JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 7]

[IHK_PK]

3m2 RCS for thunder is in fully loaded configuration or clean configuration?

Clean, if I am not wrong.

 

[jupiter2007]

What % of composite in block III?

 

[khanasifm]

So old mig-21 is 3 sq m f-15 and su series around 15-25 sqm per some of the websites but who know what’s reality

 

[Amigator]

So old mig-21 is 3 sq m f-15 and su series around 15-25 sqm per some of the websites but who know what’s reality

Jf-17 has an RCS of 5 sqm when loaded. And Su-30 mki has 10 sqm in clean mode and 15 when loaded. I have read it on wikipedia sometime ago.

 

[Advocate Pakistan]

Clean, if I am not wrong.

Heart breaking. The much larger Eurofighter has 0.5-1 msg.

 

[Amigator]

Heart breaking. The much larger Eurofighter has 0.5-1 msg.

I dont think its heart breaking at all. In earlier versions of JFT less composite materials were used so 3 sqm of RCS (in clean mode)is good. On the other hand, more than 100 million per unit EFT uses more composite materials. In 3rd blk more composites will be used so it will be more stealthy.

 

[My-Analogous]

3m2 RCS for thunder is in fully loaded configuration or clean configuration?

jf 17 has 3m2 RCS while its fully loaded as per link below but i think it is in between 4.5 to 5 m2 RCA because in clean JF17 has 2.5m2 RCA (http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/fighterplanes/texts/articles/bestfighter.html). Also note that JF17 only have 7HPoints

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/jf-17-thunder-multirole-fighter-thread-4.68207/page-484#post-3184823

 

[denel]

we know about the source of most of south african weapons but why problems, is the source pressurizing south africa or are we worried about arabs or is it a security concern

i do believe turkey is good option too, issue will be how much experience they have in developing such weapons (vs south africa already producing well known SAMs and previous AAM) and how much are they looking for JV rather than same off the shelf purchase

i would like Armed forces to move towards indigenization and exports rather than looking at purely off the shelf solutions

I dont know who is making claims on pressurising SA. There is none. Most of our efforts are always towards JVs.

 

[Gryphon]

in Defence
Dubai Airshow: Pakistan JF-17 returns to Dubai

Posted 13 November 2017

The JF-17 Thunder will be returning to the Dubai Air Show this year following its absence in 2015. Alan Warnes reports.


Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) Kamra, which builds 58% of the JF-17 Thunder and provides the final assembly for the domestic market, has now delivered more than 90 aircraft.

This year, the Pakistan Air Force (PAF) will take delivery of 14 JF-17s to complete the original order for 50 Block IIs.

However, the PAF announced in early 2017 that another 12 Block IIs would be built in 2018 to bridge the gap in production caused by delays to the more sophisticated Block III.

This more advanced version of the Thunder will include new avionics, better electronic warfare systems, increased payload and more sophisticated weapons, including Mk83 (1,000lb) and Mk84 bombs fitted with indigenous range extension kits (IREKs).

A targeting pod is also a priority, with Turkey’s Aselsan Aselpod system a likely option, as well as an indigenous data-link developed by PAC’s avionics production factory.

The only outstanding issue is the selection of an airborne electronically scanned array (AESA) radar to replace the Block I/II’s older KLJ-7 fire control radar.

“We don’t want to make any mistakes with this aircraft so we instigated a one-and-a-half year delay to the Block III programme,” explained Sohail Aman, the PAF chief of air staff back in May. He then added: “A lot of Block III improvements have already been used to upgrade Block I/2s.”

China has two AESA options on offer, one being CETC’s enhanced KLJ-7A, while Leonardo (formerly Selex ES) has also approached the PAF with a Grifo solution.

Meanwhile, Aman was keen to say that the JF-17 trumps the F-16 Block 52 in three different domains – although he wouldn’t elaborate on what they were. “Let me keep something to myself,” he smiled.

The first flight of a dual-seat JF-17B, took place at Chengdu on April 27, which revealed several modifications to the aircraft’s airframe not seen in the single-seater.

It has a dorsal spine to house more fuel, which compensates for the space taken by the additional seat. The vertical stabiliser has also been modified with the swept tail housing components for a new three-axis fly-by-wire flight control system.

The nose has been enlarged to accommodate the AESA radar.

