JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 7]

[DJ_Viper]

I don't know why people bring in F-7pg in comparison to 4 or 4.5 gen aircraft. It's not meant to compete such catogory. It's role is to intercept large numbers of Mig-21,23,27 and jaguar type aircraft invading our air space. In war first pawns are sent to spread out and test the battle field, find out their strength and weaknesses , F-7 and F-7pg are our pawns, even Mirage too, then next comes the horses like Jf-17 and F-16s, then later elephants like su-30. But unfortunately we don't have elephants now.

Sir, anything below 5th gen (up to 4.5 gen) is all avionics based capability irrespective of the hardware platform. When you get to the 5th gen, the hardware platform, along with the avionics (software) change all together. So if you really wanted to, the F-7 could be made a 4th gen platform.

Second, it is a very potent fighter. There is a reason why the IAF upgraded it in BISON configuration. They certainly don't have money issues like Pakistan used to. So it speaks volume for the aircraft. I didn't mean to derail the thread, but wanted to correct you. Back to the JFT now.

Does anyone has the slightest clue on how the JFT block III would look like? Whether conformal fuel tanks will be used, shape changed a bit to incorporate stealthier design?

 

[XDescendantX]

Cool pic of the JF-17!!! ......................... (This is what everyone probably looks like right about now.)

 

[CriticalThought]

Does anyone has the slightest clue on how the JFT block III would look like? Whether conformal fuel tanks will be used, shape changed a bit to incorporate stealthier design?

There are reports that:

1. JF-17B has fuel cells added to it.
2. Block 3 will have the same adaptations as B.

So we can be sure that Block 3 will have fuel cells added to it.

We really did miss out on the J10B induction in 2014 , 36 Brand new Jets would have been fantastic addition. Had we taken that route we would have been now ordering a refill order or extention of agreement

View attachment 389569

PAF is still searching for their Stealth plane or Fighter Jet it can pair with JF17 Long term goals

Sorry, but acquiring a new jet isn't the same as buying eggs from the whole seller. Those 36 would have brought their own maintenance problems and would need investment for:

1. Training the whole pipeline of support personnel.
2. Training pilots.
3. Spares and other maintenance related technologies.

Also, the per hour flying costs are unknown, and other than the fact that it looks a lot like F-16, none of us have actually flown it and judged its abilities. I trust the decision of people who have actually flown Block-52s, and will be flying the planes in battle and put their lives on the line for the rest of us.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

I drive a car , and I can drive any other car I get into.

I would imagine a capable pilot can figure out how the plane works after they get the basic introduction to the buttons and controls of new fighter jet

We never had any issue with supplies from China every thing is on time and ahead of schedule

I don't buy the argument of difficulty to maintain a craft from China as we have history of operating various items from France / China / US / Russia in our fleet


36-50 J10B brand new 0km birds , loaded with weapons or "Promise of 8 F16 after 5 years of waiting" yea..... I know what I want

I think ppl who favor f16 are just insecure of changes can't see the world beyond f16

 

[CriticalThought]

I drive a car , and I can drive any other car I get into.

I would imagine a capable pilot can figure out how the plane works after they get the basic introduction to the buttons and controls of new fighter jet

It seems like it would take the pilots years to simply figure out AESA technology:

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/whic...-the-jf-17-block-3.487980/page-2#post-9361697

Flying a fighter plane into battle is more difficult than driving on Karachi's pot-filled roads with W-11 drivers unleashing their terror without any check and balance.

 

[MastanKhan]

I drive a car , and I can drive any other car I get into.

I would imagine a capable pilot can figure out how the plane works after they get the basic introduction to the buttons and controls of new fighter jet

We never had any issue with supplies from China every thing is on time and ahead of schedule

I don't buy the argument of difficulty to maintain a craft from China as we have history of operating various items from France / China / US / Russia in our fleet


36-50 J10B brand new 0km birds , loaded with weapons or "Promise of 8 F16 after 5 years of waiting" yea..... I know what I want

I think ppl who favor f16 are just insecure of changes can't see the world beyond f16

Hi,

The inside dashboard electronics should be very similar to the JF17---. The weapons are the same---the EW package could be the same---.

I would say that the learning curve would be much shorter on the J10 as compared to the JF17---.

Within a years time---the pilots would be up and running the aircraft to its maximum utility.

