prefers to trade than ethnically cleanse territories and keep them as their own.

Are you serious? all NATO would fight a war over Hong kong for UK aganist China? Did they just fight Korea in 1950?

Some nato would help but China would still win, but the occupation would never be recognised by the world. It was British Sovereign territory until they graciously decided to give it back to China. Britains right to Hong Kong is no less than Russias right to Vladivostok, They came out of the same treaty.

China didn't take over Hong kong was not because China can't, it's because China needed a trading base to the west, your textbooks must be so messed up and don't even teach your some common sense.

China didn't take Hong Kong and Kawloon because it was sovereign British land until 1997.

 

[beijingwalker]

Some nato would help but China would still win, but the occupation would never be recognised by the world. It was British Sovereign territory until they graciously decided to give it back to China. Britains right to Hong Kong is no less than Russias right to Vladivostok, They came out of the same treaty.
China didn't take Hong Kong and Kawloon because it was sovereign British land until 1997.

Such a foolish claim, I really doubt if most Brits share this idea. China can take Hong kong and Macau right after 1949, China didn't was not because China can't fight UK or Portugal, it's because China need them as windows to the west for trade and exchange of information.

 

[thetutle]

Such a foolish claim, I really doubt if most Brits share this idea. China can take Hong kong and Macau right after 1949, China didn't was not because China can't fight UK or Portugal, it's because China need them as windows to the west for trade and exchange of information.

I dont see why it is relevant if British people share this view. The fact is, a historical and actual fact, that the treaty of Peking gave Hong Kong and Kawloon to the British as their sovereign territory and at the same time gave the land where Vladivostok is to Russia on the same terms.

I dont knew what the government is teaching you in China but what I say is a fact that can easily be proven if you read the Treaty of Peking.

Now, China could have invaded Hong Kong in 1949, or in 1969 or 1909 or even in 1869 soon after the Treat was signed. As it can also invade Italy or Poland. The reason it wont is because it is not their land.

and there was no need for UK to return Hong Kong Island and Kawloon. Only the new territories. UK did it to avoid the Chinese sitting off their water once the new territories were handed back.

Had there been no agreement, UK and NATO would defend the island as it would defend all other British islands like Diego Garcia. etc. And yes China might have won that war, but at what cost. you really don't think UK would defend its sovereign territory?

 

[MH.Yang]

Some small area? hmmmm. During the opium wars Russia ganged up against china and invaded an area of 600,000 sq kilometres. And china was forced to accept it under the treaty of Aigun.

And then 2 years later The Treaty of Peking gave a further 400,000 sq kilometres of outer Manchuria to Russia.

As a part of the treaty, Hong Kong and Kowloon was given to British forever. Just like Manchuria was given to Russia forever.

thats 1 million square kilometres taken by Russia and not given back yet.




Well if china is happy with its borders, thats fine. I hope they don't go to war. But given that chinas GDP is 10 times that of Russia and in our life will be 20 times a big as Russia, I just think its inevitable they will demand from Russia what they demanded from UK. A reversal of that unfair treaty. You might be right and they might let Russia keep it. its up to them I suppose. It does not bother me,




right, ok.

You said so much, but have you considered China's population?

We are facing a serious population problem, the population of Northeast China is decreasing every year.
We even lack enough population in our own land, why are we going to capture Siberia?

Fair points. I don't think we dispute that. You could also argue that Japan today is not an expansionist power as well. China should make peace with Japan and make concessions on that silly small barren rock/island spoiling relations between you and Japan. A silly rock that has been used by CCP now for decades to Stoke nationalism when it sees fit.
If China could make peace with Russia and recognise Russian sovereignty over former Chinese territories bigger than the whole of Japan, why can't you guys do the same with Japan over a small barren rock?

That's not a small stone.
There are only two channels from China's coastal waters to the Pacific Ocean, one is Hakone Strait, the other is bus Strait.
So we will not give up Diaoyu Island and Huangyan Island. Our nuclear submarines do not allow enemy surveillance equipment on these two islands.