Three aircraft are being built at Chengdu, with two set to be delivered to the PAF and one to remain in China.

Having a two-seater in the testing and development programme will speed up the integration of more weapons, according to CATIC. At the same time, it will allow potential customers to actually feel the aircraft, rather than rely on a simulator.

A fifth PAF unit – 14 ‘Tail Choppers’ Squadron – stood up on February 16 at PAF Base Minhas, with most of the aircraft fitted with air-to-air refuelling systems. It joins 2 ‘Minhasians’ Squadron at PAF Base Masroor, 16 ‘Black Panthers’ Squadron at PAF Base Minhas, 26 ‘Black Spiders’ Squadron at PAF Base Peshawar and the JF-17 Combat Commanders School (CCS) at PAF Base Mushaf. A sixth unit will stand up in early-2018.

Also being built at PAC Kamra’s aircraft manufacturing factory is the MFI-17 Super Mushshak, which has had an incredible year of export success.

With a glass cockpit, supplied by Garmin or Dynon, a new lease of life has been breathed into the old design and attracted customers looking for a cheaper state-of-the-art basic trainer. In 2016, the Nigerian Air Force ordered eight, which have been delivered, followed by a requirement for another four. The Qatar Air Force also placed an order for eight, which led to four being delivered in late-June.

In May, 2017 the Turkish MoD signed a deal for 52 Super Mushshaks, followed in September by Azerbaijan’s requirement for 10 aircraft.

There are also plans to weaponise the aircraft and, during May, a company demonstrator was fitted with Chinese FT-5 air-to-ground missiles for aerodynamic trials. Other options include the installation of an electro-optical infrared (EO/IR) system, which could help to ‘lase’ any weapons on to a target.

AMF will integrate its own domestic-made forward-looking infrared (FLIR) on the Super Mushshak, probably for the domestic market.

It’s all quite a success story for an aircraft that was first built by Saab in the early 70s before PAC took over the license to build in the 1980s.

Dubai Airshow: Pakistan JF-17 returns to Dubai | Arabian Aerospace

 

[CriticalThought]

in Defence
Dubai Airshow: Pakistan JF-17 returns to Dubai

Posted 13 November 2017

The JF-17 Thunder will be returning to the Dubai Air Show this year following its absence in 2015. Alan Warnes reports.


Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) Kamra, which builds 58% of the JF-17 Thunder and provides the final assembly for the domestic market, has now delivered more than 90 aircraft.

This year, the Pakistan Air Force (PAF) will take delivery of 14 JF-17s to complete the original order for 50 Block IIs.

However, the PAF announced in early 2017 that another 12 Block IIs would be built in 2018 to bridge the gap in production caused by delays to the more sophisticated Block III.

This more advanced version of the Thunder will include new avionics, better electronic warfare systems, increased payload and more sophisticated weapons, including Mk83 (1,000lb) and Mk84 bombs fitted with indigenous range extension kits (IREKs).

A targeting pod is also a priority, with Turkey’s Aselsan Aselpod system a likely option, as well as an indigenous data-link developed by PAC’s avionics production factory.

The only outstanding issue is the selection of an airborne electronically scanned array (AESA) radar to replace the Block I/II’s older KLJ-7 fire control radar.

“We don’t want to make any mistakes with this aircraft so we instigated a one-and-a-half year delay to the Block III programme,” explained Sohail Aman, the PAF chief of air staff back in May. He then added: “A lot of Block III improvements have already been used to upgrade Block I/2s.”

China has two AESA options on offer, one being CETC’s enhanced KLJ-7A, while Leonardo (formerly Selex ES) has also approached the PAF with a Grifo solution.

Meanwhile, Aman was keen to say that the JF-17 trumps the F-16 Block 52 in three different domains – although he wouldn’t elaborate on what they were. “Let me keep something to myself,” he smiled.

The first flight of a dual-seat JF-17B, took place at Chengdu on April 27, which revealed several modifications to the aircraft’s airframe not seen in the single-seater.

It has a dorsal spine to house more fuel, which compensates for the space taken by the additional seat. The vertical stabiliser has also been modified with the swept tail housing components for a new three-axis fly-by-wire flight control system.

The nose has been enlarged to accommodate the AESA radar.

