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Kashmir a bilateral issue for India, Pakistan: UK's Labour Party leader

This is never about getting help to liberate Kashmir. The maim reason of diplomacy is when you make your move you have your back covered. Obviously UK will not help cause of our china aligned policy, still diplomacy is necessary for making a case in international institutions.




Not really. Pakistan just needs to become extremely powerful and advanced. Nothing more. So powerful that NO ONE can mess with us. World opinion and diplomacy mean nothing. The whole world was against the 2003 Iraq war, yet could not stop nearly 2 million Iraqis being genocided by the Americans over a 14 year period. Reason: americans are too powerful to be stopped.
 
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Not really. Pakistan just needs to become extremely powerful and advanced. Nothing more. So powerful that NO ONE can mess with us. World opinion and diplomacy mean nothing. The whole world was against the 2003 Iraq war, yet could not stop nearly 2 million Iraqis being genocided by the Americans over a 14 year period. Reason: americans are too powerful to be stopped.
I think the height of military power in this world is atomic bomb we have that and we are powerful so what now. It is never about power. It is always about making your enemy weak.
 
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Rishi as good as he is will never lead the conservatives for one obvious reason, he’s not white or Protestant. The U.K. has made huge strides for minority integration but the mass of the people will simply not accept a non ethnic Brit leading.

Disraeli was Jewish and became the PM of UK. He converted but was always considered Jewish.
British Jews have also been leaders of the opposition (Michael Howard for the Conservatives, Ed Miliband for Labour), Foreign Secretary (Rufus Isaacs, Malcolm Rifkind and David Miliband), Home Secretary (Herbert Samuel, Leon Brittan and Michael Howard) and Chancellor (Nigel Lawson and, as recently revealed, George Osborne).

The U.K. has made huge strides for minority integration but the mass of the people will simply not accept a non ethnic Brit leading.
As for fast promotion do remember he got the job due to Sajid Javid quitting, someone who mentored him.

When do you think it occurred to the British Awam to hand over the keys to the exchequer to a non-white, or today not just a non-white but a Hindu to boot. This is the second most powerful position in the British govt.

The third most powerful position, that of Home Secretary, is also held by a Indian Hindu. Who would have credited that a few years ago.

Sajid the pro-israeli non practising Muslim married to an Englishwoman inherited the post from the last conservative govt. No way was Bojo going to let Sajid run the exchequer. He made that crystal clear to Sajid, so clear in fact that Sajid had no option but to resign before he was fired.

The Law minister and Business ministers are also Indians

UK will have a non-white PM at some point in the future, probably a lot earlier than some imagine
 
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I think the height of military power in this world is atomic bomb we have that and we are powerful so what now. It is never about power. It is always about making your enemy weak.





Agreed but we still need to make Pakistan so powerful at least to the level of Israel that NO ONE on earth will dare mess with us. Power works. The rule of the jungle. The important thing is, our self determination and relationship with China can make this happen.
 
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Disraeli was Jewish and became the PM of UK. He converted but was always considered Jewish.
British Jews have also been leaders of the opposition (Michael Howard for the Conservatives, Ed Miliband for Labour), Foreign Secretary (Rufus Isaacs, Malcolm Rifkind and David Miliband), Home Secretary (Herbert Samuel, Leon Brittan and Michael Howard) and Chancellor (Nigel Lawson and, as recently revealed, George Osborne).

He converted, now how many Jews do you know? I grew up with the community (reform mostly), to do something like that was treasonous beyond belief. His yiddish character is open to debate but having converted and received the Anglican sacraments at 12, which he kept all his life faithfully it's hard to argue he was Jewish in the sense that all know. Very often it was his detractors and critics who delved into the area.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/150-y...-only-jewish-leader-changed-politics-forever/

Disraeli was the subject of vicious anti-Semitic attacks from his political opponents

You might want to read up on his life about how much importance he gave to his birth culture/nation;

he seemed to have little understanding of Jewish practices and made more than a few errors.

Disraeli’s writings were also seemingly contradictory. His novels occasionally featured Jewish characters that clearly drew on then common anti-Semitic depictions — his description of a Jewish money-lender, Levison, is particularly vulgar — while the Jewish wiseman Sidonia in “Coningsby” outlines a picture of Jews working through “subterranean agencies” to control world events that was later gleefully seized upon and repeated by virulent anti-Semites.