 

[beijingwalker]

I dont see why it is relevant if British people share this view. The fact is, a historical and actual fact, that the treaty of Peking gave Hong Kong and Kawloon to the British as their sovereign territory and at the same time gave the land where Vladivostok is to Russia on the same terms.

I dont knew what the government is teaching you in China but what I say is a fact that can easily be proven if you read the Treaty of Peking.

Now, China could have invaded Hong Kong in 1949, or in 1969 or 1909 or even in 1869 soon after the Treat was signed. As it can also invade Italy or Poland. The reason it wont is because it is not their land.

and there was no need for UK to return Hong Kong Island and Kawloon. Only the new territories. UK did it to avoid the Chinese sitting off their water once the new territories were handed back.

Had there been no agreement, UK and NATO would defend the island as it would defend all other British islands like Diego Garcia. etc. And yes China might have won that war, but at what cost. you really don't think UK would defend its sovereign territory?

You are so delusional if you think China can't take over Hong kong and Macau from UK and Portugal after 1949, Did China care about NATO or even UN back then? China sent troops to Korea to fight UN. Nato will fight for UK over Hong kong? they didn't even fight for you in Egypt , how about Falkland Islands ？Did any nato countries fight for you? you are living in your dreams.

 

[Paul2]

13:00 - old pres, head of state security, and their families arrested on charge of high treason

 

[beyond2018]

13:00 - old pres, head of state security, and their families arrested on charge of high treason

Interesting, the situation now looks more like the new president (with Russia behind) VS the old president (with Turkey behind), if this is true, how should some Kazakh elites who hate Russia and the old president choose?

 

[thetutle]

You are so delusional if you think China can't take over Hong kong and Macau from UK and Portugal after 1949, Did China care about NATO or even UN back then? China sent troops to Korea to fight UN.

China didn't even have nukes in 1949 and lost 10's of millions to starvation in the late 60's. And you think it was capable of taking Sovereign British territory. Now that delusional. And take the island under what pretext? that UK stole it at the same time Russian stole Vladivostok. come on, if you could have taken it you would have taken it. Like you took over Tibet.

In 40 years time people will be saying China could have take over Taiwan anytime. Well here we are now and can you take Taiwan? Probably not, and if you do, it will be at a massive cost. When do you think China became capable of taking over Taiwan? 1970? 2010?

Nato will fight for UK over Hong kong? they didn't even fight for you in Egypt , how about Falkland Islands ？Did any nato countries fight for you? you are living in your dreams.

I am a Bosnian so technically NATO countries did fight for me briefly in 1995. But thats beside the point. Any British sovereign territory that gets attacked will be defended by USA, Australia, Canada and New Zealand if necessary. And probably some other nato countries. UK Does not need Slovenia or Luxembourg to defend it.

Argentina was a joke, UK took back its islands very easily, if it became necessary, all the above mentioned would come to their assistance.

 

[thetutle]

You said so much, but have you considered China's population?

We are facing a serious population problem, the population of Northeast China is decreasing every year.
We even lack enough population in our own land, why are we going to capture Siberia?

Thats a good excuse, works for me. Sounds good to Russia too. China is too smart to waste its time on taking back territory it can not take back. I accept that. But just remember, Russia took 1 million sq kilometres form you. thats the size of Western Europe. And west has taken nothing from you.

 

[MH.Yang]

China didn't even have nukes in 1949 and lost 10's of millions to starvation in the late 60's. And you think it was capable of taking Sovereign British territory. Now that delusional. And take the island under what pretext? that UK stole it at the same time Russian stole Vladivostok. come on, if you could have taken it you would have taken it. Like you took over Tibet.

In 40 years time people will be saying China could have take over Taiwan anytime. Well here we are now and can you take Taiwan? Probably not, and if you do, it will be at a massive cost. When do you think China became capable of taking over Taiwan? 1970? 2010?