Three aircraft are being built at Chengdu, with two set to be delivered to the PAF and one to remain in China.

Having a two-seater in the testing and development programme will speed up the integration of more weapons, according to CATIC. At the same time, it will allow potential customers to actually feel the aircraft, rather than rely on a simulator.

A fifth PAF unit – 14 ‘Tail Choppers’ Squadron – stood up on February 16 at PAF Base Minhas, with most of the aircraft fitted with air-to-air refuelling systems. It joins 2 ‘Minhasians’ Squadron at PAF Base Masroor, 16 ‘Black Panthers’ Squadron at PAF Base Minhas, 26 ‘Black Spiders’ Squadron at PAF Base Peshawar and the JF-17 Combat Commanders School (CCS) at PAF Base Mushaf. A sixth unit will stand up in early-2018.

Also being built at PAC Kamra’s aircraft manufacturing factory is the MFI-17 Super Mushshak, which has had an incredible year of export success.

With a glass cockpit, supplied by Garmin or Dynon, a new lease of life has been breathed into the old design and attracted customers looking for a cheaper state-of-the-art basic trainer. In 2016, the Nigerian Air Force ordered eight, which have been delivered, followed by a requirement for another four. The Qatar Air Force also placed an order for eight, which led to four being delivered in late-June.

In May, 2017 the Turkish MoD signed a deal for 52 Super Mushshaks, followed in September by Azerbaijan’s requirement for 10 aircraft.

There are also plans to weaponise the aircraft and, during May, a company demonstrator was fitted with Chinese FT-5 air-to-ground missiles for aerodynamic trials. Other options include the installation of an electro-optical infrared (EO/IR) system, which could help to ‘lase’ any weapons on to a target.

AMF will integrate its own domestic-made forward-looking infrared (FLIR) on the Super Mushshak, probably for the domestic market.

It’s all quite a success story for an aircraft that was first built by Saab in the early 70s before PAC took over the license to build in the 1980s.

Dubai Airshow: Pakistan JF-17 returns to Dubai | Arabian Aerospace

Key point to note. Thunder is better than F-16 Block 52 in 3 areas. Masha Allah. Alhamdulillah. @Knuckles

 

[Rafael]

Meanwhile, Aman was keen to say that the JF-17 trumps the F-16 Block 52 in three different domains – although he wouldn’t elaborate on what they were. “Let me keep something to myself,” he smiled.

Interesting..

 

[Windjammer]

 

[araz]

we know about the source of most of south african weapons but why problems, is the source pressurizing south africa or are we worried about arabs or is it a security concern

i do believe turkey is good option too, issue will be how much experience they have in developing such weapons (vs south africa already producing well known SAMs and previous AAM) and how much are they looking for JV rather than same off the shelf purchase

i would like Armed forces to move towards indigenization and exports rather than looking at purely off the shelf solutions

ASAK Zia.
The source will not allow technology to trickle down to Pak, and Pak forces remain concerned about what else is hidden under the bonnet if you know what I mean. Secondly there have been concerns about Indian involvement in the SA arms industry and they will not sell to Pak. However things can and are changing. The financial side remains a concern though.
A

3m2 RCS for thunder is in fully loaded configuration or clean configuration?

Probably loaded.
A

 

[Ultimate Weapon]

AMF will integrate its own domestic-made forward-looking infrared (FLIR) on the Super Mushshak, probably for the domestic market.

Good Going. Our own IRST. It is an achievement and another step to self reliance.

 

[denel]

ASAK Zia.
The source will not allow technology to trickle down to Pak, and Pak forces remain concerned about what else is hidden under the bonnet if you know what I mean. Secondly there have been concerns about Indian involvement in the SA arms industry and they will not sell to Pak. However things can and are changing. The financial side remains a concern though.
A


Probably loaded.
A

Friend, the concern of indian involvement was the snakes Indian transplants known as Guptas; they were trying to muzzle in via a front for Asia; that has been nullified and soon we hope to see them behind bars where they belong. Those are wretched bastards who together with zumas have stolen tax payers monies like a black hole. Honest to God; as per true indian style, they are s..t scared to set foot on South African soil and sitting in Dubai while their home is barricaded daily by protesters.
That is the only involvement by the b.. indians.
I apologise for my vulgar words but there are none else to describe them with.