Although at times his writings were balanced referring to the birth right of jews;

At other times, however, Disraeli’s novels laud Jews and the superiority of “The Hebrew.” Christianity, one of them states, was founded by a Jew at a time when the English were mere “tattooed savages.”


But again people point out that this was a savage rebuke to his critics.

The article states this;

As Cesarani has suggested, Disraeli’s assertion of “Jewish rights based on Jewish superiority” may well have been meant as a signal to his Tory colleagues “that he would never surrender to their prejudices.”

He did champion the cause of British Jews to enter parliament, in part due to heritage and in part due to reform.
The best way to describe him was a half-way house for the two great Semitic traditions, and Disraeli himself alludes to this;

“the blank page between the Old and New Testaments.”


As for Jewish leaders being the leaders of the opposition do please look at the timelines, they were poor in comparison to the leaders they should have unseated and also seen as unelectable. Howard famously was shunned by Bush, something unthinkable for American/Anglo ties, even though the latter backed the invasion of Iraq. He lost the election in 2005. Miliband is even worse and was the butt of all jokes media and public wise.
Jewish folks holding strong positions in the past and now means nothing considering other minorities also have. It certainly isn't a prelude to becoming prime minister.








When do you think it occurred to the British Awam to hand over the keys to the exchequer to a non-white, or today not just a non-white but a Hindu to boot. This is the second most powerful position in the British govt.

The third most powerful position, that of Home Secretary, is also held by a Indian Hindu. Who would have credited that a few years ago.

Sajid the pro-israeli non practising Muslim married to an Englishwoman inherited the post from the last conservative govt. No way was Bojo going to let Sajid run the exchequer. He made that crystal clear to Sajid, so clear in fact that Sajid had no option but to resign before he was fired.

The Law minister and Business ministers are also Indians

UK will have a non-white PM at some point in the future, probably a lot earlier than some imagine

What on earth are you going on about? Sajid Javid started as chancellor in July and during his time prepared the nation to leave the EU without a deal, stood by Johnson to suspend parliament (something the prime minister came under huge fire for ), oversaw the bringing out of the Brexit coin to commemorate the leaving of the EU, and supported/lobbied for the appointment of the competent Andrew Bailey as head of the Bank of England.
He was named as chancellor after the thunderous 2019 November win and carried on till February.
Had Boris wanted him out he would have got rid of him after the election. You do also know they have been friends for years don't you?

You literally are now making things up....

Javid left the job after he and treasury fell out with special advisor Dominic Cummings, who had sacked a close aide of Javid. Cummings was also looking at replacing much of the treasury which he believed had pro-EU leanings, he even offered Javid a chance to do this and stay in the job, something widely reported in the press. He didn't, and stood by the treasury so resigned. He even joked about this in prime minister's questions i.e. the "cummings and goings", I'll put up the video;


The British people loved Javid and he was widely praised in the right wing press.
As for the public they couldn't care less about ethnicity when it comes to jobs other than prime minister as long as the person can do the job well, hence why you see Sunak and Patel there.

Also the reason for the representation for British Indians being high at this point in time are two, one being time cycles i.e. these politicians have had significant time in the party and now received roles, with old colleagues leaving.
The British Pakistani community had the same with Sayeeda Warsi who was at one time co-chairman of the party and whilst Javid was a rising star in the treasury.
The second is British Indians in the country have embraced the conservatives at a greater participation level than British Pakistanis.


UK will have a non white prime minister soon, ok carry on with that idea. Tag me when it happens, not in our lifetimes for sure.
 
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He converted, now how many Jews do you know? I grew up with the community (reform mostly), to do something like that was treasonous beyond belief. His yiddish character is open to debate but having converted and received the Anglican sacraments at 12, which he kept all his life faithfully it's hard to argue he was Jewish in the sense that all know. Very often it was his detractors and critics who delved into the area.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/150-y...-only-jewish-leader-changed-politics-forever/

Disraeli was the subject of vicious anti-Semitic attacks from his political opponents

You might want to read up on his life about how much importance he gave to his birth culture/nation;

he seemed to have little understanding of Jewish practices and made more than a few errors.

Disraeli’s writings were also seemingly contradictory. His novels occasionally featured Jewish characters that clearly drew on then common anti-Semitic depictions — his description of a Jewish money-lender, Levison, is particularly vulgar — while the Jewish wiseman Sidonia in “Coningsby” outlines a picture of Jews working through “subterranean agencies” to control world events that was later gleefully seized upon and repeated by virulent anti-Semites.

