Kashmiri women are strictly forbidden from nose piercing

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Yaar, they say and show you on face how endogamous they are. Ham ne sirf Rajputon me shaadi karni hai.

But, if you check their family, you will find one uncle to have married outside family. Sometimes, a secret second marriage. That is enough.

Nope... none of them married outside..

 

[Multani]

I just asked my mum about this custom in Kashmiri families. She confirmed it. However she said that Kashmiris now are ok with nose piercings but weren't before. I asked her why and she said she didn't know, it was just the custom.

Nose piercing on the other hand is common among Paharis ( Punch, Kotli, Mirpur, Rajauri, Jammu ). Paharis are adamant about being Kashmiri. In the UK, where the majority of Pakistanis are Mirpuris, the Mirpuris claim to be Kashmiris.

So, there are Kashmiris with nose piercings. It could be a custom of Dardic Kashmiris. I will ask my grand-pa, who is an expert on these things, and will get back to you.

 

[Shahmir]

Imagine, why would dardic kashmiris leave Kashmir Valley, Doda/Kishtwar/Ramban/Neelum valleys and settle in GUJRANWALA in the middle of a much different looking group of people PUNJABIS?

Is it because Gujranwala is full of rice fields, and these Dardic Kashmiris love rice. And Gujranwala is also full of meat. While, the Kashmir valleys are small and have not had enough space for the rice and meat loving Kashmiris, as there would not be enough space for both cows and Kashmiris there.,

I think my family belong to wave of kashmiri settlers that came down to plane areas of Gujrat, Wazirabad, Daska and Gujranwala because their was a famine in early years of 1800s in kashmir valley due to prolonged winter snows for successive years and economically worst hit people were agriculturists from villages of kashmir valley, they just settled in these rural regions of punjab since these are the first plane agricultural areas of punjab that one encounters coming from north. And perhaps we had a good cultural compatibility with the local agricultural jatt tribes of these regions. And not all kashmiris are fair, some look like any regular punjabi and others look like middle eastern types. And yes the best rice in punjabi is indeed cultivated in Gujranwala and adjoining areas and since kashmiris agriculturists were good in rice cultivation this also helped their settlement in this rice growing areas of punjab

 

[Multani]

But Armstrong has already stated many times that his mother is from rajput tribe and I think in rajputs there is no such custom that forbids them from nose piercing.

@Armstrong

Well, Paharis claim to be Kashmiri, and they have a massive number of RAJAS ( Rajputs ) among them.

 

[Shahmir]

I just asked my mum about this custom in Kashmiri families. She confirmed it. However she said that Kashmiris now are ok with nose piercings but weren't before. I asked her why and she said she didn't know, it was just the custom.

My family is very strict in this custom , many girls in our family were even beaten if they accidently got their nose pierced, I told you this is the only custom that differentiates us from other tribes in punjab. My mother told me that those kashmiris whose women pierce their noses are not "pure" kashmiris , they are something else.

@Armstrong

Well, Paharis claim to be Kashmiri, and they have a massive number of RAJAS ( Rajputs ) among them.

Paharis and Gujjars are neighbors of "kashmiris" (Kashur speaking people) but they are technically NOT kashmiris, they share more with dogras of Jammu and pothoharis/hindkowans of Pothohar and Hazara. The closest ethnicity to "ethnic" kashur speaking kashmiris is dardic "Shins" (Shina speakers) of Gurez, Chilas, Gilgit and Kohistan. An ethnic kashur speaking kashmiri can make sense of "Shina" language and vice versa because Kashur language is a branch of Shina language that has been highly influenced by neighboring indic languages like pahari , hindko , sindhi and punjabi etc. Interestingly Saraiki and sindhi have more influence on kashur language than the neighboring punjabi which looks quite odd but tell that there was some interaction between sindhis and kashmiris in ancient times.

 

[Palao Eater]

My family is very strict in this custom , many girls in our family were even beaten even if they accidently got their nose pierced, I told you this is the only custom that differentiates us from other tribes in punjab. My mother told me that those kashmiris whose women pierce their noses are not "pure" kashmiris , they are something else.

Does your family have any other peculiar custom. I might be able to relate

Paharis and Gujjars are neighbors of "kashmiris" (Kashur speaking people) but they are technically NOT kashmiris, they share more with dogras of Jammu and pothoharis/hindkowans of Pothohar and Hazara. The closest ethnicity to "ethnic" kashur speaking kashmiris is dardic "Shins" (Shina speakers) of Gurez, Chilas, Gilgit and Kohistan. An ethnic kashur speaking kashmiri can make sense of "Shina" language and vice versa because Kashur language is a branch of Shina language that has been highly influenced by neighboring indic languages like pahari , hindko , sindhi and punjabi etc. Interestingly Saraiki and sindhi have more influence on kashur language than the neighboring punjabi which looks quite odd but tell that there was some interaction between sindhis and kashmiris in ancient times.

Sindhi has had influence on kashmiri? I did not know that. But I did feel a connection between the two cultures. Because sindhis and kashmiris are the only people from whom I have heard the word 'bitya' (meaning daughter) from.