The F16 usage is just an excuse---. The J10 does not get any Green Cards and cushy jobs in the U S---as the F16 does.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

I think here is what happened

1- We had a deal for J10B
2- Our head of Airforce were invited over to USA they wined and dined
3- Some verbal promises were made about F16 and how easy it would be to get these
4- Our airforce cheif were promised cooperation on supplies if we did not went the J10B route
5- Air chief comes and starts believing the myth decides not to chase a new fighter jet , F16 is coming yar why bother ? Just wait 1-2 year we will order F16

6- 7 years pased and we get 0 planes , and air cheif changed already forgotten story and we are wondering where the hell are those plane we wanted

Yahi howa na , ab Sharmane ki kiya bat hai , sub ko pata hai , Jub Navy ka frigate order kerna hota hai , USA se invite ati hai Navy head ko , come visit us.


Turkish frigate deal , how long is it stuck in pipeline for ?
Turkish helicopter deal , how long is it stuck in pipeline for ?

9 Month main to bacha bhi hojata hai , this story has gone for over 4-5 years now

J10B order kerna hota hai to F16 ki birth day banane ke liye bula letain hain USA main, head of airforce come visit us in USA , we will cut a cake in USA

We have 3 Z-10 PERFECT choppers waiting for follow up order of 100 birds and the authorities are farting away ... chasing zulu or zoolander

 

[war&peace]

Hi,

The inside dashboard electronics should be very similar to the JF17---. The weapons are the same---the EW package could be the same---.

I would say that the learning curve would be much shorter on the J10 as compared to the JF17---.

Within a years time---the pilots would be up and running the aircraft to its maximum utility.

Agreed

The J10 does not get any Green Cards and cushy jobs in the U S---as the F16 does.

Golden words by MK

 

[CriticalThought]

Hi,

The inside dashboard electronics should be very similar to the JF17---. The weapons are the same---the EW package could be the same---.

I would say that the learning curve would be much shorter on the J10 as compared to the JF17---.

Within a years time---the pilots would be up and running the aircraft to its maximum utility.

The F16 usage is just an excuse---. The J10 does not get any Green Cards and cushy jobs in the U S---as the F16 does.

Convenient how PAF fighter pilots always dance to the tune of your whims. AESA is too difficult to master, J-10 is piece of cake. Looking forward to more crackpot analysis in the future as well.

Agreed

Golden words by MK

Really? He has actually flown a J-10B? If yes, I'll delete my account and get off defence.pk.

I think here is what happened

1- We had a deal for J10B
2- Our head of Airforce were invited over to USA they wined and dined
3- Some verbal promises were made about F16 and how easy it would be to get these
4- Our airforce cheif were promised cooperation on supplies if we did not went the J10B route
5- Air chief comes and starts believing the myth decides not to chase a new fighter jet , F16 is coming yar why bother ? Just wait 1-2 year we will order F16

6- 7 years pased and we get 0 planes , and air cheif changed already forgotten story and we are wondering where the hell are those plane we wanted

Yahi howa na , ab Sharmane ki kiya bat hai , sub ko pata hai , Jub Navy ka frigate order kerna hota hai , USA se invite ati hai Navy head ko , come visit us.


Turkish frigate deal , how long is it stuck in pipeline for ?
Turkish helicopter deal , how long is it stuck in pipeline for ?

9 Month main to bacha bhi hojata hai , this story has gone for over 4-5 years now

J10B order kerna hota hai to F16 ki birth day banane ke liye bula letain hain USA main

Do you have any idea how long it took to finalize 36 Rafales for IAF? Major weapons purchases take a long time and this is so everywhere in the world.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

I just thought it was funny , when we were about to induct JF17 , there was a counter ceremony held for induction of F16 (and back then the air cheif , as gullable as they were ) thought that we would get 18-24 F16 orders with no issues. And there was all this comotion and parties and celebrations , the cheif was going to flying to visit delegates in USA this and that ....

Rememeber this celebration lol
They painted it to look like the F16 E/F model that UAE flies and we were all excited

Then when we started hearing about induction of Turkish frigate, we see our Navy cheif is getting private invites to visit the US Navy ? ehm ... like man order the frigates frist and then go do your private visits overseas

What did they promise you in your private visit ? a destroyer which will be given to Pakistan just if we wait 2-3 years and not order the ships from Turkey or China


Between 2005-2017 : We got just mere 18 F16 C/D the amazing plane
Between 2008-2017 : We made 86-90 JF17 Thunders
Between 2005-2014 : We missed out on 36 J10B deal

 

[war&peace]

Really? He has actually flown a J-10B? If yes, I'll delete my account and get off defence.pk.