Although at times his writing were balanced referring to the birth right of jews;

At other times, however, Disraeli’s novels laud Jews and the superiority of “The Hebrew.” Christianity, one of them states, was founded by a Jew at a time when the English were mere “tattooed savages.”


But again people point out that this was a savage rebuke to his critics.

The article states this;

As Cesarani has suggested, Disraeli’s assertion of “Jewish rights based on Jewish superiority” may well have been meant as a signal to his Tory colleagues “that he would never surrender to their prejudices.”

He did champion the cause of British Jews to enter parliament, in part due to heritage and in part due to reform.
The best way to describe him was a half-way house for the two great Semitic traditions, and Disraeli himself alludes to this;

“the blank page between the Old and New Testaments.”


As for Jewish leaders being the leaders of the opposition do please look at the timelines, they were poor in comparison to the leaders they should have unseated and also seen as unelectable. Howard famously was shunned by Bush, something unthinkable for American/Anglo ties, even though the latter backed the invasion of Iraq. He lost the election in 2005. Miliband is even worse and was the butt of all jokes media and public wise.
Jewish folks holding strong positions in the past and now means nothing considering other minorities also have. It certainly isn't a prelude to becoming prime minister.










What on earth are you going on about? Sajid Javid started as chancellor in July and during his time prepared the nation to leave the EU without a deal, stood by Johnson to suspend parliament (something the prime minister came under huge fire for ), oversaw the bringing out of the Brexit coin to commemorate the leaving of the EU and supported/lobbied for the appointment of the competent Andrew Bailey as head of the Bank of England. He was named as chancellor after the thunderous 2019 November win and carried on till February.
Had Boris wanted him out he would have got rid of him after the election. You do also know they have been friends for years don't you?

You literally are now making things up....

Javid left the job after he and treasury fell out with special advisor Dominic Cummings, who had sacked a close aide of Javid. Cummings was also looking at replacing much of the treasury which he believed had pro-EU leanings, he even offered Javid a chance to do this and stay in the job, something widely reported in the press. He didn't and stood by the treasury, so resigned. He even joked about this in prime minister's questions i.e. the "cummings and goings", I'll put up the video;


The British people loved Javid and he was widely praised in the right wing press.
As for the public they couldn't care less about ethnicity when it comes to jobs other than prime minister as long as the person can do the job well, hence why you see Sunak and Patel there. Also the reason for the representation for British Indians being high at this point in time are two, one being time cycles i.e. these politicians have had significant time in the party and now received roles, with old colleagues leaving.
The British Pakistani community had the same with Sayeeda Warsi who was at one time co-chairman of the party and whilst Javid was a rising star in the treasury.
The second is British Indians in the country have embraced the conservatives at a greater participation level than British Pakistanis.


UK will have a non white prime minister soon, ok carry on with that idea. Tag me when it happens, not in our lifetimes for sure.

It doesn't seem there will be an Asian Prime Minister. I dnt know the future. Let me know when it happens.
 
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It doesn't seem there will be an Asian Prime Minister. I dnt know the future. Let me know when it happens.

There won't be. Anyone who has been here for generations will know the psyche of the British people, they simply won't accept it. It's good enough that we can achieve the highest positions in the land, but to run the country they're not ready for that and won't be for years.
 
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I wonder where all those Pakistanis who touted the Labour Party as the saviour of everything including Kashmir are. I told them from day one that these lot are not interested, but no the old narrative that the conservatives are evil and labour is angelic reigned.
Now take a long look. Expect similar statements on the Middle East soon I.e. Israel.
The Pakistani diaspora kind of captured Labour Party under the last leader. There are two aspects to this:
The Pakistani diaspora overwhelmingly votes for Labour making it an effective vote chunk compared to Indian diaspora that votes for both parties and is, therefore, more diffused
The Pakistani diaspora is geographically more concentrated than their Indian counterparts.

However, the recently the labour party's actions led to the Indian community jettisoning the party and moving to conservative. This is their attempt to keep the votes intact.

I have to say though at the end of the day, even if both conservative and labour said that Kashmir is an international issue or even that Kashmir should be Pakistani, I don't see that making an iota of difference to India on the ground. India is now economically strong and globally meshed enough that it doesn't matter what any other country says.

@waz , I am curious why Pakistanis still continue to seek international support on this. What's do they think will happen if Britain or any other country voices that Kashmir is an international issue?
 