I am a Bosnian so technically NATO countries did fight for me briefly in 1995. But thats beside the point. Any British sovereign territory that gets attacked will be defended by USA, Australia, Canada and New Zealand if necessary. And probably some other nato countries. UK Does not need Slovenia or Luxembourg to defend it.

Argentina was a joke, UK took back its islands very easily, if it became necessary, all the above mentioned would come to their assistance.

It seems that you don't know about the Korean War. In 1950, we defeated the United Nations led by the USA.

Korean War - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

As for Britain, we have never respected it. The PRC was founded in 1949. We fought the civil war and shelled British warships in 1949.

Amethyst incident - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

BTW: You think China dare not attack Hong Kong? Those who think China dare not do it have the same ending, such as MacArthur, Nehru…

 

[beyond2018]

Lol Good thing you are going to the past to justify your current policy with Japan, I see this mindset alot with Asians .
Why not use that on Russia as well?lol Use the past Russia to also make your policy with them today. After all, they were an expansionist imperial power who caused so much harm and loss of territory to China as well . In fact more so than Japan, if anything funny enough China hasn't really lost any territory to Japan whatsoever , same can't be said of Russia.
So why not use that your logic towards both countries ? Or does it only apply to your East Asian neighbour Japan and not European Russia ?

After all, the world is all about strength. The reality is that we can’t handle Russia and Japan, and Russia is now a friend of China. Therefore, we can only choose the UK and Portugal. Whether it’s taking back Hong Kong or in the Korean War, the UK was beaten by the China has been humiliated twice, I'm sorry, I hope the strong British gentleman can teach the CCP a hard lesson! To prove the strength of the British Empire.

hey be brave

 

[retaxis]

Thats a good excuse, works for me. Sounds good to Russia too. China is too smart to waste its time on taking back territory it can not take back. I accept that. But just remember, Russia took 1 million sq kilometres form you. thats the size of Western Europe. And west has taken nothing from you.

You realise outer mongolia and outer manchuria is not traditional han chinese land. It was briefly taken by Manchurians and then taken by Russians. You act like they stole Beijing and Shanghai. You need to learn Chinese history kid.

 

[thetutle]

It seems that you don't know about the Korean War. In 1950, we defeated the United Nations led by the USA.

Well if you attacked Hong Kong you would have the same success as you did in Korea. Lost a bunch of people and pushed back to the font lines where you started. Just like in Korea. I am glad your leaders thought the same as me and did not bother repeating Korea.

You realise outer mongolia and outer manchuria is not traditional han chinese land. It was briefly taken by Manchurians and then taken by Russians. You act like they stole Beijing and Shanghai. You need to learn Chinese history kid.

I know its not Chinese land anymore. Its Russian land and all 1 million sq kilometres will stay Russia just as was agreed during the Opium wars. A fair outcome you would agree right?

 

[retaxis]

Well if you attacked Hong Kong you would have the same success as you did in Korea. Lost a bunch of people and pushed back to the font lines where you started. Just like in Korea. I am glad your leaders thought the same as me and did not bother repeating Korea.



I know its not Chinese land anymore. Its Russian land and all 1 million sq kilometres will stay Russia just as was agreed during the Opium wars. A fair outcome you would agree right?

Considering it was only "manchurian" not han land for a few decades i think it is very fair do you not? Show me which actual Chinese dynasty from Xia to Ming did China dominate Siberia/Outer Manchuria and sent Han to populate those areas. Show me historical evidence that Han people ever migrated or used outer mongolia/manchuria besides Manchurians occupying it for a few years then handing it to the Russians.

Its actually insulting when you talk about mongolian and Manchurian land which was owned by mongols and manchurians as Chinese land. the Qing dynasty which occupied those lands were Manchurians not Han Chinese either. It seems your knowledge of Chinese history is very poor.