He never claimed that he has flown any airplane let alone J-10B
But what does it has to do with flying an airplane?, it just needs a thing called "common sense"....ever heard about it?...I mean maybe sometime your friends or neighbours discussed about it?

 

[salman-1]

J-10 is fully matured and ready in plate, When ever something is cooked in front of PAF it looses it's appetite in favour of another. That's really what's happening, whether is J-10, J-11-15 PAF can never decide in time, having a cutting edge tech at the price of basic requirement is not wisdom. Navy has assessed the threat from India and put her requirement in writing for a heavy weight to counter the threat, but we have put Jf-17 in place to counter the Mig-29 naval version which is the mother of thunder.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Oh those past year Obama also tried to suckker us into waiting for OHP nice ship but with no weapons making it crap frigate (with no weapons) if we only did not ordered the F22P frigate guess that time we were lucky we did actually ordered the F22P friagte other wise we would be depending on the rubber dukie boats US gave us afterwords (what was it those tiny black coast patrol ships)

This pattern of deliberately holding back on delivery of items to Pakistan and offering us old outdated goods , if we only did not bought something new appraoch has been going for 10-15 years and people who realize the subtle nature of this can see it clearly

The last time the bull shit we faced with the 8 F16 was perhaps the tipping point and if Sukhoi was available I was even gona suggest just move to new platform be done with it

 

[MastanKhan]

I think here is what happened

1- We had a deal for J10B
2- Our head of Airforce were invited over to USA they wined and dined
3- Some verbal promises were made about F16 and how easy it would be to get these
4- Our airforce cheif were promised cooperation on supplies if we did not went the J10B route
5- Air chief comes and starts believing the myth decides not to chase a new fighter jet , F16 is coming yar why bother ? Just wait 1-2 year we will order F16

6- 7 years pased and we get 0 planes , and air cheif changed already forgotten story and we are wondering where the hell are those plane we wanted

Yahi howa na , ab Sharmane ki kiya bat hai , sub ko pata hai , Jub Navy ka frigate order kerna hota hai , USA se invite ati hai Navy head ko , come visit us.


Turkish frigate deal , how long is it stuck in pipeline for ?
Turkish helicopter deal , how long is it stuck in pipeline for ?

9 Month main to bacha bhi hojata hai , this story has gone for over 4-5 years now

J10B order kerna hota hai to F16 ki birth day banane ke liye bula letain hain USA main, head of airforce come visit us in USA , we will cut a cake in USA

We have 3 Z-10 PERFECT choppers waiting for follow up order of 100 birds and the authorities are farting away ... chasing zulu or zoolander

Hi,

I assume most of the times that everyone would know or understand the fundamentals of the issue---so I don't bring it up most of the time---.

But what I wrote was the core of the issue---and you have defined it very well.

There is a good old americans saying---" the americans will give you enough rope to hang yourself in due time "---and that is what they did to all the Air Chief Marshalls and General Kiyani---.

They wined and dined them---they lavished praises on them---they gave them medals and honors---and made them believe in what they were not---and then they dumped them and went to the next one---.

J-10 is fully matured and ready in plate, When ever something is cooked in front of PAF it looses it's appetite in favour of another. That's really what's happening, whether is J-10, J-11-15 PAF can never decide in time, having a cutting edge tech at the price of basic requirement is not wisdom. Navy has assessed the threat from India and put her requirement in writing for a heavy weight to counter the threat, but we have put Jf-17 in place to counter the Mig-29 naval version which is the mother of thunder.

Hi,

OHHHHHHH---you are forgetting man---We got the man behind the Machine---.

Now that we have told you---don't you ever forget that-----

 

[CriticalThought]

Per ACM's recent interview, the strategy moving forward is to keep negotiations for F-16s, move full throttle on JF-17, and acquire a fifth generation plane as a stop gap measure until we have indigenous development of 5+ gen aircraft. This is the right strategy. Thankfully, those who want to divert limited resources towards another 4.x generation aircraft are only internet warriors and have no influence on PAF's decision making process.