 

[Multani]

My family is very strict in this custom , many girls in our family were even beaten even if they accidently got their nose pierced, I told you this is the only custom that differentiates us from other tribes in punjab. My mother told me that those kashmiris whose women pierce their noses are not "pure" kashmiris , they are something else.



Paharis and Gujjars are neighbors of "kashmiris" (Kashur speaking people) but they are technically NOT kashmiris, they share more with dogras of Jammu and pothoharis/hindkowans of Pothohar and Hazara. The closest ethnicity to "ethnic" kashur speaking kashmiris is dardic "Shins" (Shina speakers) of Gurez, Chilas, Gilgit and Kohistan. An ethnic kashur speaking kashmiri can make sense of "Shina" language and vice versa because Kashur language is a branch of Shina language that has been highly influenced by neighboring indic languages like pahari , hindko , sindhi and punjabi etc. Interestingly Saraiki and sindhi have more influence on kashur language than the neighboring punjabi which looks quite odd but tell that there was some interaction between sindhis and kashmiris in ancient times.

Mashallah, you are very knowledgeable Shahmir. Yes, I can give one posssible reason why Seraiki has more influence on Kashur than Majhi Punjabi of Lahore and Gujranwala

It is because of Sufi influence, along the Indus. Seraiki is a language born out of Sufi poetry and the massive Sufi families settled in South Punjab, people of the Indus. Descendants of Syed Ali Hamadani and his companions in Kashmir, and the Syed families settled in South Punjab and northern Sindh/ Derajats had strong links.

 

[Palao Eater]

Mashallah, you are very knowledgeable Shahmir. Yes, I can give one posssible reason why Seraiki has more influence on Kashur than Majhi Punjabi of Lahore and Gujranwala

It is because of Sufi influence, along the Indus. Seraiki is a language born out of Sufi poetry and the massive Sufi families settled in South Punjab, people of the Indus. Descendants of Syed Ali Hamadani and his companions in Kashmir, and the Syed families settled in South Punjab and northern Sindh/ Derajats had strong links.

Thankfully sufi influence is rapidly declining in Kashmir and the whole Islamic world.

Sufism today is shirk. Real sufis like Imam Ghazali, Imam Suyuti, Imam Nawawi, Ibn Hajr would be shocked at today's sufis.

 

[Shahmir]

Does your family have any other peculiar custom. I might be able to relate



Sindhi has had influence on kashmiri? I did not know that. But I did feel a connection between the two cultures. Because sindhis and kashmiris are the only people from whom I have heard the word 'bitya' (meaning daughter) from.

Not any special custom other than this particular custom, the rest of our life style is pretty much same as for any other punjabi in Gujranwala. Perhaps only that our family does consume more rice than an average person in Gujranwala but definitely not the way you said, our diet now is predominantly wheat based but with more than average intake of rice than other people in the area.

 

[Jaanbaz]

The tallest man in Kashmir is 6ft tall.

 

[Palao Eater]

Sayyid Muḥammad Anwar Shāh ibn Mu‘az̤z̤am Shāh Kashmīrī was a real Islamic scholar from the Kashmir Valley masha allah.

The tallest man in Kashmir is 6ft tall.

Rubbish. My mamoo is taller than that. Kashmiris are naturally tall.

 

[Shahmir]

The tallest man in Kashmir is 6ft tall.

The tallest pakistani that I met in germany during my 8 years studies was a kashmiri Batt/Butt from Rawalpindi. He was about 6' 3'' tall. In india the state with highest average height for both men and women is Kashmir according to an official survey of all the states of india. There was a thread in defence.pk about that check it, Average Heights of Indians for different states

 

[Multani]

Sayyid Muḥammad Anwar Shāh ibn Mu‘az̤z̤am Shāh Kashmīrī was a real Islamic scholar from the Kashmir Valley masha allah.



Rubbish. My mamoo is taller than that. Kashmiris are naturally tall.

Anwar Shah Kashmiri was a BIG SUFI

 

[Palao Eater]

@Shahmir

You said Kashmiris can understand shina speakers and shina speakers can understand kashmiri. How is that? And do people in Gilgit really look like ethnic kashmiris? This sounds interesting

Because that would mean that the most 'kashmiri' parts of the state after the valley are the Gilgit and Shina speaking areas.

Anwar Shah Kashmiri was a BIG SUFI

Yes but he was a proper good sufi. Not like sufis today who engage in literal grave worship.

 

[Multani]

Thankfully sufi influence is rapidly declining in Kashmir and the whole Islamic world.

Sufism today is shirk. Real sufis like Imam Ghazali, Imam Suyuti, Imam Nawawi, Ibn Hajr would be shocked at today's sufis.

This reeks of Al Maghrib Forum Salafism.

Imam al Ghazali radiallahu anhu , Imam Jalauddin Suyuti radiallahu anhu and Imam al Nawawi radiallahu anhu were MUJTAHIDS Fuqaha, and Muslims judge by their rulings as to declare what is shirk and what is not.

Imam Nawawi radiallahu anhu was Shaf'i Mujtahid.

Yes but he was a proper good sufi. Not like sufis today who engage in literal grave worship.

Proper good sufi? Lol

Anwar Shah Kashmiri sat 40 days in the grave sites of Sadaat.