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The Pakistani diaspora kind of captured Labour Party under the last leader. There are two aspects to this:
The Pakistani diaspora overwhelmingly votes for Labour making it an effective vote chunk compared to Indian diaspora that votes for both parties and is, therefore, more diffused
The Pakistani diaspora is geographically more concentrated than their Indian counterparts.

However, the recently the labour party's actions led to the Indian community jettisoning the party and moving to conservative. This is their attempt to keep the votes intact.

I have to say though at the end of the day, even if both conservative and labour said that Kashmir is an international issue or even that Kashmir should be Pakistani, I don't see that making an iota of difference to India on the ground. India is now economically strong and globally meshed enough that it doesn't matter what any other country says.

@waz , I am curious why Pakistanis still continue to seek international support on this. What's do they think will happen if Britain or any other country voices that Kashmir is an international issue?





india is not economically strong. It has the most impoverished and severely malnourished people on earth with one of the lowest living standards on the planet:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wo...591/India-accused-of-poverty-smokescreen.html

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/jul/14/poverty-india-africa-oxford

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wo...-third-of-worlds-poorest-says-World-Bank.html

https://blogs.worldbank.org/opendata/half-world-s-poor-live-just-5-countries




On top of the above, unlike the European, Western and Far Eastern nations, 1.4 billion indians have NEVER EVER invented ANY advanced Sciences or technologies EVER as indians generally have a low IQ:

https://new-iq-test.com/iq-by-country/



india is a very weak, backward and poverty stricken nation that cannot do much.
 
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india is not economically strong. It has the most impoverished and severely malnourished people on earth with one of the lowest living standards on the planet:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wo...591/India-accused-of-poverty-smokescreen.html

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/jul/14/poverty-india-africa-oxford

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wo...-third-of-worlds-poorest-says-World-Bank.html

https://blogs.worldbank.org/opendata/half-world-s-poor-live-just-5-countries




On top of the above, unlike the European, Western and Far Eastern nations, 1.4 billion indians have NEVER EVER invented ANY advanced Sciences or technologies EVER as indians generally have a low IQ:

https://new-iq-test.com/iq-by-country/



india is a very weak, backward and poverty stricken nation that cannot do much.
Thank you. You're right. Now, if possible, I request you to not reply to my posts in the future.
 
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@waz , I am curious why Pakistanis still continue to seek international support on this. What's do they think will happen if Britain or any other country voices that Kashmir is an international issue?

It will allow their army to claim "victory" and continue their hold on pakistan.

Consuming so much resources demands that they deliver some kind of victory from time to time.

Even if it means claiming shooting down Su 30 MKI's and denying Indian strike on their terrorist hideout.
 
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It will allow their army to claim "victory" and continue their hold on pakistan.

Consuming so much resources demands that they deliver some kind of victory from time to time.

Even if it means claiming shooting down Su 30 MKI's and denying Indian strike on their terrorist hideout.




Where is the proof and evidence of the strike? No indian FAKE NEWS please.
 
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It will allow their army to claim "victory" and continue their hold on pakistan.

Consuming so much resources demands that they deliver some kind of victory from time to time.

Even if it means claiming shooting down Su 30 MKI's and denying Indian strike on their terrorist hideout.
I don't believe that. I don't believe that its a question of claiming victory. From the efforts that Pakistanis put in to 'internationalize Kashmir', I believe the answer is deeper.

That said, I personally don't see any tangible benefit from a Pakistani perspective by 'internationalizing' Kashmir. I don't see India backing down or making any concession to Pakistan because of any other country.
 
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Where is the proof and evidence of the strike? No indian FAKE NEWS please.

All bad news is Fake news.

I don't believe that. I don't believe that its a question of claiming victory. From the efforts that Pakistanis put in to 'internationalize Kashmir', I believe the answer is deeper.

That said, I personally don't see any tangible benefit from a Pakistani perspective by 'internationalizing' Kashmir. I don't see India backing down or making any concession to Pakistan because of any other country.

Do you think the generals who run pakistan are not aware that there are NO tangible benefit from a statement from a has been power ?

All they want is some "moral victory" that will placate the mob and help them continue their hold.

As of today UK economy is SMALLER than that of India.

They just want news headline that will justify putting imran khan on the PM seat.
 
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awww finally some ray of hope for India....koi to hay jo bola tere lye bhi
 
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